Zelda MU ratios

[Veggie123]

In an attempt to try and get us a bit more productive, I invite ALL Zelda players, especially you tournament Zeldas, to list their own ratios for Zelda against each character. This isn't the place to argue if you disagree with someone's numbers, leave that for the MU discussion threads. This topic is just to get a feel on where everyone stands MU wise. It should be interesting to see what people think based on their own personal experiences.

Here's what I think right now, copy and paste my ratios and manipulate them to what you see fit.

20-80 MK
25-75 Snake
40-60 Wario
35-65 Falco
40-60 Diddy
50-50 DDD
35-65 Marth
25-75 G&W
45-55 Pikachu
20-80 Olimar
55-45 Ice Climbers
45-55 Kirby
40-60 Lucario
40-60 ZSS
50-50 ROB
45-55 TL
45-55 Pit
50-50 DK
35-65 Peach
45-55 Luigi
50-50 Fox
40-60 Wolf
50-50 Sonic
40-60 Sheik
60-40 Bowser
55-45 PT
40-60 Ike
55-45 Lucas
55-45 Mario
50-50 Ness
60-40 Yoshi
40-60 Samus
40-60 Jigglypuff
60-40 Falcon
55-45 Link
65-35 Ganon

 

[KayLo!]

Pikachu - 45:55/40:60
Falco - 35:65
DDD - 40:60
Peach - 35:65
ICs - 55:45
Marth - 35:65
ROB - 45:55/40:60
Ness - 50:50
Bowser - 60:40
Mario - 50:50
Yoshi - 60:40
Falcon - 60:40
Ganon - 60:40
MK, Snake, G&W, Olimar - So unwinnable, it's not even worth it to number them.

Those're the only MUs I feel comfortable giving ratios for.

 

[Kataefi]

A big heads up to everyone that posts in here... keep it civil. Don't be so obsessive over someone else's opinion.

I'll be watching over this thread carefully.

Here are matchups I feel I relatively know what I'm doing in:

35-65 Wario
40-60 Diddy
45-55 Toon Link
45-55 Pit
40-60 Peach
40-60 Luigi
40-60 Sonic
45-55 PT --> 35-65 Squirtle / 55-45 Ivy / 50-50 Charz
45-55 Ike

 

[GodAtHand]

Just from personal experience. Tournament matches.
? = I don't feel I have sufficient knowledge to comment.

30-70 MK
30-70 Snake
50-50 Wario
35-65 Falco
40-60 Diddy
50-50 DDD
?-? Marth
30-70 G&W
?-? Pikachu
25-75 Olimar
45-55 Ice Climbers
45-55 Kirby
40-60 Lucario
40-60 ZSS
45-55 ROB
45-55 TL
45-55 Pit
50-50 DK
45-55 Peach
45-55 Luigi
50-50 Fox
40-60 Wolf
50-50 Sonic
?-? Sheik
?-? Bowser
55-45 PT
50-50 Ike
50-50 Lucas
55-45 Mario
50-50 Ness
55-45 Yoshi
50-50 Samus
55-45 Jigglypuff
60-40 Falcon
60-40 Link
65-35 Ganon

 

[MrEh]

Here are my ratios, with reasons for my more favorite ones.. (some more lazily written then others)


20-80 MK
It's MK. He outrages Zelda, he can gimp her, he's faster then her and he can punish every bit of lag that Zelda goes through. Zelda has little tools to defend herself if MK is swinging at her, and she has no real way of approaching an MK who's camping her. If MK gets her in the air or offstage, Zelda gets wrecked.

30-70 Snake
Zelda's ground game gets eaten alive by Snake's tilts, and Snake outcamps her with grenades. Snake hits like a truck, and Zelda will pretty much be in death range with a handful of tilts. Approaching from the ground is like trying to attack a brick wall, and approaching for the air with Zelda is pretty bad as well, considering that Snake can punish a lot of things with his ridiculous tilts.

