Are we asking for too many veterans?

[Swagkage]

But Injustice's DLC was premade, and Sakurai has to choose whether or not he wants to work on it.

That doesn't really change the fact that it has the largest amount of DLC characters in a fighting game like ever. Most games are lucky if they get one or two, so expecting Smash 4 to get like a bajillion and a half just because we ask for it isn't realistic.

 

[Serell]

Not sure if pre-made DLC really counts as DLC. It's just cut content behind a paywall...

 

[Duplighost]

Guys...
I think we are asking for too many characters, period. After Lucas is released, wouldn't that leave only two spaces left on the roster for more DLC characters? Unless the character boxes on the character select screen were to be shrunk, there is little to no room to add more fighters.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Edit: And considering Nintendo asked for your gender in the Fighter Ballot, we can infer he will be releasing the highest-demand character from males, and highest-demand character from females. This would fill up the two spaces left on the roster... but this is just a guess.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Guys...
I think we are asking for too many characters, period. After Lucas is released, wouldn't that leave only two spaces left on the roster for more DLC characters? Unless the character boxes on the character select screen were to be shrunk, there is little to no room to add more fighters.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Edit: And considering Nintendo asked for your gender in the Fighter Ballot, we can infer he will be releasing the highest-demand character from males, and highest-demand character from females. This would fill up the two spaces left on the roster... but this is just a guess.

Roy and ryu are lretty much confirmed. That would leave 0 ballot characters. Plus there are the 5 (6?) Placeholder mario files already found that would be replaced by other characters.

Plus there are the character arrows that could be used to open another menu like mii fighters or custom moves. Or shrinking works too.

 

[Duplighost]

Roy and ryu are lretty much confirmed. That would leave 0 ballot characters. Plus there are the 5 (6?) Placeholder mario files already found that would be replaced by other characters.

Plus there are the character arrows that could be used to open another menu like mii fighters or custom moves. Or shrinking works too.

Hmm... if Roy and Ryu were to be confirmed, then what was the point of the Ballot?

If shrinking/adding another page is not executed, then I don't see many more characters coming as DLC.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Hmm... if Roy and Ryu were to be confirmed, then what was the point of the Ballot?

If shrinking/adding another page is not executed, then I don't see many more characters coming as DLC.

I just said there was the dlc menu arrows and shrinking is possible AND that dlc placeholders exist (more than 4).

The hell?

 

[Ura]

Those 6 characters were obviously placeholder files for pre-determined DLC characters. Do you honestly think they would open a ballot when they have all the spots filled up? Think about it for a second people.

Mewtwo, Lucas, Ryu, Roy, Wolf, and Inkling are the most likely the 6 characters that were in the files. The Smash Ballot will introduce a lot of DLC characters in the game so relax everyone.

 

[Duplighost]

I just said there was the dlc menu arrows and shrinking is possible AND that dlc placeholders exist (more than 4).

The hell?

...I know... I was just supporting your claim and agreeing.

Sorry man.

 

[Duplighost]

(My quotes aren't working for some reason, my apologies.)
@ Ura said:

Mewtwo, Lucas, Ryu, Roy, Wolf, and Inkling are the most likely the 6 characters that were in the files.

Do you think King K. Rool has any chance of making it in?
This one's a bit obscure, but what are your thoughts on Medusa (Kid Icarus) making an appearance?

The Smash Ballot will introduce a lot of DLC characters in the game so relax everyone.

Hate to ask so many questions, but over what span of time (if the six characters you stated were to be confirmed) would these fighters be released? Would they be released simultaneously, or over a long span of time?

 

[Wintropy]

The claim that the expectation of more than a certain amount of DLC character is "unrealistic" in Smash is silly. Smash is not, nor has it ever been, a traditional fighting game: few fighting games have a base roster of 50+ characters, nor can they claim to have the immense potential for additional content that Smash can.

Sakurai's said himself that DLC is about pleasing the fans, and Nintendo have opted to let fans vote for who they want to see in Smash. All of that should suggest that Sakurai is serious about DLC going all-out to make fans happy: if the fans want there to be ten more characters, then let them support that. At the end of the day, saying something is "unrealistic" or "not gonna happen" is absurd. Nintendo decides if DLC is going to happen, Sakurai gets to commit to it to the extent that he feels is appropriate - we just have to help him out by lending our voices and ensuring this game is the best Smash game yet.

