Actual Use for Dair go figure

[Judo777]

Ok sheiks i figured i'd give a hand in trying to liven up this place a little bit. So i know this kind of thing has been discussed before but i'll give you my opinion on the idea.

Ok what i am getting out is chain jacketing if you guys don't know what that is you can look it up on a different thread but its essentially using the chain at the height between the respective heights for a sh-chain and grounded chain to make the chain adapt the properties of the last hit box you used.

Problems with the chain jacket are as follows. Firstly when you jacket a move the chain becomes that move an it gets all that moves properties like damage and knock back. It also loses its properties of tanscendant priority which is kind of important for that move. I'll tell you why that is so important in a sec.

Firstly i would wonder what move you should chain jacket i thought for the most useful results i would always try fsmash. It gives the chain a hitbox really far out and its sheiks strongest move bar tipper upsmash and vanish (which the damage hitbox cant be jacketed). The problem with fsmash is that its a grounded move so if someone had any knowledge about the chain jacket they can aimply attack the tip of the chain and clank with the fsmash hitbox and end the chain.

So then I moved on to aerials because aerials cant be clanked with. The issue now arises that sheiks aerials arent that useful to jacket. Nair for some reason wont ever give me the strong hit box and uair's hitbox is in a bad position to be useful. bair would be great if it didnt force people behind u which is where u want to keep people away from seeing as thats ur vulnerable side also bairs chain is way to inactive to be used for anything but the bair which can also be hard to land if they are in certain spots on the chain.

Fair is a different story (and i honestly think it might be worth learning.) If u get the normal hitbox its ok it sends people back out does like 7% and the chain acts fairly normal only a little less active. Every now and then i have jacketed a special fair with 3 hitboxes one of which was backwards and the third hitbox send them back into to get hit into the other 2 fair hit boxes so they would essentially combo. It's definitely worth looking at but i have only had it happen 3 times and i can't figure out why.

But anyway now to my main point. Holy crap jacketing dair is actually pretty good and ill tell you why. Dair's hitbox is huge and it a great spot. When u jacket dair the chain acts just like a sh-chain with more hitboxes of the chain having the electric property but everytime u move the chain it put a dair hitbox out that encompaseses ur entire body. It does 10% and its knockback is fairly weak so it doesnt send people out of the chain until much higher percents. also the direction it sends them is ideal for guarding the ledge. The reason its good is because you get to take something that is alwready great (sh-chain) and add an unclankable hitbox that deals 10% and covers ur whole body. If a certain character had trouble with u keeping them out using the chain (ledge guarding or not) before, now they will have even more trouble. If it could be done consistently i can see it being useful.

Thoughts? opinions?

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Just tried, and have now found a use for the jacket! This is good ****!

 

[Variable]

Pretty cool stuff. You should get some pictures and videos up of differing Chain Jacketing examples, so we can compare the uses differently, and help people understand better.

 

[FrozenFire13]

I always knew there was something useful for that crappy move. Ima test this when I get the chance.

But here are my questions: Are you sure that it ADDS a hitbox? Cuz everything else just replaces the chain's hitbox. Also, if you ARE correct, then do the original chain hitboxes still block certain projectiles?

Again, looking forward to trying this.

 

[Judo777]

um idk if i can get vids up im bad at that sort of thing. Um that chain's hitboxes aren't always completely replaced there are generally a few normal less active hitboxes of the chain. Im not sure why this is maybe u are replacing a certain number of the chains hitboxes idk. dair just seemed to keep a good majority of the chains activeness and it acts like sh-chain which is good.

Concerning the projectiles yea actually u will also be able to swat more projectiles with it. This however isnt great news and thank you for bringing this to my attention frozen. The chain hitboxes will still be transcendant so it will only be able to swat projectiles with hurtboxes like pikmin, grenades etc. However moves without hurtboxes with still be able to get through like samus missles and fireball and what not. HOWEVER because there is now a dair hitbox present in the chain since aerials can clank with b moves we will clank with fireballs and missles and any b move that isnt trancendant.

