Greninja Grab Release Followups?

[InvaderSkoodge]

I have been practicing Greninja a lot recently, and I think that it would be good to examine the possible followups, and general strategies for a grab release, since Greninja's grab release puts the opponent a close distance in front of him. I know personally it is easy to follow up a grab release with a forward smash on some characters, like Fox. I mainly use this at high percent (130%), when no other throws have a good followup, and upthrow can't kill yet.

This supports my common thoughts on Greninja as a character, he has a ton of potential, but as a player you must know the physics and knock back of all moves on different characters to tap into that potential.

So does anyone else think grab release is a possible option? and what do you use it for?

 

[elusiveTranscendent]

The thing that I've noticed is, that when an opponent gets released from our grab in particular, they either are set in front of us on the ground, or their character jumps up and outwards.

This is what I'm remembering from memory. I should probably go back into the lab to confirm.

I know that Marth has a good follow up of a dtilt from his grab release; could we potentially do the same? Our dtilts both come out relatively quickly, though I'm unsure if ours has enough range to hit the opponent after they've been released, provided they are released on the ground.

 

[InvaderSkoodge]

It is character dependent, just by a little bit, which is annoying, but most characters are just plopped down in front and slide a little bit, it is also dependent on opponent hurt boxes, like when I was just testing Zelda escapes a f-smash even though the blade should hit her, her hurtbox is just too small.

Most importantly it appears to be set knockback! The most important part of getting a followup is to immediately do an input after your lag, which is the limiting factor to me.

 

[FullMoon]

What determines if a character is going to fly up or just go forward in a grab release is whether their feet are touching the ground or not when they're being grabbed.

 

[elusiveTranscendent]

What determines if a character is going to fly up or just go forward in a grab release is whether their feet are touching the ground or not when they're being grabbed.

Ohhh. I see.

 

[Inger]

Perfect pivoting towards them then ftilt towards them as well as dash attack probably work. One trips and the other pops them up. An uncharged shuriken would create hitstun enough for a dashgrab followup, I think, but the startup lag on uncharged shuriken would probably just catch them if they decided to spotdodge or something weird.

 

[Lavani]

I enjoy grab releasing opponents over the ledge to see what they'll do; some people aren't careful about how they mash and may kill themselves mashing out a laggy aerial. Others may not even be mashing and will let you rack up pummel damage...though Greninja has the worst (or at least one of the worst) pummels in the game, so that isn't exactly worth much.

Grab release doesn't have frame advantage, so keep in mind that there aren't any guaranteed followups off of it - I'm not 100% on this, but certain characters may have guaranteed followups on you for breaking out. Not to discourage talk on the subject as a surprise mixup or something, but it's kind of sketchy to opt for a situation where you aren't at an advantage and the opponent can just hold shield because they're immune to regrabs.

 

[Ludiloco]

Yeah, I feel like with our ability to juggle and how hard it is to land against us, even if up throw won't kill it's best just to use it for a potential follow up. At high % I like to wait til they come down and are about 3-4 character lengths above me, empty short hop to bait an air dodge and run in for an up smash. Works wonders.

 

[Poppy JR.]

Just off the top of my head, if you were to grab release them and they moved to to the side and up, you could try using the grounded hydro pump diagonal "squirt". I don't know how viable it would be, but it could gimp some slow retaliatory moves, like Ike's Aether, given that you were close to the edge. I imagine this technique would require some super hard reads, though.