35-65 Wario
Aircamp aircamp aircamp. If Wario gets the percentage lead, he can run away from Zelda and Zelda is going to be in a very bad situation. Even if he doesn't camp, it's still not that good. Wario's air speed can be used to pressure Zelda and prevent him from being punished, and it pretty much makes Din's near useless for forcing him to approach you. The weight difference here is pretty bad as well, and it doesn't help that Wario is super strong. If you lag for a second in front of him, you're dead. Waft kills Zelda extremely early.

35-65 Falco
*pew pew pew*
Falco camps Zelda hard, and when Zelda approaches him, Falco has plenty of fast options to screw with her. He can short hop laser as an approach, and has that stupid jab of his that eats Zelda alive. (2 frame jab with stupid range)

40-60 Diddy
Glide toss into dash attack to catch the banana is hilarious.

40-60 Dedede
Dedede still can't chaingrab you, but he still does like 18% per grab. If her gets a few grabs in, the Zelda is in death percents already. Obviously, he has a bogus grab range, and he can use it to punish a lot of Zelda's moves. You attack his shield, you die. Oh, and Bair. Bair wrecks Zelda in the air.

35-65 Marth
He has his aerials. He has Dancing Blade. Those two things make this matchup a load of balls. Marth simply outrages Zelda, and he can punish her very well. Sword>sparkles.

25-75 G&W
blah blah blah, moving on.

10-90 Olimar
Don't even bother. Olimar destroys Zelda with throwing Pikmin and Pivot Grabs. There is nothing that Zelda can do about this.

50-50 Ice Climbers
Fsmash a lot. Don't get grabbed.


40-60 Pikachu
45-55 Kirby
40-60 Lucario
40-60 ZSS
40-60 ROB
40-60 TL
40-60 Pit
40-60 DK
35-65 Peach
45-55 Luigi
40-60 Fox
40-60 Wolf
45-55 Sonic
50-50 Sheik
60-40 Bowser
55-45 PT
50-50 Charizard
60-40 Ivysaur
50-50 Squirtle
45-55 Ike
50-50 Lucas
50-50 Mario
50-50 Ness
50-50 Yoshi
45-55 Samus
60-40 Jigglypuff
60-40 Falcon
60-40 Link
60-40 Ganon

 

[stingers]

why does zelda do so well against ics? o.o

 

[MrEh]

why does zelda do so well against ics? o.o

Because of Fsmash and because Nana is stupid.

 

[Brinzy]

30-70 MK
30-70 Snake
40-60 Wario
40-60 Falco
40-60 Diddy
50-50 DDD
35-65 Marth
30-70 G&W
45-55 Pikachu
15-85 Olimar
50-50 Ice Climbers
55-45 Kirby
40-60 Lucario
40-60 ZSS
45-55 ROB
40-60 TL
50-50 Pit
40-60 DK
35-65 Peach
50-50 Luigi
40-60 Fox
40-60 Wolf
50-50 Sonic
40-60 Sheik
60-40 Bowser
50-50 PT
45-55 Ike
50-50 Lucas
50-50 Mario
50-50 Ness
55-45 Yoshi
45-55 Samus
55-45 Jigglypuff
60-40 Falcon
60-40 Link
60-40 Ganon

 

[KayLo!]

60-45 Link

I'm guessing you meant 60:40?

Nice to see someone else agree on DDD being in DDD's favor.

 

[Veggie123]

I'm guessing you meant 60:40?

actually, that was my typo...lool

 

[MrEh]

Nice to see someone else agree on DDD being in DDD's favor.

That's because it is.

actually, that was my typo...lool

Copy and paste ftw.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

35-65 MK
30-70 Snake
50-50 Wario
55-45 Falco
55-45 Diddy
55-45 DDD
50-50 Marth
45-55 G&W
60-40 Pikachu
35-65 Olimar
55-45 Ice Climbers
55-45 Kirby
55-45 Lucario
50-50 ZSS
50-50 ROB
55-45 TL
50-50 Pit
50-50 DK
50-50 Peach
60-40 Luigi
60-40 Fox
50-50 Wolf
60-40 Sonic
60-40 Sheik
60-40 Bowser
60-40 PT
45-55 Ike
55-45 Lucas
55-45 Mario
50-50 Ness
60-40 Yoshi
60-40 Samus
65-35 Jigglypuff
70-30 Falcon
60-40 Link
80-20 Ganon

Zelda ratios on the left the other on the right.

