Beefy Smash Doods: How to Mash Quickly!

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With shield being buffed in Smash 4, grabs may just be more powerful than ever. Many of the cast have easy combos and setups from grabs as well as kill throws. Besides from avoiding being grabbed, mashing is the best way to avoid a potential combo or kill. Mashing also helps with escaping out of shield breaks and the buried state. That's why Beefy Smash Doods is here to show the most effective way to mash!

 

This looks like it'll be good, gotta watch it!

 

A great must watch video for all smashers who love to be mashers....................

 

I wonder if this applies to Melee/PM?...if not how differently so?

Good informative video though, definitely adjusting my mashing mindset

 

I wonder if this applies to Melee/PM?...if not how differently so?

Good informative video though, definitely adjusting my mashing mindset

I think a lot of these applied to Brawl, I used this to get out of Ice Climbers grabs if they did grab me if they made a mistake.

So PM it might apply there as well assuming no one changed the coding on that.

For Melee I have no idea.

 

I wonder if this applies to Melee/PM?...if not how differently so?

Good informative video though, definitely adjusting my mashing mindset

I was thinking the same exact thing.

 

I'll be sure to try this.

 

I actually experimented with this and found out a lot of what they said. Not everything, though. This was actually very enlightening. Very helpful. Thanks to the guys at Beefy Smash Doods for their help.

 

This was very informative, and great knowledge for both on stage and off stage mashing. Thanks!

 

So many of these front page articles are very anti-ZSS. #WHEREISTHEANTISHIEKGUIDE

 

dude i never thought wobbling would be so easy

 

Incredibly helpful. Thanks again beefy smash doods!

 

Very insightful video. Will certainly put to the test from now on, thanks Beefy Smash Doods!

 

This hurts my fingers to watch.
But unfortunately my thumb doesn't bend like that to wobble

 

Wait, wait, wait, the shield was buffed in this game?
Seriously, you need a beta reader, because I'm pretty sure shield was nerfed in the game heavily (by a large margin).

Anyways, aside from the above, there is a problem that hadn't been addressed in the video, notably the use of the shield button. There are characters who'll jump out of the way after being grabbed, and people may end up accidentally air dodging, giving the opponent who originally grabbed them an opportunity to punish. This can be avoided simply by not using L, R or Z (unless you use tether grab characters), since they will guarantee an air dodge.

 

Interesting! I myself am guilty as charged of believing that the c-stick helped, but never looked into it too much.
As a speedrunner I'm familliar with something similar to wobbling when scrolling through text. So should be a pretty easy thing to get used to, great video!

 

Finally, I can escape being egg'd by Yoshi off stage. Very helpful!

 

Could swiping potentially damage your controller? It looks more effective than wobbling since you press all four buttons, but I don't want to do it if it damages you controller, and it looks like it might harm your buttons over time.

 

Wait, wait, wait, the shield was buffed in this game?
Seriously, you need a beta reader, because I'm pretty sure shield was nerfed in the game heavily (by a large margin).

Anyways, aside from the above, there is a problem that hadn't been addressed in the video, notably the use of the shield button. There are characters who'll jump out of the way after being grabbed, and people may end up accidentally air dodging, giving the opponent who originally grabbed them an opportunity to punish. This can be avoided simply by not using L, R or Z (unless you use tether grab characters), since they will guarantee an air dodge.

No, shield got a large buff in a Smash 4. They take significantly less shield stun when blocking and an attack and you can do an out of shield option even before the minimum shield frames end. Because of this, and the fast rate shields regen, shielding in Smash 4 is an option that can be used a lot and there's really not a whole lot that can't be punished by just shielding it. Also, they said specifically in the video that pushing the shoulder buttons don't help at all, because the game doesn't register more then one input per frame. So you really shouldn't be pushing L, R or Z anyway.

 

So many of these front page articles are very anti-ZSS. #WHEREISTHEANTISHIEKGUIDE

You don't counter Sheik, so no Anti Sheik guide.

