Data Matchup Discussion and Analysis - Directory

[A_Kae]

Marth Matchup Discussion and Analysis

• General Posting Guidelines
  • Quality Posts: Post relavant, detailed responses when possible. Avoid posting simple matchup ratios/scores. Providing data or tournament replays to support your post is always appreciated.
  • Civil Discussion: A discussion has more value when conducted in a civil manner than one with personal attacks. Please stay respectful of other posters.
  • Matchup Differences: If you feel that there is a notable difference between Marth and Lucina, whether in overall score, or how the matchup should be fought, please indicate so in your post.
  • Full Potential: Always assume that both characters are being played to their full potential. Don't base your position on sub standard play.
  
  
• Points to consider in your analysis
  • The Overall Matchup Score: Which character has the advantage over the other, and by how much. See below for definitions.
  • How The Matchup Should Be Optimally Played: How to fight the opponent more efficiently and deal with them. General do's and don't of the matchup.
  • Gameplay States: How should each stated be played?
    
    • Neutral:
    • Advantage:
    • Disadvantage:
  • Stage Choice: Which stages should be chosen against the opponent, and which stages should be avoided, and how the stage elements affect the matchup
  • Custom Move Choices (If applicable): If custom moves are on, be sure to mention which moves should be used and how they affect they matchup.
  
  
• Matchup Scoring
  
  +4 = decisive advantage
  +3 = large advantage
  +2 = medium advantage
  +1 = small advantage
  ±0 = even or insignificant (dis)advantages
  -1 = small disadvantage
  -2 = medium disadvantage
  -3 = large disadvantage
  -4 = decisive disadvantage​

Matchup Table

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Spoiler: Matchup Threads

The Matchup Threads
VS Rosalina : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-rosalina-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.414165/
VS Yoshi : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-yoshi-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.414708//
VS Pikachu : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-pikachu-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.415339/
VS Robin : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-robin-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.415677/
VS Mii Swordfighter : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-mii-swordfighter-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.415945/
VS Zelda : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-zelda-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.416331/
VS Ike : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-ike-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.416595/
VS Wii Fit Trainer : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-wii-fit-trainer-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.416931/
VS [Dark] Pit /: http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-dark-pit-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.417387/
VS Mario : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-mario-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.417971/
VS Fox : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-fox-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.418740/
VS Ryu : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-ryu-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.420266/
VS Sheik : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-sheik-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.422136/
VS Zero Suit Samus : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-zero-suit-samus-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.422137/
VS Little Mac : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-little-mac-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.422140/
VS Captain Falcon : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-captain-falcon-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.423227/
VS Bowser : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-bowser-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.423228/
VS Lucario : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-lucario-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.424115/
VS Shulk : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-shulk-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.424116/
VS Charizard : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-charizard-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.427081/
VS Diddy Kong : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-diddy-kong-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.427586//
VS Mega Man : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-mega-man-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.430648/
VS Cloud : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-cloud-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.430649/
VS Meta Knight : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-meta-knight-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.431301/
VS Sonic : http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-sonic-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.431300/

 

[Saki-]

Past Threads Can Be Found Here:
http://smashboards.com/threads/matc...rectory-currently-discussing-rosalina.414156/

http://smashboards.com/threads/marth-match-up-discussion-update-zss.383174/

 

[Locuan]

Thanks for taking up the project @ A_Kae and @ Saki- ! I'll be looking forward to how this thread advances. On that note, I might use this post as well to add any data/images/graphs that I may find pertinent in the future.

 

[A_Kae]

Rosalina

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-rosalina-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.414165/

 

[Mr.Random]

Has anyone discussed marth vs yoshi?

 

[Saki-]

Negative, but it is a matchup we can discuss really soon.

 

[A_Kae]

Has it been 3 days already? I guess it has been.

Yoshi is matchup that isn't talked about much, and can give a lot of players trouble. It's a good choice.

also this means I don't have to make the random character generator yet.

 

[HFlash]

Maybe we could bring over some Rosa mains over here? Actually, why ask, I will make a post on their boards to see if they will be willing to put some input. I wish I could put valuable input, but I really don't see alot of Rosas. I think alot of it is due to the fact that similar to sonic, she has a very defensive zoney play style, which gets bad talked harshly to the point that people regularly call rosa mains cancerous (at least on twitch). Which is ridiculous but that's another story.

