Attention Fox Boards: Snake ***** Fox

[NJzFinest]

How witty. Walking for spacing...?

You play Snake, right? LOL
"Walk + Ftilt FTW" is a pretty common line.

A pro player isn't always right. He said that ages ago.

Pro player, and one of the best Snake players
And again, what does you word mean against his Mr.Nobody???


...? hmm...

Even if he's said it ages ago (which is kinda false), the metagame for Brawl hasn't changed at all since then.

- Falco is a much better character than Fox

Which is irrelevant for character matchup discussion >_<

- Falco can actually camp
- Falcos laser is actually useful

Says the person who stated "you can just duck under lasers" :/

- Falco can actually deal dmg (lol CG)

And how can't Fox? Dair, Uptilt, Fair, lasers, and good ways for refreshing diminished moves + a fat opponent = damage

- Falco can actually edgeguard

His edgeguarding isn't too much better then Foxes, I mean... Fox's bair actually kills. More and more Snakes are catching onto the "mindgame" Dair from Falco players.

Also, shield drop to dash upsmash > anything Falco can do to KO snake besides "gimping".

...O...K?

...do you really think Snake is as agile as Fox? Press the jump button LOL.

Yeah, I avoid it usually

Good, I hope you do lol, because your posts on the page before this were pretty "lol-able". At least you made an effort to elaborate here, thanks ^_^

 

[ZodiakLucien]

Also, skimming the thread, I think some people mentioned Lucien? Kel, Champ, and Gamble are much more consistent, place well, and are actually good with Fox.

saying that again? You have no evidence of that at all, I have no idea why you hate me so much.

 

[M@v]

saying That Again? You Have No Evidence Of That At All, I Have No Idea Why You Hate Me So Much.

O SnApZ here he comes. =O


But yeah, I love all the talk flying around here, yet the LACK OF PROOF.

>_>. And Im sure people will agree with me. I have only seen a couple people consisitently back themselves up with facts in this thread.

 

[-Mars-]

saying that again? You have no evidence of that at all, I have no idea why you hate me so much.

Lucien, what is your personal feeling on the matchup since you have first hand experience?

 

[KheldarVII]

saying that again? You have no evidence of that at all, I have no idea why you hate me so much.

OMGz LUCIEN, WE LUV YOU LUCIEN!!!

*holds up a big ACME sign with a heart on it*

 

[M@v]

OMGz LUCIEN, WE LUV YOU LUCIEN!!!

*holds up a big ACME sign with a heart on it*

>___________>

 

[KheldarVII]

>___________>

OMGz it's Pgh-M@v-Pgh!! OMFGZ WE.... oh it's Lucien! OMGZ WE LUV YOU LUCIEN!!

*starts dancing and igniting fireworks*

 

[Irsic]

This threat is hilarious.

Quite obvious that Gheb hasn't even played a Fox player before? I can't even take you seriously your first post is so pathetic.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

^ Nice contribution
I should have expected nothing else ...

@NJZs

Actuall, the Metagame has indeed changed a lot between Corts statement and now: Metaknight is the best character now. This means more than you might think...

Also, just because he's a pro doesn't mean he's right by default. M2K says lots of stuf too but that doesn't mean he's right either. Being a good player doesn't give you right per se

 

[Steel]

This thread.. wreaks.. ACCURACY!!

 

[Brinzy]

I love how whenever I see Emblem Lord, I can count on at least two users to be right behind him... not that it matters anyway...

I kinda feel bad for Fox. His match-ups (currently) look terrible... then again, I guess he still has his reign elsewhere...

 

[NJzFinest]

Actuall, the Metagame has indeed changed a lot between Corts statement and now: Metaknight is the best character now. This means more than you might think...

Metaknight was the best character back then and for the same exact reasons. I kinda lurk the backroom, so "I know what's up" lol.

Also, just because he's a pro doesn't mean he's right by default. M2K says lots of stuf too but that doesn't mean he's right either. Being a good player doesn't give you right per se

Once again, he's one of the best Snake players. I'll take his word easily over yours. You can say professionals may "not always be right" but they're at least expected to "be right" almost all of the time.