 

[mountain_tiger]

25-75 MK
30-70 Snake
35-65 Wario
35-65 Falco
40-60 Diddy
55-45 DDD
35-65 Marth
20-80 G&W
45-55 Pikachu
25-75 Olimar
55-45 Ice Climbers
40-60 ZSS
50-50 ROB
40-60 Peach
45-55 Luigi
60-40 Bowser
65-35 Jigglypuff
60-40 Falcon
65-35 Ganon


As for the others, I don't feel I have enough match-up knowledge to give ratios for them.

 

[Half-Split Soul]

50-05 Marth

I think you meant 50-50...

I'm not going to post any ratios myself, but I'll be reading what others think about them from the sidelines.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

I think you meant 50-50...

I'm not going to post any ratios myself, but I'll be reading what others think about them from the sidelines.

Good catch didn't realize the typo. I think I already know all of your Zelda ratios 0-100 =/.

 

[Half-Split Soul]

I think I already know all of your Zelda ratios 0-100 =/.

LOL not really. It's not like I'd go as far as to think she's the worst character ever created with no chance of winning against anyone ever. In fact, I find her completely capable of winning a good deal of MU's.

Although I also do find her to have a very limited amount of advantages bigger than near-even.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

LOL not really. It's not like I'd go as far as to think she's the worst character ever created with no chance of winning against anyone ever. In fact, I find her completely capable of winning a good deal of MU's.

Although I also do find her to have a very limited amount of advantages bigger than near-even.

Good because that would make her captain falcon.

 

[zeldspazz]

30-70 MK
35-65 Snake
35-65 Wario
35-65 Falco
40-60 Diddy
45-55 DDD
35-65 Marth
Wow G&W
Wow Olimar
55-45 Ice Climbers
35-65 Lucario
45-55 ZSS
50-50 ROB
35-65 TL
45-55 Pit
45-55 DK
37-63 Peach
50-50 Sonic
45-55 Sheik
60-40 Bowser
50-50 PT
45-55 Ike
50-50 Lucas
50-50 Mario
50-50 Ness
45-55 Samus
60-40 Jigglypuff
65-35 Falcon
50-50 Link
60-40 Ganon

There are a some I didnt do cus ive never fought anyone competant as that character.

 

[powuh_of_PIE]

30-70 MK
35-65 Snake
40-60 Wario
40-60 Falco
40-60 Diddy
50-50 DDD
35-65 Marth
25-75 G&W
45-55 Pikachu
20-80 Olimar
55-45 Ice Climbers
45-55 Kirby
45-55 Lucario
40-60 ZSS
50-50 ROB
35-65 TL
50-50 Pit
50-50 DK
40-60 Peach
45-55 Luigi
50-50 Fox
40-60 Wolf
50-50 Sonic
47-53 Sheik (this one is almost even)
60-40 Bowser
55-45 PT
40-60 Ike
55-45 Lucas
55-45 Mario
50-50 Ness
60-40 Yoshi
55-45 Samus
45-55 Jigglypuff
65-35 Falcon
55-45 Link
65-35 Ganon

 

[zeldspazz]

Am I doin something really wrong against TL. Cus Im always really intimidated by all his projectiles and my ratio for him is lower than most.

 

[KayLo!]

L2perfect shield.

That's honest advice, btw. Most TLs fall into a spam pattern, so perfect shielding/avoiding his projectiles to get close isn't as hard as it sounds -- still hard, mind you, but mainly just really, really annoying because you'll be doing it for half the match, if not more.

Also, predict and punish zairs.

If you're mainly a wifi Zelda (iirc, that's what you've said before, right?), it'll be much harder for you since perfect shielding is a complete ***** online. Not to call you out, but that's why it's sometimes a really bad idea to base ratios off of wifi. x.x

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

L2perfect shield.

