Changes that you would like to see from Bowser.

[MagnesD3]

What Id like to see.

- Flamethrower no longer runs out

- Increase the range on koopa claw significantly on ground and in air

- Armor on B up

- Koopa Claw causes better knockback

- Bowser to be faster overall

- More knockback on tilts.

- Some armor on smashes and bair.

Suggested Changes I agree with:

- Disjointed hitbox on all claw moves that happens after bowsers animation is done, orange claw mark hitboxes appear after animation.

- Kill the land lag time from bowser dair or give him a new one.

 

[S_B]

Some or all of the following:

-Super armor on Up+B and down+B, and any other move that involves Bowser tucking into his shell.

-Disjointed hitboxes for all of his claw attacks: Remember how the original koopa klaw left slash marks through the air? I'd like for all of his claw moves to have this, extending beyond the actual length of his claws and having a hitbox that is not a hurtbox. Without a projectile, the next best thing we can hope for is disjointed attacks so Bowser at least has SOME range without putting himself in danger.

-A projectile: this may very well be the difference between Bowser being decent tier and bottom tier. I would trade the fire breath for a fireball in a hearbeat, just something to prevent Bowser from being forced to approach any opponent who has a projectile because that's currently his biggest weakness (falling victim to campers who spam projectiles).

-His killing moves to come out faster: thankfully, it looks like we may already be getting this. His kill moves in Brawl were basically telegraphed, with the exception of his f-air and u-tilt, making them stupidly easy to dodge.

Honestly, I don't mind if he does less knockback and less damage in general because they've typically balanced Bowser in the past around the idea of "he's slow but powerful, so he's balanced!", overlooking the fact that this generally allows fast characters to absolutely destroy him.

If Bowser had to be made lighter to balance his moveset so he could be competitive, so be it.

 

[BKupa666]

Boost Bowser's weight by up to half of what it currently is. People seriously underestimate how crippling a weakness size can be, so giving Bowser the ability to actually tank some combos shouldn't prove too problematic.

 

[S_B]

Boost Bowser's weight by up to half of what it currently is. People seriously underestimate how crippling a weakness size can be, so giving Bowser the ability to actually tank some combos shouldn't prove too problematic.

The problem I see with that is that it'll make him too strong in casual play while still leaving him weak in competitive play.

It doesn't matter if Bowser can tank up to 300% before going over if he can't land a hit on fast characters because they balanced him that way.

 

[Phan7om]

1. Neutral-B does more damage
2. Better D-air
3. Super Armor on SOME moves (especially the ones where he's inside his shell)

 

[LaniusShrike]

-Fireball when you tap Neutral B, flamebreath when you hold it.
-Super Armor on charging smashes.
-Make his Up B move deflect (not reflect) projectiles.
-New Final Smash in lieu of something he actually has in his games, potentially clown car.
-Make the bodyslam part of his Side B a more consistent method of control.
-Alternately, replace the Koopa Claw. It's just not my favorite move.

Koopa Claw replacement: CHOMP TOSS
While the button's held, Bowser swings a chain chomp around by its chain above his head, hurting aerial attackers. When the button's released, he throws the chain chomp forward which bounces along the ground trying to bite enemies for a few seconds before leaping down off the stage.
-He'd be able to walk slowly while swinging it.
-The roaming chain chomp would turn around when hitting a wall.
-The chomp can be knocked away by attacks.
-The chomp, when connecting with an enemy, bites down on them and chews for a second, temporarily slowing the enemy and hurting them.
-Only one chomp can be on the screen at a time, so the move isn't spammable.

I would love playing as Bowser if his shtick changed more towards controlling the stage and forcing enemies into his powerful blows.

 

[nat pagle]

Boost Bowser's weight by up to half of what it currently is. People seriously underestimate how crippling a weakness size can be, so giving Bowser the ability to actually tank some combos shouldn't prove too problematic.

That's just asking for him to get subjected to chain throws.

 

[Komenja]

Some projectile immunity on his back, similar to how Link/Toon Link have it on their shield, would be cool.

 

[Deleted member]

He's faster and slightly more agile in SSB4, so some of my changes have been met! However, I would like to see:
-Super armor when he is in his shell.
-Tapping the B button in his neutral special move will send a fire ball out while holding it will unleash his Fire Breath.
-His on-screen appearance is him exiting out of the Koopa Clown Car.

I would also love to fight against Giga Bowser again...

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

I loved that Chain Chomp throw in Mario RPG, I wish that was his attack!

I hope to be able to play as Giga Bowser, and not just for 15 seconds, I want to actually pick Giga Bowser and play as him the whole entire match.