 

[M@v]

I love how whenever I see Emblem Lord, I can count on at least two users to be right behind him... not that it matters anyway...

I kinda feel bad for Fox. His match-ups (currently) look terrible... then again, I guess he still has his reign elsewhere...

We havent covered a lot of his good ones. But he probably has more bad than good.

 

[-Mars-]

We havent covered a lot of his good ones. But he probably has more bad than good.

Lol, of course most of the higher tier matchups aren't going to be in his favor, Brawl is so stacked at the top. Doesn't mean that he can't have some decent matchups against a few of them though.

 

[PhilMcCloud17]

Who uses the laser to do actual damage........?????? We only do it to get the opp to approach.

 

[M@v]

Lol, of course most of the higher tier matchups aren't going to be in his favor, Brawl is so stacked at the top. Doesn't mean that he can't have some decent matchups against a few of them though.

Fox's top tier matchups imo:

MK-3:7
Snake:5:5
DDD-5:5
Falco-4:6
R.O.B-5:5
G&W-3:7

He does ok against 3, and gets owned by 3.

And not counting MK, G&W does good against all my tourney characters(Fox, Falco, Zelda/sheik, Lucario)
So yeah I dont like him. At all.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

50:50 vs ROB?

 

[-Mars-]

50:50 vs ROB?

Why not...... ROB can't camp, easy as hell to combo, dies early. Seriously what's your problem?

 

[NJzFinest]

Falco vs Fox should be at least 7:3, Falco's favor.

I personally think Fox beats DDD 6:4, that matchup is tooo much fun.

 

[M@v]

50:50 vs ROB?

Once again, You think your mr.know it all. Last time I checked, you dont play fox. Anyway, we just finished ROB not too long ago.

-he cant camp you
-Your Fair ***** him. It will almost always finish completely when you connect.
- Almost all of your combos work

Where R.O.B excels is off stage. he is a great edgeguarder. Spotdodge dsmash is annoying, but punishable if the R.O.B becomes predictable and spams it, which is pretty common among lower level/intermediate r.o.b.

The Fact R.O.B cant camp you is HUGE. I have so much trouble on this matchup with Lucario. But i have nowhere near as much with fox.

 

[Zhamy]

I personally think Fox beats DDD 6:4, that matchup is tooo much fun.

Yeah, but it's just too easy for DDD to get a few good hits in, and then Fox just up and dies.

Falco vs Fox should be at least 7:3, Falco's favor.

Perhaps, but not at least 70:30. I will admit Falco's game has changed, though.

 

[-Mars-]

For what it's worth I did some testing and bair trades with Snakes utilt, Foxs' utilt also clashes with Snakes jabs. Fair and uair beat pretty much anything Snake has in the air.

 

[chaos_Leader]

why does this always happen?

Snake is a great character, a really great character, he just has a lot of his strong points neutralized against Fox. That doesn't make Fox the greatest thing since sliced bread, and that doesn't topple Snake's domineering position against anyone else.

Gheb, do yourself a favor and stop digging yourself into a hole looking for dirt to throw. It's getting old.

 

[_X_]

Falco vs Fox should be at least 7:3, Falco's favor.

I personally think Fox beats DDD 6:4, that matchup is tooo much fun.

Nah Fox doesn't get ***** that hard by falco, at all.

 

[RPK]

You know what...We should just make everyone think that Fox is bottom tier. So crappy that he is even below Falcon, and then just go out and **** anyways...I mean, everyone, or most people that comes in here seems to think it so why not..Though thats just because I, personally, love beating people with low/bottom tier characters, or rarely used characters. So yeah...Just turn all match ups into 20:80 in the opponents favor and watch them go wtf when they get beat by Fox.

Cause I mean, Fox is a horrible f***ing character who apparently doesnt have that many kill options, cant combo, has crappy aerial attacks, and is just too **** slow for anything.

 

[Jugz]

You know what...We should just make everyone think that Fox is bottom tier. So crappy that he is even below Falcon, and then just go out and **** anyways...I mean, everyone, or most people that comes in here seems to think it so why not..Though thats just because I, personally, love beating people with low/bottom tier characters, or rarely used characters. So yeah...Just turn all match ups into 20:80 in the opponents favor and watch them go wtf when they get beat by Fox.