 

[Ura]

(My quotes aren't working for some reason, my apologies.)
@ Ura said:

Do you think King K. Rool has any chance of making it in?
This one's a bit obscure, but what are your thoughts on Medusa (Kid Icarus) making an appearance?

Hate to ask so many questions, but over what span of time (if the six characters you stated were to be confirmed) would these fighters be released? Would they be released simultaneously, or over a long span of time?

Well yeah I guess, he's really popular so him in the ballot is a given. IDK who Medusa is.

I don't have insider info man lol. I know as much as you do. My guess is that they'll be released in the in the Summer/Fall before the Ballot ends. Once 2016 comes, we'll get a wave of characters that were voted on in the ballot (my prediction).

 

[POKEMANSPIKA]

Well yeah I guess, he's really popular so him in the ballot is a given. IDK who Medusa is.

I don't have insider info man lol. I know as much as you do. My guess is that they'll be released in the in the Summer/Fall before the Ballot ends. Once 2016 comes, we'll get a wave of characters that were voted on in the ballot (my prediction).

Medusa is a great character from the Kid Icarus series. She was the main boss in the first while in Uprising just being a boss. She has a lot of personality and personally would be the only other Kid Icarus character I would want.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Well yeah I guess, he's really popular so him in the ballot is a given. IDK who Medusa is.

I don't have insider info man lol. I know as much as you do. My guess is that they'll be released in the in the Summer/Fall before the Ballot ends. Once 2016 comes, we'll get a wave of characters that were voted on in the ballot (my prediction).

Medusa
final boss of first kid icarus. Teturns in uprising after being absent for a game. Replaced by hades and viridi (mostly hades) as the big bad for the game. Based on greek mythology's medusa the gorgon.

Medusa is a great character from the Kid Icarus series. She was the main boss in the first while in Uprising just being a boss. She has a lot of personality and personally would be the only other Kid Icarus character I would want.

viridi though

 

[Ura]

I haven't played any of the KI games before so excuse my lack of knowledge lol.

I wouldn't mind a new character from that series in the ballot. Also want to see DP decloned from Pit even if it's something really minor.

 

[Artmastercorey]

Me personally I dont really want more old characters back, especially the clone-like ones. I would prefer new characters with new moves, to give more of a new-like experience rather than a refurbished one. It just seems like a waste of an opportunity.

 

[DarkBlueSpark]

No such thing as asking for too many DLC characters in general

Seriously though, nah. Imo, veterans shouldn't be cut, clone or not.

 

[XenothiumX]

Yes, we are asking for too many vets. I don't want to pay to put a character back in the game. I'd rather pay for new characters with original movesets!

Lucario was my main in Brawl. To be honest, I was actually expecting him to be cut in this game, but I wasn't panicking about it because I was willing to accept it. Even if Lucario was cut I wouldn't be asking for him back. I think everyone should just get over losing their characters. Everyone cut in this game I felt was expandable anyways.

 

[MagnesD3]

No. Wolf, Ice Climbers and Snake need to come home.

 

[Chris_Skorniak]

No because everyone has the right to have their main back. I for one am a Roy main and hope to god he gets his PM treatment but even if he doesn't he will insanely outshine Marth for once. Wolf honestly I don't see a point since customs have wolfs moves but hey I don't have to buy him if I don't want to. That's the thing. Who cares who gets in you know? Awesome if your main comes back. There will always be the kind of people who say Roy's just another Marth or Wolf is a fox clone. They don't have to buy wolf or Roy. I don't see a point to half the newcomer dlc threads like king k tool and shovel knight. But I'm not gonna say they have no chance if someone asks I'd say I don't want them but cool if they make it. I don't have to buy things I don't like if I don't want them. Even though I'd probably buy all the character dlc anyways.