I wouldn't mind if they replaced Giga Bowser as a final smash just so Giga Bowser could be added as a playable character, in fact it would be a good character idea if they had any dlc characters.

 

[BKupa666]

That's just asking for him to get subjected to chain throws.

So long as the chain throws were only possible below a certain damage level, this would be a feasible way to balance out Bowser against those characters.

 

[Angiance]

Bowser weighs the most of all the characters (200), and already gets comboes dropped on him like a nuclear warhead; if the man weighed more, Pikachu could just pull a douche move, and U-Tilt him repeatedly til he reaches high percents. Bowser needs higher rewards for getting in on the opponent; F-Air REALLY needs a better hit-box, and quick landing lag so he can combo with it, although his strangely good air speed makes retreating F-Air decent(ish); Flame Breath is good as is. Honestly, the only disadvantages a heavy character should have is: being comboed badly, having a terrible recovery, having slow walk/run speed, etc.; giving them a bunch of snail like moves with bad hit-boxes that no one'll get hit by (Pikachu can very, very easily CRAWL under Bower's F-Smash!) isn't really great character design, or enjoyable.

 

[Bowserlick]

Bowser seems like he at least has a good dash attack. As a heavy character that should trade hits with lighter characters, Bowser needs a little more protection and better approach.

I think momentum should be an ability. Heavy characters running at their max speed should be able to not take stun or knockback from some projectiles.

Also, superarmor on shell attacks and/or added protection from being hit on the shell would be nice.

Taking away repeatable grabs would help the game overall as well as better character balance. Some characters just do not have big enough weaknesses (Metaknight).

 

[MagnesD3]

Bowser seems like he at least has a good dash attack. As a heavy character that should trade hits with lighter characters, Bowser needs a little more protection and better approach.

I think momentum should be an ability. Heavy characters running at their max speed should be able to not take stun or knockback from some projectiles.

Also, superarmor on shell attacks and/or added protection from being hit on the shell would be nice.

Taking away repeatable grabs would help the game overall as well as better character balance. Some characters just do not have big enough weaknesses (Metaknight).

I definitely think bowser needs some armored moves.

 

[Angiance]

Super armor isn't what he needs; the dude needs actually good, quick/safe attacks capable of chaining into strong attacks, or walling out the enemy (picture F-Air with better landing lag/range, making it stringable into say, jab, which could string to a grab); Bowzies grab needs more range as well (the same range as Dedede's, or Charizards).

 

[deadjames]

I'm not sure really, I was pretty happy with Bowser in Project M, so at the very least I hope someone on the dev team plays it and takes notes, but by the looks of things he has a new, much faster dash animation, and I'm assuming the dropkick will either be his new fsmash or dash attack so that's a good start, other than that I hope he gets a better projectile, his fire breath could either be replaced by fireballs, or thrown hammers.

Edit: Hopefully Smash 4 will have L cancelling that should solve a lot of the problems with his laggy aerials.

 

[Toxicroaker]

• Give him a projectile: If you tap the a button he can spit a large fireball but if it is held he can use fire breath
• Up-B should reflect projectiles
• Give him some super armor while dashing or ducking/crawling

 

[Pheta Ray]

• Super armor that Koopa Klaw
• Faster movement overall
• Take the landing lag from Bair and Dair and toss it right out the door
• Faster Uair
• Fsmash gets 5 frame super armor
• Up-B is something more... Well, more. (Less boring, it feels so weak when I use it.)

Any takers? Bowser for low-mid tier.

 

[PAPCGyE]

I'm the only one who hate the B-foward special attack? How many times did someone suicide with you doing that?

 

[MSmariosonic]

Super Armor..Nuff said

 

[Medaka444]

I'm the only one who hate the B-foward special attack? How many times did someone suicide with you doing that?

I think the suicide is a large reason why some prefer it to the Koopa Klaw (which is, IMO, rather boring). Also, there's something called Koopa Hopping to increase air mobility, but I don't know how useful it is.

 

[deadjames]

I think the suicide is a large reason why some prefer it to the Koopa Klaw (which is, IMO, rather boring). Also, there's something called Koopa Hopping to increase air mobility, but I don't know how useful it is.

Here's perhaps the best of many reasons why the Koopa Klaw is better, with his Brawl side-b your offstage options are limited to only suicides, with the Koopa Klaw you can jump offstage grab them, throw them against the stage which will stage spike and kill them leaving you alive to safely jump back onstage.