That's honest advice, btw. Most TLs fall into a spam pattern, so perfect shielding/avoiding his projectiles to get close isn't as hard as it sounds -- still hard, mind you, but mainly just really, really annoying because you'll be doing it for half the match, if not more.

Also, predict and punish zairs.

If you're mainly a wifi Zelda (iirc, that's what you've said before, right?), it'll be much harder for you since perfect shielding is a complete ***** online. Not to call you out, but that's why it's sometimes a really bad idea to base ratios off of wifi. x.x

I'd have to disagree perfect shielding isn't that bad. I can do it on a consistent basis in any connection. You just need to practice it offline to be able to get more consistent at it.

 

[zeldspazz]

Yeah, I basically wifi most of the time, you just have to play a few matches to get the correct timing, after that perfect sheilding isnt too hard. Its just all about adjustments for each connection, and then honestly I dont feel as much of a difference on/offline. I might just be better at adapting than most though, cus I always hear people complain that they cant do **** on wifi because of lag. *shrugs* Thanks

 

[MrEh]

Yeah, I basically wifi most of the time

Well that's the problem then.

Zelda can't punish TL for crap on wifi.

 

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

Yeah, I basically wifi most of the time, you just have to play a few matches to get the correct timing, after that perfect sheilding isnt too hard. Its just all about adjustments for each connection, and then honestly I dont feel as much of a difference on/offline. I might just be better at adapting than most though, cus I always hear people complain that they cant do **** on wifi because of lag. *shrugs* Thanks

It's not the lag but the input that screws with ppl. I used to be unaffected by online but its starting to get more annoying. But I just try to take it in atride since its all i got till i go tp tournies.

 

[KayLo!]

till i go tp tournies.

I was at the biweekly today.

I saw no AlmostLegendary, just sayin.

 

[#HBC | Scary]

35-65 MK
It's MK, he does stuff, and this become an annoying fight real quick

35-65 Snake
See above, make sure your spacing is amazing and everything could be ok

50-50 Wario
I have never had trouble in this matchup, Up angled Ftilt does work in this MU. Don't get baited

40-60 Falco
This MU sucks against campy Falcos. Aggro Falcos, it isn't so bad

45-55 Diddy
This is fun, try not to use NL so much since it can get you burned

50-50 DDD
Though I think it's even, I can't fight this matchup to save my life. I play far to aggressive to win.

42-58 Marth
I think this matchup is fun. Again, Up angled Ftilt works wonders here. I think it beats his Fair approaches straight up

30-70 G&W
Yup, G&W.

48-52 Pikachu
This one is close but Pikachu has enough to get by.

35-65 Olimar
I know how it can be bad, but in all honesty, I haven't had any trouble with him.

55-45 Ice Climbers
Gotta love Fsmash

55-45 Kirby

50-50 Lucario
45-55 ZSS
45-55 ROB
40-60 TL
50-50 Pit
50-50 DK
40-60 Peach
50-50 Luigi
50-50 Fox
45-55 Wolf
50-50 Sonic
50-50 Sheik
60-40 Bowser
55-45 PT
45-55 Ike
55-45 Lucas
55-45 Mario
50-50 Ness
60-40 Yoshi
55-45 Samus
45-55 Jigglypuff
65-35 Falcon
55-45 Link
60-40 Ganon


EDIT: Oh wow, looking at these numbers again, I could only imagine what I was on when I typed this out.

 

[-Mars-]

35-65 MK
30-70 Snake
40-60 Wario
50-50 Falco
30-70 Diddy
50-50 DDD
35-65 Marth
25-75 G&W
45-55 Pikachu
30-70 Olimar
55-45 Ice Climbers
50-50 Kirby
40-60 Lucario
35-65 ZSS
35-65 ROB
35-65 TL
45-55 Pit
40-60 DK
35-65 Peach
50-50 Luigi
50-50 Fox
40-60 Wolf
45-55 Sonic
40-60 Sheik
60-40 Bowser
55-45 Charizard
50-50 Ivysaur
40-60 Squirtle
40-60 Ike
55-45 Lucas
50-50 Mario
50-50 Ness
50-50 Yoshi
40-60 Samus
55-45 Jigglypuff
60-40 Falcon
60-40 Link
60-40 Ganon

My feelings on the matchups as of now

 

[Aibou]

Let's see if I can contribute with the small knowledge I have:

Olimar: 20-80 (God help us all. I think this matchup is pure garbage. If it weren't for the fact that Oli's easy to edgehog, then I think this would be impossible)

MK: 25-75 (It's hard. Not unwinnable, per se. But very, very, very hard)

Snake: 30-70 (FUN! )

G&W: 30-70 (...)