Edit: Just made a thread asking some Rosa mains for their input.

 

[ben1707]

I really feel like Marth has a medium to large advantage against Rosa. He one shots Luma with Fsmash/ Dsmash/ Shield Braker near the ledge, and then Rosalona can be easily killed with any tippered attacks at medium/high percents. It's all about focusing on Luma while doing some damage to rosa. Don't know about Lucina though

 

[A_Kae]

Maybe we could bring over some Rosa mains over here? Actually, why ask, I will make a post on their boards to see if they will be willing to put some input. I wish I could put valuable input, but I really don't see alot of Rosas. I think alot of it is due to the fact that similar to sonic, she has a very defensive zoney play style, which gets bad talked harshly to the point that people regularly call rosa mains cancerous (at least on twitch). Which is ridiculous but that's another story.

Edit: Just made a thread asking some Rosa mains for their input.

I knew there was something I was forgetting to do. Thanks for doing that.

I really feel like Marth has a medium to large advantage against Rosa. He one shots Luma with Fsmash/ Dsmash/ Shield Braker near the ledge, and then Rosalona can be easily killed with any tippered attacks at medium/high percents. It's all about focusing on Luma while doing some damage to rosa. Don't know about Lucina though

If there's already a thread for a matchup, post in the specific thread, not here.

 

[ben1707]

I knew there was something I was forgetting to do. Thanks for doing that.



If there's already a thread for a matchup, post in the specific thread, not here.

Thank you! :D

 

[A_Kae]

Yoshi

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-yoshi-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.414708//

-

Edit: Next thread way too late because I forgot. Since there was no request, it's random this time.

Pikachu

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-pikachu-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.415339/

 

[FullMoon]

Hello Falchion users, the Greninja boards is going to start discussing you guys: http://smashboards.com/threads/mast...m-week-8-24-8-31.369356/page-25#post-20005352

 

[A_Kae]

Robin

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-robin-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.415677/

Mii Swordfighter

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-mii-swordfighter-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.415945/

Zelda

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-zelda-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.416331/

Ike

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-ike-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.416595/

Wii Fit Trainer

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-wii-fit-trainer-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.416931/

[Dark] Pit /

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-dark-pit-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.417387/

 

[Sneak Sneaks]

Have you discussed vs. Mario?

 

[A_Kae]

Have you discussed vs. Mario?

Not yet, but now is as good a time as any to start.

Mario

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-mario-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.417971/

Fox

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-fox-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.418740/

 

[TheUnknownMartin]

Unless there's some way to stop the combos, little-no ending lag of Ryu's Side Smash, The Shoryuken having super armour/being fast as hell, Ryu's priority in general? I can't seem to adapt to them, as Lucina's frame-data is terrible, and most of Lucina's strings are punishable. This also goes for the rest of my characters (Jiggly and her landing lag+lightness, Yoshi and his grab taking so long, as well as his lag after turning around sprinting, Palutena in general.) I even perfect shield the Hadoukens, punish the Focus, and try to read, but I can't do anything once the Ryu finds 1 tiny mistake (like an accidental up smash supposed to be a uptilt, failed Dance Trot, missed spacing, wrong attack). Once he gets in his strings, I'm done for. Ive face 5 Ryu's so far, and I can't seem to stop them. Should I use Sheik or ZZS or something (top tiers)?

 

[Locuan]

TheUnknownMartin your post was moved to the match-up thread. You will be able to get more help regarding match-ups by asking here.

 

[A_Kae]

Ryu

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-ryu-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.420266/

 

[Gemba Board]

I skimmed over a few threads, including the sheik boards, and I havent seen a solid thought on that matchup yet. Can someone point me in the right direction? Or can we spark that up here?

 

[A_Kae]

Since I've been gone for a while now and unable to post new matchup threads, I'm going to do three right now instead of just one. Sheik and Zero Suit because they're the common top 2 right now, and it's probably a good idea to have threads for them. Little Mac because he was at the top of my random list.

Sheik

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-sheik-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.422136/

Zero Suit Samus

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-zero-suit-samus-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.422137/

Little Mac

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-little-mac-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.422140/

 

[MARTH_IS_BAE]

Tbh I think Marth really beats Shiek in the Shiek MU. Like what does Shiek do about fair? When I play Shiek I kind of feel like I'm watching a Princess Diana documentary it's so sad. Like none of my Shiek friends or Shiek players on FG have ever beaten my Marth. Definitely one of our easier MUs.