 

[Toxicroaker]

Here's perhaps the best of many reasons why the Koopa Klaw is better, with his Brawl side-b your offstage options are limited to only suicides, with the Koopa Klaw you can jump offstage grab them, throw them against the stage which will stage spike and kill them leaving you alive to safely jump back onstage.

Lol I have actually used it to recover before. (in brawl)

 

[deadjames]

Lol I have actually used it to recover before. (in brawl)

You can use it to recover in Melee/P:M too provided you save your double jump, but I was talking about offstage options against your opponent.

 

[smashbroskilla]

Faster recovery from running "A/normal" attacks

 

[Toxicroaker]

You can use it to recover in Melee/P:M too provided you save your double jump, but I was talking about offstage options against your opponent.

No, I used it to recover. Not recovering after... I was too low to get up with whirling fortress but I used flying slam and that did the trick.

 

[deadjames]

No, I used it to recover. Not recovering after... I was too low to get up with whirling fortress but I used flying slam and that did the trick.

That's why you need to save your double jump.

 

[Toxicroaker]

That's why you need to save your double jump.

...I was knocked off and he tried to edgeguard me more than he needed... I did not purposely jump off and wast my double jump...

 

[Pheta Ray]

Speaking of changes made to Bowser, I had more to add.

What do you guys think of adding a third jab? He already has his two claw slashes, what about a third?

 

[deadjames]

Speaking of changes made to Bowser, I had more to add.

What do you guys think of adding a third jab? He already has his two claw slashes, what about a third?

I just want jab 1 to combo into side-b.

 

[Niko Mar]

I'm pretty sure he has it now (saw what looks like energy waves in one of the trailers), but either stars or something surrounding him after he does his Down-B (like Yoshi & Dedede). This, combined with the fact that his upward approach on the move looks a lot better, will make it a lot more usable.

 

[deadjames]

I'm pretty sure he has it now (saw what looks like energy waves in one of the trailers), but either stars or something surrounding him after he does his Down-B (like Yoshi & Dedede). This, combined with the fact that his upward approach on the move looks a lot better, will make it a lot more usable.

All down-b needs to be usable is to be jump cancellable and have super armor like in Project: M.

 

[Niko Mar]

All down-b needs to be usable is to be jump cancellable and have super armor like in Project: M.

Meh, I like the idea Project M had, but I'd like the move to be more usable all the way through. It'd give people a reason to use it in the air if it had some protection when you hit the ground. Bowsercide would become ridiculous if you had a faster, super armored jump to lead into it (and possible make it a combo).

 

[deadjames]

Meh, I like the idea Project M had, but I'd like the move to be more usable all the way through. It'd give people a reason to use it in the air if it had some protection when you hit the ground. Bowsercide would become ridiculous if you had a faster, super armored jump to lead into it (and possible make it a combo).

P:M did make it usable in the air, you can use it to snap to the ledge, which opens up tons of options for ledge camping and edge-guarding, technically you could do that in Melee and Brawl as well, but the super armor makes it a lot more useful in P:M.

 

[Niko Mar]

P:M did make it usable in the air, you can use it to snap to the ledge, which opens up tons of options for ledge camping and edge-guarding, technically you could do that in Melee and Brawl as well, but the super armor makes it a lot more useful in P:M.

That's pretty nice, but what about just as an attack...still on the stage. If you only add a jump cancel and super armor, what's the point of the rest of the move (it's like a guaranteed free smash, needs something).

 

[deadjames]

That's pretty nice, but what about just as an attack...still on the stage. If you only add a jump cancel and super armor, what's the point of the rest of the move (it's like a guaranteed free smash, needs something).

There will always be moves that require a hard read to land and Bowser Bomb will forever be one of them, what you're asking for is unrealistic, not every character's moves need to be 100% safe, hell even Meta Knight, the most broken character in Smash history, has some unsafe moves.

 

[Niko Mar]

There will always be moves that require a hard read to land and Bowser Bomb will forever be one of them, what you're asking for is unrealistic, not every character's moves need to be 100% safe, hell even Meta Knight, the most broken character in Smash history, has some unsafe moves.

It still wouldn't be safe, you can just jump over it to get him. It would just make it hard for people like Fox to run in and Up smash him at mach speed the second they see an opening lol.

 

[StatusC]

I'd like to see Bowser's up b deflect projectiles into the air in a fireworks fashion. Not really useful, I just think it would look really cool.

 

[Hoboman5000]

Nerf his damage a little bit and increase his speed so he's up on a level with everybody else and won't be considered low tier.

 

[Toxicroaker]

Nerf his damage a little bit and increase his speed so he's up on a level with everybody else and won't be considered low tier.

But that gives him his play stile.