 

I had recently wondered about this.
I had heard people say things like setting all the dpad inputs to other inputs and mashing that as well as buttons was the fastest, but that shouldn't work because they'll likely be the same inputs as your regular buttons... Do taunts count for the mashing? If they do, mashing dpad with the normal setup along with the face buttons could actually help a fair amount.

 

Wait, wait, wait, the shield was buffed in this game?
Seriously, you need a beta reader, because I'm pretty sure shield was nerfed in the game heavily (by a large margin).

The only nerf shields received is that they no longer take reduced damage, which is why it's easier to shield poke with multi-hit moves and why large hits against them are so effective. Overall, though, they were buffed, as shown by Eureka.

It is worth noting that there are more moves than ever that are capable of actually breaking a shield, however, and all get-up attacks do major shield damage, so shield breaks are actually more common in Smash 4 than previous titles. This, along with the aforementioned nerf, is no doubt to accommodate for the improved OOS options & faster regeneration.

 

I had recently wondered about this.
I had heard people say things like setting all the dpad inputs to other inputs and mashing that as well as buttons was the fastest, but that shouldn't work because they'll likely be the same inputs as your regular buttons... Do taunts count for the mashing? If they do, mashing dpad with the normal setup along with the face buttons could actually help a fair amount.

Taunts do not count for mashing as far as I know. You can also set your d pad to different inputs and mash that, but using the control stick, which has 8 inputs, instead of the d pad, which has 4, is probably a better idea. Also you would lose the ability to taunt, and that would be a huge blow to you rmindgaming abilities (and simply inexcusable if you're playing Captain Falcon). Still, I think it should be tested out. I'd test it but I only have the 3DS version.

 

I appreciate the Kevin Macleod jams

 

You don't counter Sheik, so no Anti Sheik guide.

Play shiek

 

No, shield got a large buff in a Smash 4. They take significantly less shield stun when blocking and an attack and you can do an out of shield option even before the minimum shield frames end. Because of this, and the fast rate shields regen, shielding in Smash 4 is an option that can be used a lot and there's really not a whole lot that can't be punished by just shielding it. Also, they said specifically in the video that pushing the shoulder buttons don't help at all, because the game doesn't register more then one input per frame. So you really shouldn't be pushing L, R or Z anyway.

But shields takes more shield damage because the debuff in previous games where shields take reduced % is gone. This is why it is easier to shield break and although shields can regenerate fast, hey still don't take as much of a hit as they used to.

Yes you can still drop them fast like in brawl but dropping on entry short hops is actually weaker because dropping a shield when you aren't hit actually takes a lot longer than it did in past games.

Shields are still good but things were changed to make them weaker in other areas.

 

Does it work like this in Melee?

 

But shields takes more shield damage because the debuff in previous games where shields take reduced % is gone. This is why it is easier to shield break and although shields can regenerate fast, hey still don't take as much of a hit as they used to.

Yes you can still drop them fast like in brawl but dropping on entry short hops is actually weaker because dropping a shield when you aren't hit actually takes a lot longer than it did in past games.

Shields are still good but things were changed to make them weaker in other areas.

Shields are certainly not flawless, but the the reduced shield stun and the ability to do an out of shield option even during the minimum shield frames are such potent abilities that they outweigh what was weakened with shields in Smash 4. And although shields have less health, shield brakes don't happen usually anyway unless the opponent has a shield breaking move. So yes shields were made more fragile but they were also made more powerful, particularly with the reduced shield stun.

 

Shields are certainly not flawless, but the the reduced shield stun and the ability to do an out of shield option even during the minimum shield frames are such potent abilities that they outweigh what was weakened with shields in Smash 4. And although shields have less health, shield brakes don't happen usually anyway unless the opponent has a shield breaking move. So yes shields were made more fragile but they were also made more powerful, particularly with the reduced shield stun.

Actually they have more raw health to them.

The difference is in every past game shields had a % reduction on the damage they would take. Unless it is a shield breaker like move that has properties that allow for that.