 

[Spatman]

Wanting pretty much every veteran except Pichu and Young Link back is perfectly justified. (We've got Toon Link already and there really isn't any reason to play Pichu over Pikachu)

so also wanting back Roy is totally injustified

also more than YL and Pichu, who have only another very similar character in the roster

Wolf honestly I don't see a point since customs have wolfs moves but hey I don't have to buy him if I don't want to.

tilts and smashes and stats..?

 

[Enderwoman]

so also wanting back Roy is totally injustified

also more than YL and Pichu, who have only another very similar character in the roster

But Roy carries several differences from Marth, but Pichu does not.

 

[Diddy Kong]

But Roy carries several differences from Marth, but Pichu does not.

Animation-wise, Pichu has at least one attack that differenciates him from Pikachu: the Up Smash. Roy's moves are literally all the same looking as Marth's, but with a fire effect. Only Ganondorf had more unique moves in Melee, with his Jab and Forward Air.

 

[Enderwoman]

Animation-wise, Pichu has at least one attack that differenciates him from Pikachu: the Up Smash. Roy's moves are literally all the same looking as Marth's, but with a fire effect. Only Ganondorf had more unique moves in Melee, with his Jab and Forward Air.

But for the most part Roys attacks function differently because the sweetspot is near the base of the blade. But the biggest difference attack wise I can recall with Pichu is his up smash and that his down b hits multiple times.

 

[Diddy Kong]

But for the most part Roys attacks function differently because the sweetspot is near the base of the blade. But the biggest difference attack wise I can recall with Pichu is his up smash and that his down b hits multiple times.

His Side B also charges longer and is much stronger than Pikachu's. But yeah, otherwise he's just like Pikachu but with less range and knockback basically.

 

[FalKoopa]

But for the most part Roys attacks function differently because the sweetspot is near the base of the blade. But the biggest difference attack wise I can recall with Pichu is his up smash and that his down b hits multiple times.

Pichu's Skull Bash is jaw-droppingly powerful compared to Pikachu's.

Melee clones didn't have whole lot of different animations, only different visual effects (Roy's fire and Ganondorf's darkness) and properties (knockback and angle).

 

[TheAnvil]

Well.
The question of "are we asking for too many veterans" is a bit tricky to answer since that's a question directed at everyone in the Smash community.

Now, for the sake of answering the question, let's just say that everyone was asking for all nine of the vets listed in the first two posts here. In that case, yes, we would be asking for too many vets. Nine entire veteran DLC characters would be ridiculous, and at that point there'd almost be no hope at all for any newcomers because people would already be shelling out like $30-$40 for all of the game's DLC characters.

The thing is, nobody expects all nine of those characters to be released as DLC for the reasons I gave above. Most people, both in and out of this forum, seem to want anywhere from one to three (not counting Lucas and Mewtwo of course) veteran characters, and that's honestly not that big of an issue.

What is an issue is when people ask to see four or more separate from Mewtwo and Lucas, because at that point six DLC spots will have been reserved for DLC characters alone, and that's more characters than a lot of fighting games get as DLC.

Like at all.

Injustice had six DLC characters: Zod, Martian Manhunter, Batgirl, Scorpion, Lobo and Zatanna, and that's probably the largest amount of non pre-order bonus DLC characters I've ever seen in a fighting game. MKX has 5 announced DLC characters, but that's another rare scenario and likely has to do with the fact that MKX is, like Injustice, published by Warner Bros.

If we end up with any more than three additional veterans as DLC, then it'd be a miracle for us to see one or two DLC newcomers. Some people in the community are saying things like "nah I only want Wolf, Snake, Roy, Pichu, and Young Link, and I'd also like to see like 3 newcomer characters show up as well!"

Stuff like that is unrealistic. I'll take one more vet as long as I can be assured that we get some newcomers to change up the meta a bit since that's always nice. I'll say I want Snake as my vet SOLELY because I want to be able to have Rules of Nature in the soundtrack, and as for newcomers, the fact that the ballot exists is evidence enough that there are PLENTY of newcomer opportunities. Waluigi, Metal Sonic, Black Shadow, Banjo, Ryu, Simon Belmont, et cetera et cetera. I'd hope to see some of them make it into the game instead of seeing a whole bunch of characters I've already played as, although I definitely would like it if they could somehow introduce a bunch of newcomers while still making as many vets as possible DLC.