 

[Ako.]

Tbh I think Marth really beats Shiek in the Shiek MU. Like what does Shiek do about fair? When I play Shiek I kind of feel like I'm watching a Princess Diana documentary it's so sad. Like none of my Shiek friends or Shiek players on FG have ever beaten my Marth. Definitely one of our easier MUs.

hey dude welcome to smashboards! but try to post in the proper thread next time. We have a vs shiek mu thread so pls post there.
As a reponse to your post, Shiek definitely wins the MU, 60-40 imo. No way this MU is in marths favor. Shiek fair beats urs and she has the tools too pressure and be aggressive which is something marth has trouble with, and she also has the tools too play the zoning and spacing game. Not to sound like an ass but u prolly playing bad shieks

 

[A_Kae]

And I forgot to post new threads again, so I'm making two now.

Bowser

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-bowser-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.423228/

Captain Falcon

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-captain-falcon-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.423227/

Lucario

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-lucario-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.424115/

Shulk

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-shulk-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.424116/

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Hello.

I'm a Charizard main and we're currently discussing the Marth vs Charizard matchup!

http://smashboards.com/threads/charizard-matchup-discussion-marth.424722/

We'd love for you to come over and talk about the matchup! We'd really appreciate it.

Also, Zard should totally be the next matchup A_Kae

 

[A_Kae]

Well, it's about a month late but I made the Charizard thread!

Charizard

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-charizard-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.427081/

Diddy Kong

http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-diddy-kong-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.427586/

 

[WispBae]

Wasn't sure where to post this but...

Hey there Hero Kings! The Doggy subforum is currently discussing this MU and would love your input on it!

Click on... whatever this is supposed to be... to hop straight to the thread!

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

The Rosalina sub-forum is analyzing Marth again this week. Here's the link to the page if you have anything to contribute.

http://smashboards.com/threads/410743/

Also, Lucina is being analyzed again this week.

http://smashboards.com/threads/410745/

 

[Blue Banana]

Hi, the Olimar board is now discussing the Marth/Lucina matchup. Any input is appreciated.

 

[gagebair]

has anyone made a vs. cloud matchup thread?

 

[A_Kae]

has anyone made a vs. cloud matchup thread?

Yes, here: http://smashboards.com/threads/vs-cloud-matchup-discussion-and-analysis.430649/

 

[Illusion.]

Greninja boards are talking about the MU against the Falchions, any input is appreciated.

Link is here: http://smashboards.com/threads/mast...alchions-dedede-bayo-2-29-3-14.369356/page-35

 

[Trillion]

Anyone got any experience against Ness that would be willing to share a few tips? Got wrecked in grand finals of a small weekly bracket by one. Private message is welcomed if it would be better than talking about it in here.

 

[JimmyTheCaterpillar]

The boards are now discussing the Hero himself, Marth! Please come on over and help us learn more about each other!

 

[Swamp Sensei]

http://smashboards.com/threads/charizard-matchup-discussion-lucina.438661/

Well this is a tad awkward.

I come to say that the Charizard boards are discussing the Charizard vs Lucina matchup and get linked here.

Uh...

Come anyways! I'm sure there are notable differences between the matchups!

 

[Mythzotick]

In order to succeded, one must learn the fundamentals. Hey Marth Mains! The boards are about to discuss the Marth/Lucina match up. Any input is appreciated. Thank you.

 

[EnhaloTricks]

How does Marth do vs rosa? I'm a fox main and she's really tough for me. Looking for a good secondary and I love marth.

I'm gonna read the analysis thread later but just the quick n dirty would be nice

 

[SmBootZ]

I seem to be having a lot of trouble dealing with Ness and Lucas. Anyone have advice on what marth can do in this match up, mainly in the neutral?

 

[Nice_FZPSC.42]

Who beats ? Like all characters with an advantage over him.

 

[Floor]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1R2msbBDYm4c3-wmiN0Jabegr4181Xf2iy4My-dW9u8g/edit?usp=sharing

My MU Guide on Mewtwo
Written from perspective of a Lucina/Marcina player