Cause I mean, Fox is a horrible f***ing character who apparently doesnt have that many kill options, cant combo, has crappy aerial attacks, and is just too **** slow for anything.

I like the way you think.

 

[chamberlin]

FACT: It's really lame to start threads just to count the number of people who agree with you...

-> Gheb

Snake does probably have a slight advantage, but any good player can find a way to beat anything.

 

[bludhoundz]

Lasers?

Y + B. Then duck. Grenade strip if Fox tries to throw the grenade back.

I don't see how Fox outcamps Snake?

Once you get one grenade near him and he needs to respond, the laser spam stops. This is where the grenade spam begins...

If Snake wants to approach, he's not going to just mortar slide up to you. He's probably going to toss a grenade or two first. While you're busy not getting blown up, he's busy approaching.

Lasers don't force him to approach at all. He can just crouch and do nothing. What's wrong with that? As long as he was quick enough to duck before taking a laser hit, he's not in a losing position. He can also just jump over the lasers.. (hmm.. quite a novel idea.. jumping you say?) and toss a grenade. He might take a laser or two on the way down if he's careless.

Lastly, I don't really see the big deal even if Snake is forced to approach. How does that put him at any kind of disadvantage? Once he's close enough to Fox, lasers can't be spammed. Doing that is just going to get you hit. But at that range, Fox can't do much of anything. Move closer? Eat utilt or ftilt. Back up? Snake walks forward. Shield? lol I'll wait. Take to the air? Probably your best bet. If you try to land near Snake you're going to eat a mortar or a utilt, though. Maybe even get shieldgrabbed, if you attack.

Now I don't think Snake ***** Fox. But it is certainly no better for Fox than a 40:60 disadvantage.

 

[NeverKnowsBest]

Lasers?

Y + B. Then duck. Grenade strip if Fox tries to throw the grenade back.

I don't see how Fox outcamps Snake?

Once you get one grenade near him and he needs to respond, the laser spam stops. This is where the grenade spam begins...

If Snake wants to approach, he's not going to just mortar slide up to you. He's probably going to toss a grenade or two first. While you're busy not getting blown up, he's busy approaching.

Lasers don't force him to approach at all. He can just crouch and do nothing. What's wrong with that? As long as he was quick enough to duck before taking a laser hit, he's not in a losing position. He can also just jump over the lasers.. (hmm.. quite a novel idea.. jumping you say?) and toss a grenade. He might take a laser or two on the way down if he's careless.

Lastly, I don't really see the big deal even if Snake is forced to approach. How does that put him at any kind of disadvantage? Once he's close enough to Fox, lasers can't be spammed. Doing that is just going to get you hit. But at that range, Fox can't do much of anything. Move closer? Eat utilt or ftilt. Back up? Snake walks forward. Shield? lol I'll wait. Take to the air? Probably your best bet. If you try to land near Snake you're going to eat a mortar or a utilt, though. Maybe even get shieldgrabbed, if you attack.

Now I don't think Snake ***** Fox. But it is certainly no better for Fox than a 40:60 disadvantage.

>_<

Have you read any of the posts in this thread? There has been countless response to everything you wrote in your post.

 

[Fenrir VII]

You know what...We should just make everyone think that Fox is bottom tier. So crappy that he is even below Falcon, and then just go out and **** anyways...I mean, everyone, or most people that comes in here seems to think it so why not..Though thats just because I, personally, love beating people with low/bottom tier characters, or rarely used characters. So yeah...Just turn all match ups into 20:80 in the opponents favor and watch them go wtf when they get beat by Fox.

Cause I mean, Fox is a horrible f***ing character who apparently doesnt have that many kill options, cant combo, has crappy aerial attacks, and is just too **** slow for anything.

Yay for win-win situations...

we can either:

a) debate and maybe finally make people understand Fox is a decent char
b) let everybody just think Fox players are incredible.


Gheb is a tool

NJz is pretty much covering everything in here... so I'll leave it right now.