Every past smash game had that and Smash 4 is the first to remove this. This is why a lot of non shield breaking moves now suddenly do it now and why Marth's Shield breaker is actually a shield breaker now where as in Brawl it sometimes wouldn't even do that. Lucario's Fsmash with aura in Smash 4 can now break shields at high aura. Bowser's DownB and Kirby's Stone now can break shield with double hits. Charizards Rock Smash now will actually poke shields now.

The removal of that % reduction is a big deal. Along with how shield dropping when you don't get hit apparently has longer dropping than in past games, which is a buff to empty short hops.

Getting hit and acting out of it is still pretty good for most of the cast, which is similar to Brawl.

I think shields overall are weaker compared to brawl, along with many character having kill/combo throws now which is a nerf to shields overall. They are still strong though, I'm with people on that.

 

..........

 

Why not swipe the c-stick when you're swiping buttons though? It's just a centimeter away but it's an extra input to escape grabs in the same amount of time.

 

E Eureka However, you might have to know that the buffs are somewhat minor. In the past, shields couldn't be broken so easily by get-up attacks, but in this game, one wrong placement and your shield is as good as broken (Link's get-up is the best example, since it can hit with more damage and speed than any other character's). And despite their ability to let you act out of them earlier if you are hit without perfect shielding, you're still knocked a considerable range, sometimes as far as being unable to actually get to the opponent on some characters.

Then there's the danger of the shields being able to be pushed back so far that, if they do break by something like Bowser Bomb or Headbutt, the opponent might get sent off the edge of the stage. Then consider that if the shield does break near the ledge, and the opponent is close enough, something like Storm Punch, FLUDD or Guardian Orbiters will do the trick on sending them flying out.

Lastly, shields are very, very unsafe to use if they're on their lowest amount of health, thus prompting players to not try shielding for a while, thus opening them up to more attacks.

And let me give you a list of potential shield breaking moves here that are practical:
Shield Breaker
Pound
Headbutt
Bowser Bomb
Side Smash (Bowser)
Wizard's Foot
Warlock Punch
Warlock Blade
Up Tilt (Ganondorf)
Side Smash (Ganondorf)
Up Smash (Ganondorf)
Down-Side Smash (Little Mac)
Shadow Ball
Side-Smash (Link) - If your shield takes damage beforehand, this is going to end your shield if charged.
Get-Up Attack (Link)
Down Smash (Roy)
Side Smash (Roy)

So there are a lot of bad things about shielding, and there's a firm belief that the nerfs may outweigh the buffs to shield. And don't get me talking about rolling...

 

Actually they have more raw health to them.

The difference is in every past game shields had a % reduction on the damage they would take. Unless it is a shield breaker like move that has properties that allow for that.

Every past smash game had that and Smash 4 is the first to remove this. This is why a lot of non shield breaking moves now suddenly do it now and why Marth's Shield breaker is actually a shield breaker now where as in Brawl it sometimes wouldn't even do that. Lucario's Fsmash with aura in Smash 4 can now break shields at high aura. Bowser's DownB and Kirby's Stone now can break shield with double hits. Charizards Rock Smash now will actually poke shields now.

The removal of that % reduction is a big deal. Along with how shield dropping when you don't get hit apparently has longer dropping than in past games, which is a buff to empty short hops.

Getting hit and acting out of it is still pretty good for most of the cast, which is similar to Brawl.

I think shields overall are weaker compared to brawl, along with many character having kill/combo throws now which is a nerf to shields overall. They are still strong though, I'm with people on that.

I meant they had less effective health because they don't take reduced damage. While shields can be broken easier the thing about shields in Smash 4 is they do what they're meant to do the best, block things. A 19 damage move would do 13 frames of shield stun in Brawl, in Smash 4 it's 7, that's almost half and is really significant. So yeah if you try to shield things like it's Brawl it won't be effective, but utilizing shield properly makes it stronger then in Brawl because you can punish just about everything by blocking it.

E Eureka However, you might have to know that the buffs are somewhat minor. In the past, shields couldn't be broken so easily by get-up attacks, but in this game, one wrong placement and your shield is as good as broken (Link's get-up is the best example, since it can hit with more damage and speed than any other character's). And despite their ability to let you act out of them earlier if you are hit without perfect shielding, you're still knocked a considerable range, sometimes as far as being unable to actually get to the opponent on some characters.