Peach: 35-65 (It's not impossible, but Peach has a lot over us that I can't even explain properly)

Falco: 35-65 or 40-60 (It depends on how campy Falco is. A campier Falco is harder than a more aggressive Falco)

Marth: 40-60 (Hard, due to his superior range and priority, but it's nowhere near impossible. Personally, I rarely lose to Marth, but it could be that I need to face stronger Marths)

Lucario: 40-60
Fox: 40-60
Sheik: 45-55
Ike: 45-55
Mario: 45-55
Samus: 45-55
R.O.B.: 50-50
Lucas: 50-50
Yoshi: 50-50
Link: 50-50 (Yup)
Bowser: 55-45
Kirby: 60-40
C. Falcon: 60-40
Ganondorf: 60-40

The rest, I haven't had enough experience to give an accurate opinion on. This is just the experiences I've had.

EDIT: I forgot Lucario. He's above Fox now.

 

[Darkmusician]

I just looked at the S and A tier ratios. But yeah I agree with those ratios pretty much. 5% give or take but ya close enough.

 

[JigglyZelda003]

Wow im surprised alot of people feel that JP isn't that bad for JP. i thought i was one of the few that thought it was.

i agree with most other matchups so far

 

[Dark.Pch]

I don't think Zelda gets it that hard vs Peach as it says in this thread. I'll Say this, If Zelda is facing an aggressive Peach, She can take it.

 

[KayLo!]

Well, playing aggressively against Zelda with any character is pretty dumb. Unless you're a top tier who can easily **** her anyways.

Turnips + fair = gg.

Although Zelda's nair is pretty great for this particular MU.

 

[Dark.Pch]

Yea it is, I hate that move when used against me. Used correctly, you can screw Peach over. Stupid sparkles.

 

[mountain_tiger]

I still find it hard to believe that Zelda vs Peach is 35:65. Yes, it's definitely in Peach's favour. But 35:65? I'd say it's more like somewhere between 40:60 and 45:55. USmash helps out a lot in this matchup.

 

[zeldspazz]

I still find it hard to believe that Zelda vs Peach is 35:65. Yes, it's definitely in Peach's favour. But 35:65? I'd say it's more like somewhere between 40:60 and 45:55. USmash helps out a lot in this matchup.

Peachs are good at baiting and punishing it, I dont find it that useful at all. The key is to learn how to catch turnips which Im trying to get better at, because getting around her camping can be troublesome.

 

[KayLo!]

Usmash?



*refrains*

EDIT: Ninja'd. But I agree with Zeldspazz. And kinda have more to say, but I don't feel like getting into it. Usmash isn't terribly useful, though, from my experience.

 

[Dark.Pch]

If the Peach likes to be in the air alot and float too much, then Yes, Upsmash is your friend. But same time you might not kill well cause you abusing that move. Iif you can land her other kills moves well, then go for it. Peach dies best off the top. So need to think wice about how to use that upsmash.

Also For her Turnip>Fair gimic. Can't Zelda Nair to Hit/catch the turnip then hit Peach as she Fairs? This is something I would try to do if I faced a Peach as Zelda.

 

[KayLo!]

Can't Zelda Nair to Hit/catch the turnip then hit Peach as she Fairs?

Peach's fair is disjointed enough to beat our nair. It pretty much outranges everything we have...... x.x

 

[JigglyZelda003]

Peach's fair is disjointed enough to beat our nair. It pretty much outranges everything we have...... x.x

and since it ACs all we can do is run from it or take a wild chance on hyphen Usmash.