LovinMitts
Smash Journeyman
I know I should never really lose neutral to Ganon, but I tend to do that. Anyone have any matchup advice for Ganon?
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I have issues with Ganon.
- Thread starter LovinMitts
- Start date
Well, the main character flaw you can exploit with Ganon is his lack of approaches and movement options. Zone him out with needles and when he commits to something really unsafe like a fair or stomp, just wavedash back and grab. The neutral isn't that hard if you camp with needles and stuff him out. Up tilt, jab, and forward tilt absolutely demolish him (unless he's at CC%'s.)
Apart from that, just respect his zone, and don't do anything dumb and you should be perfectly fine.
Oh and one more thing, if you get a grab and down throw, you should always strive to get around 40% minimum. You have a chaingrab (I don't know if it's 100% guaranteed though) and your fftilt --> fair combo should be easy to land at higher %'s.
Good luck!
Apart from that, just respect his zone, and don't do anything dumb and you should be perfectly fine.
Oh and one more thing, if you get a grab and down throw, you should always strive to get around 40% minimum. You have a chaingrab (I don't know if it's 100% guaranteed though) and your fftilt --> fair combo should be easy to land at higher %'s.
Good luck!
i can tell you right now. as i live in the same region as Kage. its not as easy as a match up as people think. Gannon punishes super hard and can often kill you off two or 3 exchanges, his chain grab is arguably better then sheiks.
my best advice after playing Kage for a long time. DONT PUT YOURSELF IN THE CORNER. Gannon has scary corner pressure. one wrong roll and spot dodge and that can mean your stock.
keep center stage and work on your punishment game. know your options out of d throw at super low%. gannon has lots of CC and Sdi tricks against sheik at low %. so be careful how you fight. I think if you lose this match up, its because of mistakes you make when gannon is at 0-30%. once hes higher then that your moves become much better.
my best advice after playing Kage for a long time. DONT PUT YOURSELF IN THE CORNER. Gannon has scary corner pressure. one wrong roll and spot dodge and that can mean your stock.
keep center stage and work on your punishment game. know your options out of d throw at super low%. gannon has lots of CC and Sdi tricks against sheik at low %. so be careful how you fight. I think if you lose this match up, its because of mistakes you make when gannon is at 0-30%. once hes higher then that your moves become much better.
Bizz (and honestly probably all lesser ganons, so everyone except kage) doesn't know how to take ledge from a shino stalling sheik, so if he corners me I just stall until I can get past him for free.
You can crouch under his grab and his jab, so if you fair his shield then crouch in front of it you can usually reactively grab his whiffed shield grab (I assume all low level ganons spam shield grab).
Be really careful when punishing Ganon. 90% of hits I see ganons get are either from having center stage (which they get via respawn invulnerability) or from hitting people out of their own combos. Don't get hit out of your own combos.
Ganon is extremely simple. If he fairs, dash dance back -> fair him -> crouch will most likely get you a free grab. If his fair hits your shield, it's borderline impossible for him to punish roll away. You can threaten whenever you want - bait a bunch and don't go in predictably, because you always get to decide when to attack and on top of that all of his responses to your baits are highly committal and punishable (except jab, which doesn't even beat half the approaches you would fake, and if he spams jab you can run up -> crouch -> grab).
How are you losing neutral? Look at what you're getting hit by - it shouldn't be hard because Ganon uses about 3 moves. Don't go in the air, or he'll use his upair, which is actually broken lmao but it doesn't matter because your ground game ****s his ****
You can crouch under his grab and his jab, so if you fair his shield then crouch in front of it you can usually reactively grab his whiffed shield grab (I assume all low level ganons spam shield grab).
Be really careful when punishing Ganon. 90% of hits I see ganons get are either from having center stage (which they get via respawn invulnerability) or from hitting people out of their own combos. Don't get hit out of your own combos.
Ganon is extremely simple. If he fairs, dash dance back -> fair him -> crouch will most likely get you a free grab. If his fair hits your shield, it's borderline impossible for him to punish roll away. You can threaten whenever you want - bait a bunch and don't go in predictably, because you always get to decide when to attack and on top of that all of his responses to your baits are highly committal and punishable (except jab, which doesn't even beat half the approaches you would fake, and if he spams jab you can run up -> crouch -> grab).