Then there's the danger of the shields being able to be pushed back so far that, if they do break by something like Bowser Bomb or Headbutt, the opponent might get sent off the edge of the stage. Then consider that if the shield does break near the ledge, and the opponent is close enough, something like Storm Punch, FLUDD or Guardian Orbiters will do the trick on sending them flying out.

Lastly, shields are very, very unsafe to use if they're on their lowest amount of health, thus prompting players to not try shielding for a while, thus opening them up to more attacks.

And let me give you a list of potential shield breaking moves here that are practical:
Shield Breaker
Pound
Headbutt
Bowser Bomb
Side Smash (Bowser)
Wizard's Foot
Warlock Punch
Warlock Blade
Up Tilt (Ganondorf)
Side Smash (Ganondorf)
Up Smash (Ganondorf)
Down-Side Smash (Little Mac)
Shadow Ball
Side-Smash (Link) - If your shield takes damage beforehand, this is going to end your shield if charged.
Get-Up Attack (Link)
Down Smash (Roy)
Side Smash (Roy)

So there are a lot of bad things about shielding, and there's a firm belief that the nerfs may outweigh the buffs to shield. And don't get me talking about rolling...

The buffs to to shields were not insignificant, the reduced shield stun is a big deal. Also shield pushback is only a problem on really strong attacks, and those are just laggy enough that you can punish them anyway or just forward air out of shield. And the thing about the majority of moves that do increased shield damages is that they are NOT safe on shield. So if your opponent is keeping their shield healthy and not holding it for no reason (like any good player will) then they just get a free punish. And if you do get a punish then you get to use that time on the offensive to heal any damage your shield might have taken.

So sure, you can throw around pound, headbutt, and side smashes willy-nilly trying to get a shield break, but I really don't think I need to explain why that's a dumb idea. And if your holding a weakened shield at the ledge against a character with a move that does extra shield damage you deserve to lose that stock. And to my knowledge there is no character with both a good shield breaking move and a practical windbox, not including customs.

Also, you listed Ganondorf's up tilt as "practical"... Seriously?

 

So I don't know if anyone else has noticed it, but my friend noticed that if he pressed R while being grabbed it would immediately mash out. As in as quick as possible. I've been able to do it a couple times, but I guess if it does work is that the window for doing it is extremely small, because it usually doesn't work. Still, worth a try, especially at high percents where you would have to mash.

 

I meant they had less effective health because they don't take reduced damage. While shields can be broken easier the thing about shields in Smash 4 is they do what they're meant to do the best, block things. A 19 damage move would do 13 frames of shield stun in Brawl, in Smash 4 it's 7, that's almost half and is really significant. So yeah if you try to shield things like it's Brawl it won't be effective, but utilizing shield properly makes it stronger then in Brawl because you can punish just about everything by blocking it.

This is false.

SSBB is X/3

SSB4 is X/2.56.

Smash 4 actually has more shield stun.

For reference, 64 is (X * 1.62) + 4

Melee is (X + 4.45)/2.235

 

This is false.

SSBB is X/3

SSB4 is X/2.56.

Smash 4 actually has more shield stun.

For reference, 64 is (X * 1.62) + 4

Melee is (X + 4.45)/2.235

Can you show me evidence of this? Because according to this http://smashboards.com/threads/shields-in-smash-4.381183 and everything else I've seen there is less shield stun then in Brawl. I do agree shields are weaker in the whole stupid "I'm just going to stand here and hold shield because I can" aspect from Brawl but just the sheer lack of safety moves have on shield in Smash 4 makes it a more powerful (if less universal) option then in Brawl in my opinion.

 

im pretty sure it was nakats stream but someone was talking about this method..