Fox vs Falco is somewhat in Falco's favor until Fox edgeguards, at which point, Fox wins.
DDD is very fun, yes. I beat Seibrik's DDD in a money match last toureny. he placed 3rd at CH4.
I say Snake Fox is very nearly 5-5

I also very much disagree that MK Fox is 3-7 but ohhhhkay I don't want to start that up again.

 

[M@v]

I also very much disagree that MK Fox is 3-7 but ohhhhkay I don't want to start that up again.

just go with it so there is more ammo for the ban Mk movement. xD

 

[bludhoundz]

>_<

Have you read any of the posts in this thread? There has been countless response to everything you wrote in your post.

I read a lot of it.

I didn't read every single post in detail.

I didn't see any argument against my "Snake doesn't have to approach," statement or "he can jump and toss a grenade."

In fact, I posted some of those things because there were no responses to them.

 

[Fenrir VII]

just go with it so there is more ammo for the ban Mk movement. xD

I don't want MK banned. I want everybody and their mom to play MK and think that they're safe.


6/7 vs different MKs in tourney.

 

[Fenrir VII]

I read a lot of it.

I didn't read every single post in detail.

I didn't see any argument against my "Snake doesn't have to approach," statement or "he can jump and toss a grenade."

In fact, I posted some of those things because there were no responses to them.

Because Snake doesn't have to approach doesn't mean that Fox suddenly does. that's a common misconception. not saying you were doing that. I was just making a point.

A jumping thrown grenade gets Snake an usmash...if not more than that due to a dair combo. Snake is kinda scared against Fox if he leaves the ground.

 

[Tenki]

SNAKE DOES NOT DIE OUT OF A GRAB RELEASE ON THE EDGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He can drop a C4 and blow himself back up to the stage / give him another UpB.
Besides, the assumption to get a grab on Snake, while he recovers is already laughable, since every Snake recovers high. The only chance to grab him is if he recovers from close to the stage but Fox has no move to force him into suh a position

kthxbai

I'm just addressing the white part, since the rest is true.

If you grab Snake correctly off the cypher, it'll be an instant 'ground' release, except since he's floating off the edge, it's more like an instant 'fall' release.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wkiCPq0GmLs

mind you, Fiction even says himself that he sucks at Snake, but there are some interesting 'demonstrational' points in that vid.

2:01 - 'correctly' grabbing Snake out of Cypher.
2:36 - ?????? c4

 

[Fenrir VII]

2:36 - ?????? c4

o.o

incredible. I mean, I guess I knew it was possible, but imagine somebody that could consistently footstool that.

 

[bludhoundz]

Because Snake doesn't have to approach doesn't mean that Fox suddenly does. that's a common misconception. not saying you were doing that. I was just making a point.

A jumping thrown grenade gets Snake an usmash...if not more than that due to a dair combo. Snake is kinda scared against Fox if he leaves the ground.

I would only jump throw a grenade if Fox is pretty much spamming his blaster from a distance. If I jump throw a grenade there's no way he can run in and Usmash in that amount of time. If Fox does decide to rush up, then Snake can just fastfall and shield, and he'd be perfectly safe.

 

[Fenrir VII]

I would only jump throw a grenade if Fox is pretty much spamming his blaster from a distance. If I jump throw a grenade there's no way he can run in and Usmash in that amount of time. If Fox does decide to rush up, then Snake can just fastfall and shield, and he'd be perfectly safe.

We're talking about a SHDLing Fox, right? uh...yeah he has the time... and a REALLY safe bet for a punisher is a grab anyway... so *shrug*

If Snake leaves the ground, Fox players should know that's a free grab at the least.

 

[NeverKnowsBest]

We're talking about a SHDLing Fox, right? uh...yeah he has the time... and a REALLY safe bet for a punisher is a grab anyway... so *shrug*

If Snake leaves the ground, Fox players should know that's a free grab at the least.

PWG = sexier.

I think he assumes that the Fox that is using a blaster is a Fox that is just standing still spamming and not like the Fox the rest of us are talking about that is SHDLing.

 

[RPK]

...A free grab? When he leaves the ground? Sorry, man, thats just kind of contradictory...I think you meant uair or upsmash right? >.>