You can't compare Smash to any other fighting game. Much less one thats geared up to bleed the consumer dry.

 

[Spatman]

But Roy carries several differences from Marth, but Pichu does not.

but we already have marth AND lucina
and only pikachu, not also raichu

moreover... pichu could be funny to play as and handicap character. During melee days it was a waste because the roster contained only 25 characters. But with more than 50 characters and DLCs possibilities, Smash4 CAN "waste" a slot for this.

But actually I'd prefer a pichu with many flaws, but also some strong points different from pikachu's ones (for example some high risk-high reward comboes with a different functionality from pikachu's ones)

 

[Artmastercorey]

Again I hope that Sakurai doesnt waste any remaining slots when he could potentially make use of the limited rostercount effectively to bring new experiences to players over refurbished ones. Like dark pit to me is considered a wasted opportunity, a refurbished experience. I think creating new fun experiences like villager, megaman, bowser jr. is more appealing/rewarding than to fill up the remaining roster with old characters for the sake of fan service nostalgia.

I understand wanting to play your old favorites but I think ultimately its better to try something new, to look forward rather than look back.

 

[BluePikmin11]

Given the quality of the Mario Kart DLC, I'm willing to bet that Sakurai can go beyond 10+ characters, there's probably lots more room for DLC newcomers even after he adds all the veterans.

 

[Swagkage]

You can't compare Smash to any other fighting game. Much less one thats geared up to bleed the consumer dry.

Well, alright. Perhaps my point wasn't exactly clear there, and that's my bad.
I'm not trying to say that because Injustice and Smash are both fighting games that they'll end up with the same amount of DLC characters or anything that black and white because that's a bit silly. What I was attempting to say was that, as you pointed out, Injustice was geared to bleed the consumer dry. Warner Bros. published the game and Warner Bros. is the same level of greedy as Ubisoft/EA.

Now, the point of establishing that was to say that a fighting game getting SIX DLC characters is almost unheard of, and it has only happened in the case of a game like Injustice where the game was pretty much a vector for DLC. I was saying that Nintendo has a much better track record with DLC than a publisher like WB does and that their track record suggests they won't sell 6+ separate pieces of DLC for their game because of the fact that doing so means they're asking the customer to pay the base price of the game plus and additional $24+ for the rest of the content that they don't have. I just can't see Nintendo doing something like that, which is why I said that it's REALLY unlikely we'll see a bunch of veterans AND a bunch of newcomers as DLC.

 

[TheAnvil]

Well, alright. Perhaps my point wasn't exactly clear there, and that's my bad.
I'm not trying to say that because Injustice and Smash are both fighting games that they'll end up with the same amount of DLC characters or anything that black and white because that's a bit silly. What I was attempting to say was that, as you pointed out, Injustice was geared to bleed the consumer dry. Warner Bros. published the game and Warner Bros. is the same level of greedy as Ubisoft/EA.

Now, the point of establishing that was to say that a fighting game getting SIX DLC characters is almost unheard of, and it has only happened in the case of a game like Injustice where the game was pretty much a vector for DLC. I was saying that Nintendo has a much better track record with DLC than a publisher like WB does and that their track record suggests they won't sell 6+ separate pieces of DLC for their game because of the fact that doing so means they're asking the customer to pay the base price of the game plus and additional $24+ for the rest of the content that they don't have. I just can't see Nintendo doing something like that, which is why I said that it's REALLY unlikely we'll see a bunch of veterans AND a bunch of newcomers as DLC.

I get what you're saying, but I don't think it really holds any merit.

#1 We've already as good as got 5 DLC characters confirmed after Mewtwo because of the Mario placeholder files (and Ryu and Roy). And this is assumably before ballot characters are chosen.
#2 Nintendo's track record for DLC is all that really matters. And we only have 2 major examples of this, that being Mario Kart, and Hyrule Warriors. Both offered extensive DLC programs with a LOT of additional content. To put it into context, Mario Kart added an additional 50% of the base game worth of content so far. Whether we get more or not isn't really relevant to this though.
#3 Sakurai has in so many words said he's going all in with DLC. I believe due to his stance on cuts (he hates cutting characters) and that he said no character had been cut yet in an interview he gave in late 2013, that he could very easily finish up all the cuts and release those as DLC. He's stressed this DLC is for the fans, and the fans want their characters back. The fact that 3/4 of the current (basically confirmed) DLC characters are veterans seems to support this theory.
#4 I personally don't think we're going to get many newcomers.