 

Dat pikachu tho

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-WMza27ajp...AE_Q/LLYFp4yj9FQ/s1600/ermahgerd-kermerks.jpg

 

I meant they had less effective health because they don't take reduced damage. While shields can be broken easier the thing about shields in Smash 4 is they do what they're meant to do the best, block things. A 19 damage move would do 13 frames of shield stun in Brawl, in Smash 4 it's 7, that's almost half and is really significant. So yeah if you try to shield things like it's Brawl it won't be effective, but utilizing shield properly makes it stronger then in Brawl because you can punish just about everything by blocking it.


The buffs to to shields were not insignificant, the reduced shield stun is a big deal. Also shield pushback is only a problem on really strong attacks, and those are just laggy enough that you can punish them anyway or just forward air out of shield. And the thing about the majority of moves that do increased shield damages is that they are NOT safe on shield. So if your opponent is keeping their shield healthy and not holding it for no reason (like any good player will) then they just get a free punish. And if you do get a punish then you get to use that time on the offensive to heal any damage your shield might have taken.

So sure, you can throw around pound, headbutt, and side smashes willy-nilly trying to get a shield break, but I really don't think I need to explain why that's a dumb idea. And if your holding a weakened shield at the ledge against a character with a move that does extra shield damage you deserve to lose that stock. And to my knowledge there is no character with both a good shield breaking move and a practical windbox, not including customs.

Also, you listed Ganondorf's up tilt as "practical"... Seriously?

Baits, mind games and timing. It's practical on opponents coming from the air that don't have enough reach, and often have to rely on shields once they land, or risk being hit by the attack. Air dodging doesn't work either, that attack has a somewhat lingering hitbox. Still going to hit when you land.

And Pound is actually a good attack to throw around, especially when you can use Jiggly's jab to pressure shielding and end it off with a Pound. It takes quite a bit more shield damage off the opponent and could lead into a shield breaker. It's just as decent as using DK's Headbutt after pressuring the opponent's shield (since Headbutt destroys almost the entire shield).

Also, going on the offensive might also not be a good strategy on characters with worse shields, as their opponents might do the same and hit hard.

 

Baits, mind games and timing. It's practical on opponents coming from the air that don't have enough reach, and often have to rely on shields once they land, or risk being hit by the attack. Air dodging doesn't work either, that attack has a somewhat lingering hitbox. Still going to hit when you land.

And Pound is actually a good attack to throw around, especially when you can use Jiggly's jab to pressure shielding and end it off with a Pound. It takes quite a bit more shield damage off the opponent and could lead into a shield breaker. It's just as decent as using DK's Headbutt after pressuring the opponent's shield (since Headbutt destroys almost the entire shield).

Also, going on the offensive might also not be a good strategy on characters with worse shields, as their opponents might do the same and hit hard.

No. Sorry, just... No.
In the scenario your talking about there are three potential outcomes.

1. They go behind you by double jumping, rolling, or just holding forward and charged f smash you because you're charging a Ganondorf up tilt.
2. They smack you in the face with an aerial because you're charging a Ganondorf up tilt.
3. In some hilariously specific situation where they can't do 1 or 2 they stop or back out of range because you're charging a ****ing Ganondorf up tilt.

No one will ever try to shield up tilt unless they are blind, ignorant, stupid, or all three. 90% of the time they'll just roll or jump behind you and charge an f smash.

And you can't throw around pound because it is not safe on shield. While it does do more shield damage it won't break even a moderetly healthy shield. If you do block pound that's a free shield grab or up smash out of shield. This is the problem for the majority of high shield damage moves, as they are extremely punishable if the opponents shield doesn't break. And some of the moves you mentioned like Warlock Punch (lol) and Bowser Bomb are so absurdly laggy to start up they can just be dodged through other methods even though they can break shields in one hit.

And of course you want to go on the offensive with a low shield. You don't try to use shield when you have the advantage. It would be stupid to try to play a defensive game with a weak shield anyway. If I were to block something like pound or headbutt then I'm either going to throw them into a combo, toss them up and start juggling them, up smash them and start juggling them, or toss them offstage and start an edgegaurd. All those situations give a shield plenty of time to recharge. And all the aerial shield breaking moves are extremely obvious to dodge and are punishable.