How are you losing neutral? Look at what you're getting hit by - it shouldn't be hard because Ganon uses about 3 moves. Don't go in the air, or he'll use his upair, which is actually broken lmao but it doesn't matter because your ground game ****s his ****
OG Zen
Smash Rookie
I feel u homie. I just got back from playing a really good ganon and got **** on. Even though hes a falcon main and the #1 in my state. It hurts. Bit here are some things i learned from last night after having played the MU for 4 hrs.
Dont attack pre emptively from the ledge. Ganon ****s bricks on that. Instead, inch ur way back into stage position.
Doing randy bairs to assert air dominance is horrendince. Just stay grounded. Please.
Ganon is a MU that tests ur adaptability and thought process harder then any other MU. U can slow down if it helps you thinl more clearly. I had the issue of trying to move really fast like i was playing fox. I was later told by a good sheik main to test his sheild and space to see how he reacts. Fair -> crouch as an example. Fair jab dash back. Fair wait. Is he starting to spot dodge alot?" Roll out the dsmashes". (lol drephen quote.)
If you get hit by a fair it sucks.
You have to have good DI in this MU.
Standing needle can edgegaurd ganon rofl.
Edgegaurding tricks:
Parallel with the edge/low? Nair.
Did he tech? Yes -> **** i dont know. Happened to me and i got hit by a fair
No -> re grab ledge bair b o i s
Bair some more
Bair again
One more time for the fans
Wait...wut. He air dodged? Stand up. Regrab. B throw. Bair some more or sh needle him.
I would always get hit by trying to over commit to engaging and my punishes. Chain grab the *******. Or if ur bad at CG like me just tech chase him.
Please. If u ftilt. Space it. I noted that wave dash back then ftilt is better then ftilting wherever u are currently standing. It ensures space. (pls corrct me if im wrong. ) the guy knew i loved to spam the good ol ftilt so he would ledgedash and sheild my poor spacing. Grab. Then convert like 100% into a stock.
I also noticed that my punishes suck mad balls. Id get like 25% off a grab. And i was getting them often. Fml.
Reminder: these are simply my notes i had from playing a good player in this MU for a long time. I really wish i could wave a wand and be blessed with infinite knowledge and insane findamentals.
Any advice or corrections?
Dont attack pre emptively from the ledge. Ganon ****s bricks on that. Instead, inch ur way back into stage position.
Doing randy bairs to assert air dominance is horrendince. Just stay grounded. Please.
Ganon is a MU that tests ur adaptability and thought process harder then any other MU. U can slow down if it helps you thinl more clearly. I had the issue of trying to move really fast like i was playing fox. I was later told by a good sheik main to test his sheild and space to see how he reacts. Fair -> crouch as an example. Fair jab dash back. Fair wait. Is he starting to spot dodge alot?" Roll out the dsmashes". (lol drephen quote.)
If you get hit by a fair it sucks.
You have to have good DI in this MU.
Standing needle can edgegaurd ganon rofl.
Edgegaurding tricks:
Parallel with the edge/low? Nair.
Did he tech? Yes -> **** i dont know. Happened to me and i got hit by a fair
No -> re grab ledge bair b o i s
Bair some more
Bair again
One more time for the fans
Wait...wut. He air dodged? Stand up. Regrab. B throw. Bair some more or sh needle him.
I would always get hit by trying to over commit to engaging and my punishes. Chain grab the *******. Or if ur bad at CG like me just tech chase him.
Please. If u ftilt. Space it. I noted that wave dash back then ftilt is better then ftilting wherever u are currently standing. It ensures space. (pls corrct me if im wrong. ) the guy knew i loved to spam the good ol ftilt so he would ledgedash and sheild my poor spacing. Grab. Then convert like 100% into a stock.
I also noticed that my punishes suck mad balls. Id get like 25% off a grab. And i was getting them often. Fml.
Reminder: these are simply my notes i had from playing a good player in this MU for a long time. I really wish i could wave a wand and be blessed with infinite knowledge and insane findamentals.
Any advice or corrections?