Ninja101
Smash Rookie
kirby in low tier? greninja is low mid tier?!?!? people still have that freaking melee mentality "kirby sucks".. and not a lot of people vote for greninja and just because he is nerfed he has to be that low!?
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whats up with the tier list
- Thread starter Ninja101
- Start date
TheRealDonquavious
Smash Cadet
- Joined
- Apr 13, 2015
- Messages
- 30
Greninja is actually almost always put at mid-high or mid from what I've seen, which is about where he is. I also almost always see Kirby at mid tier as well. This isn't because of nerfs or old melee mentalities, but rather because these two characters are very rarely used in high levels of play. Tier lists are based on matchups and tournament results. Greninja and Kirby are simply underused, not necessarily underestimated. The meta will change with time, whether it be positive or negative. I believe that greninja will be seen more as his meta develops. I don't play Kirby though, so I can't speak for him.
Shack
Smash Journeyman
The only way Greninja will ever be high tier is if he gets buffs or someone like aMSa learns to use his mobility with Perfect Pivots and fox trots on command as if they were wave dashes and becomes un touchable. Even then, he still lacks a lot. His aerials all have start up lag (Nair), Shield Grab is probably one of the worse in the game, high skill cap for reliable kill set ups and combos, lacks reliable kill combos from throws, decent neutral game.
Greninja is really hard to play and doesn't have tournament results. He's always been put at mid to high mid simply because he's fast and people assume a fast character can't be bad even though his hitboxes come out extremely slow. Not that Greninja is bad, but if he was people wouldn't know because nobody understands the character.
I don't know why Kirby always gets put low. I don't play him enough to know his shortcomings, but he can be pretty threatening with back air walls and soft spikes.
I don't know why Kirby always gets put low. I don't play him enough to know his shortcomings, but he can be pretty threatening with back air walls and soft spikes.
Last edited:
AlexAnthonyD
Smash Apprentice
I think the buffs we received over the past 2 patches, shirekens recently and ftilt before that made Greninja a really viable character as he flows in so many ways. Aerials do have startup LAG but with Bair at Frame 5 and Uair starting at frame 7 this really isn't that slow, but yeah they do have limited usability. Jumping with an uncharged aforementioned shireken works as a really quick forward air for characters at many ranges, and the little hop we get now every time we throw out the shireken really helps our mixup.
You're not wrong in your points but I quoted your post because I didn't feel it was entirely accurate. I am a bit more optimistic for Greninja and maybe i'm being a fan of him more than anything but I really feel like I can see big things happening once its all said and done (unless we get nerfed of course).
Shack
Smash Journeyman
I'm a huge fan of him too, that is why I still main him instead of just playing Sheik. You have to realistic though if you want to try and overcome his weakness'. The fact that he cant throw out aerials as haphazardly as a large portion of the cast sucks. No shield grab, really sucks. No gtfo move sucks too. He lacks a lot of basic tools that the top tiers have. I think he is still viable, just won't be high tier unless people start to master his speed. Tiers don't matter though, if you get nice with him and win tourneys, then that's great!