The bad news is that if our chain clanks with anything it ends the chain. The good news is the fireballs and missles stop the chain anyway because our chain cant stop those anyway so now instead of taking the hit we can just clank it and not take the damage and we should have even frames so i guess really its a good thing cause now we have extra defense against moves that would otherwise break our chain anyway.

Good question frozen.

 

[choknater]

wow sweet, imma try this

 

[-Mars-]

Good stuff Judo. Jacketing has never been something i've bothered with as I get freezing a lot, but this is worth practicing i suppose.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

im going to try this too

 

[Turazrok]

I found an even better use of dair.

BEHOLD

 

[-Mars-]

why do you have tryant as your avatar? lmao.

 

[choknater]

cuz he looks funny like a dinosaur in that pic

 

[Variable]

I found an even better use of dair.

BEHOLD

That was simpy amazing.

How he did that I do not know.

 

[Judo777]

Good stuff Judo. Jacketing has never been something i've bothered with as I get freezing a lot, but this is worth practicing i suppose.

If u dont know you wont freeze provided u have done at least 3 moves and at least 1 chain before the jacket.

 

[Rawnie]

Hmm. I might look into this. Also, anyone know if chain jacket hitboxes can be seen in hitbubble .pacs?

 

[Thunder Of Zeus]

That was simpy amazing.

How he did that I do not know.

Looks like they took off the auto-sweetspot, and Sheik snuck her grapple in just before Falco got within range of the grab.

 

[Wavebuster]

I feel like as the discoverer of this trick, I should clarify things.

Aerial hitboxes jacketed by the chain are in fact, clankable. If your aerial can cancel out a projectile thrown at you (all of Sheik's do), it will clank things when used on the ground somehow, as with chain jacketing. Chain jacketing in general is only overly useful against targets forced into the air because of this, like when they are recovering.

If you don't want the game to freeze, use the chain once normally in the match without chain jacket timing. You can use use the chain freely for the remainder of the match. The "3 attack rule" was a misconception due to my testing processes.

Dsmash in general is the best move to jacket. It gives very long reaching hitboxes on both sides of Sheik.

Depending on how many different *strength* hitboxes the move(s) you used has, the electric tip that the normal chain possesses may or may not still be present when jacketing the move. It's always the last hitbox to be replaced.

It is possible to jacket multiple moves at once.

To jacket the strong, initial hits of an aerial, you have to interrupt the aerial before the weaker hitboxes have a chance to come out. The timing for doing this is fairly precise. Doing the Bair and immediately landing results being able to do this for example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMdj-i5w6U4

 

[Judo777]

I feel like as the discoverer of this trick, I should clarify things.

Aerial hitboxes jacketed by the chain are in fact, clankable. If your aerial can cancel out a projectile thrown at you (all of Sheik's do), it will clank things when used on the ground somehow, as with chain jacketing. Chain jacketing in general is only overly useful against targets forced into the air because of this, like when they are recovering.

If you don't want the game to freeze, use the chain once normally in the match without chain jacket timing. You can use use the chain freely for the remainder of the match. The "3 attack rule" was a misconception due to my testing processes.

Dsmash in general is the best move to jacket. It gives very long reaching hitboxes on both sides of Sheik.

Depending on how many different *strength* hitboxes the move(s) you used has, the electric tip that the normal chain possesses may or may not still be present when jacketing the move. It's always the last hitbox to be replaced.

It is possible to jacket multiple moves at once.

To jacket the strong, initial hits of an aerial, you have to interrupt the aerial before the weaker hitboxes have a chance to come out. The timing for doing this is fairly precise. Doing the Bair and immediately landing results being able to do this for example: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMdj-i5w6U4

while i am unsure of the 3 hit rule (as that is what i have been told) i am positive of everything else said in this thread. Aerials CANNOT clank with other moves ASIDE from specials. Ankoku has posted the rules for clanking several times and its recent in the social thread right now i bleieve if not the Q and A 1 of the two. Aerials cannot clank with normal moves EXCEPT for specials (without trancendant priority of course). Most special moves such as missiles that can be clanked with aerials beat out the chain anyway so it would clank with the chain jacket and not damage us.