Not that this matters, but I want to point out that if you're talking about other fighting games UMvC3 added 12 characters. And it was confirmed that all of those characters were to be DLC if not for the Earthquake disaster that changed their schedule. I also believe that SFxT had 14 including Pac Man and BBA MegaMan.

 

[Altais]

Since it will probably be easier to remake a veteran than create a newcomer, I won't be surprised if most of the downloadable fighters turn out to be veterans.

Among the characters listed in the original post, the two I won't be surprised to see returning are Wolf and Young Link--if nothing else, for business reasons. I'm still taking the Roy leak with a grain of salt. Since we already have six Pokemon characters now, I don't expect Pichu, Ivysaur, or Squirtle to return. The only way I see the Ice Climbers returning is if they manage to make them work on the New Nintendo 3DS.

 

[Cress!]

No, I mained Lucas. I know the feeling. ;_;

 

[Swagkage]

I get what you're saying, but I don't think it really holds any merit.

#1 We've already as good as got 5 DLC characters confirmed after Mewtwo because of the Mario placeholder files (and Ryu and Roy). And this is assumably before ballot characters are chosen.
#2 Nintendo's track record for DLC is all that really matters. And we only have 2 major examples of this, that being Mario Kart, and Hyrule Warriors. Both offered extensive DLC programs with a LOT of additional content. To put it into context, Mario Kart added an additional 50% of the base game worth of content so far. Whether we get more or not isn't really relevant to this though.
#3 Sakurai has in so many words said he's going all in with DLC. I believe due to his stance on cuts (he hates cutting characters) and that he said no character had been cut yet in an interview he gave in late 2013, that he could very easily finish up all the cuts and release those as DLC. He's stressed this DLC is for the fans, and the fans want their characters back. The fact that 3/4 of the current (basically confirmed) DLC characters are veterans seems to support this theory.
#4 I personally don't think we're going to get many newcomers.

Not that this matters, but I want to point out that if you're talking about other fighting games UMvC3 added 12 characters. And it was confirmed that all of those characters were to be DLC if not for the Earthquake disaster that changed their schedule. I also believe that SFxT had 14 including Pac Man and BBA MegaMan.

Well alright, I've recently seen a lot of people mention the whole "Sakurai is going all out with DLC" bit and I wasn't aware of that. That does change things a bit, since in that case it's just a case of me picking who I do and don't want to buy. If Sakurai really does decide to make an insane amount of DLC characters, that would be pretty awesome. So I'll keep my eyes and ears open for news like that and hope for the best. More characters isn't a bad thing in any sense since DLC is obviously optional, so it'll be cool if we see something ridiculous like the 12-14 Capcom released. If that is what ends up happening, then the answer to this question is 'no' since we don't really have a cap for the number of characters we could see as DLC.

So I'll be a little more hopeful and optimistic about the whole thing

 

[Marakatu]

Yes.
People are asking for Pichu, for God's sake.
Pichu.
Freaking Pichu. The pokémon you breed just to have it in the pokédex and then release or keep in a box forever.

 

[TheAnvil]

Yes.
People are asking for Pichu, for God's sake.
Pichu.
Freaking Pichu. The pokémon you breed just to have it in the pokédex and then release or keep in a box forever.

Pichu is awesome and you love him. You can't not love him.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Pichu is awesome and you love him. You can't not love him.

Pichu is love, Pichu is life.

 

[Ura]

Pichu > Ridley, Chrom, Rayman, Banjo, and Shovel Knight combined.

 

[TheAnvil]

Pichu > Ridley, Chrom, Rayman, Banjo, and Shovel Knight combined.

 

[Tino]

As long as Wolf and Snake make it back. I don't care about the rest.