Dsmash jacket would be great if it werent a grounded move. Because its a grounded a character such as marth can simply attack the tip of the chain and end it i have tested this many times. For an even easier time have MK tornado over top of a dsmash chain and watch as it gets clanked and beaten. while clanking a dsmash chain isnt bad cause it just resets us (which could be a decent low risk decent reward situation) but sense the chain only works effectively on a handful of character anyway it seems like it might be too hard to pull off just to have it clanked with.

Strong hit bair is probably our best bet for trying something new along with dair IMO.
bair is good cause it covers our back (which is our weakest point) so well. However the chain seems very different with bair where as the dair jacket seems to have most all of the properties of the regular chain plus the dair hitbox. There may be ways of getting that with every aerial but idk yet.

 

[Zankoku]

Chain jacketed aerial hitboxes are not aerial hitboxes.

Since I've not consistently done chain jacketing enough, I haven't tested much with their rules of priority, but I'm definitely certain that even a strong bair hitbox is capable of clashing ground attacks.

Ryoko/An Easy Frag is correct about the freeze glitch - it only occurs if you attempt to jacket as your first use of the chain in any given game. This means that it can happen as your first move or your fifty-seventh move.

 

[Judo777]

Chain jacketed aerial hitboxes are not aerial hitboxes.

Since I've not consistently done chain jacketing enough, I haven't tested much with their rules of priority, but I'm definitely certain that even a strong bair hitbox is capable of clashing ground attacks.

Ryoko/An Easy Frag is correct about the freeze glitch - it only occurs if you attempt to jacket as your first use of the chain in any given game. This means that it can happen as your first move or your fifty-seventh move.

Oh ur right crap anything can clank with it cause they arent aerials for some reason. I guess that means the best ones are the ones with the most range like dsmash and bair. However those 2 seem kinda useless compared to regular sh chain.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

Wow, great to see Ryoko posting on the Sheik board again.

 

[KenniSpam!]

too bad jacket is useless against anyone good

/thread

 

[<π]

MK is bad though.

 

[-Cross-]

I don't see why bair is bad for chain jacket though. I just did it, and the best part is the huge disjointed hitbox from behind. I mostly see chain jacket as another way to land kills that being said reverse chain jacket with strong bair (facing toward the stage) near the edge with proper spacing for edge guarding may be a very good strategy to land kills. It has a huge disjointed hitbox from behind when you twirl the chain, and since its near the blastzone it will be easier to land the kill. You can even hit them when they hang from the ledge if their invincibility runs out, which is how ridiculous the back hitbox is.

How long do the chain jacketed hitboxes stay inactive though? I get the feeling that some jacketed moves have longer inactive hitboxes after the first hit. Also do people know which chain jackets are good for comboing onto itself?

 

[Judo777]

I don't see why bair is bad for chain jacket though. I just did it, and the best part is the huge disjointed hitbox from behind. I mostly see chain jacket as another way to land kills that being said reverse chain jacket with strong bair (facing toward the stage) near the edge with proper spacing for edge guarding may be a very good strategy to land kills. It has a huge disjointed hitbox from behind when you twirl the chain, and since its near the blastzone it will be easier to land the kill. You can even hit them when they hang from the ledge if their invincibility runs out, which is how ridiculous the back hitbox is.

How long do the chain jacketed hitboxes stay inactive though? I get the feeling that some jacketed moves have longer inactive hitboxes after the first hit. Also do people know which chain jackets are good for comboing onto itself?

I think ur right some hitboxes are much more inactive then others. I said i liked dair because of how active the regular chain boxes are however i think after everything id have to say the best are dsmash, bair and dair in no specific order cause i do still think dair is good but had it been unclankable i would have said it was the best hands down but since it is idk its close.

I have no idea how to test the activity of a chain jacket tho