Investigation - Your character's hardest Match Up?

[Crystanium]

Clunky Samus does not perform admirably against a lot of characters, but I must agree that Olimar is a little bag of perturbation.

 

[Hive]

Olimar is def hard I would still go with mk though. Mk is really strong v. samus in almost every gameplay area and it gets worse when the mk actually takes the match half seriously and uses his planking/nado potential, and Olimar is at least decently killable off ledge I feel like, and bthrow to dair can be occasionally effective. Not that there is much difference, your losing either way, but just preference I suppose. I would much rather lose to olimar than mk.

 

[PokemonMasterIRL]

Squirtle and Charizard **** Samus.

ANd Ivysaur really ***** Samoose.

 

[Hive]

lol ivysaur. :D

 

[Crystanium]

Squirtle and Charizard **** Samus.

ANd Ivysaur really ***** Samoose.

That's not what Ivysaur said when I was finished with it. It told me, "I vewwy sore."

 

[PokemonMasterIRL]

well EggM's fox *****.

 

[KillerJawz]

I'm actually inclined to change my vote here. I've been studying and playing the Olimar matchup recently and I think that he might not be as hard as MK... That being said however, I have yet to play an MK who makes me cry so :/....

Also does Char really **** Samus? ;o. Seriously didn't know that.

 

[Hive]

Charizard doesn't **** samus lol, but I'd say its pretty underrated too, its pretty close to even if not a slight advantage either way. Samus is really good at spacing and getting up dmg on charizard onstage, and avoiding his powerful close range attacks (especially his rock attack), and fairly decent gimping him with ledge immunities or dair, but charizard has great survivability (like 160 before kos), a great anti ledge game (top tier imo) with grabs and his flamethrower that make it hard to do anything except zair under the stage, good grab options and ability to use it to approach, and his up b invincibility and glide make him less gimpable then people expect.

Squirtle on the other hand probably does **** samus.

 

[KillerJawz]

Would you say that Charizard's fair plays a major role in his anti ledge game? Against Samus at least?

 

[Hive]

well... his fair is a really kwl move in general and anti ledge too, and I've seen it used before well too, but basically his flamethrower outprioritizes it usually if I remember right... its been awhile if they position it right it will continually hit your ledge position or right above it and you can't really do anything above ledge anyhow where the fair hitbox usually is, plus it diminishes samus' ledge options and makes her ledge approaches a lot more predictable.

 

[Throwback]

Hive I imagine fair/uair from under the stage would hit charizard without being exposed to flamethrower (ie, through the stage).

 

[Crystanium]

Hive I imagine fair/uair from under the stage would hit charizard without being exposed to flamethrower (ie, through the stage).

Yeah, it could work like that, although just using the Screw Attack constantly will avoid taking the hit from Charizard's flamethrower.

 

[Hive]

I can't remember if charizard positions himself right if he will be in range of uair and fair from underneath the ledge on like battlefield.. my gut wants to tell me he is actually out of range or he can actually hit you somehow, but its been awhile and I honestly don't remember. Or at least far enough out of range that fair ends up doing only slight damage that ends up being similar to the amount zair dmg anyways. uair from underneath is def my fave when enemies are close enough, but I think the flamethrower actually outextends it on most maps, and a lot of times I think you may use fair or uair underneath the stage and it ends up scraping charizard and then he just uses the recovery time to reposition himself in a better place or be on the watchout for it. Screw attack to ledge is of course effective and you should totally be doing it while he is using it and you aren't acting since he can hit you on the ledge but it is a stalling technique and doesn't really help you to get out of the position except to wait til the flames are weaker, a lot of zards will use the predictability of the stalling to refresh the flamethrower though.

 

[Pokemon Trainer1]

Wow, how could you say Olimar? Samus is the second best projectilist in the game, so someone with reflctors is obviously going to be more effective. Zelda, Fox, Falco, Wolf, Pit (especially), Mario, and even Lucas and Ness. But Olimar?

 

[KillerJawz]

You have no idea what you're talking about. Falco is far better with his projectiles, as is Olimar. We beat Zelda, go pretty much even with Pit, Ness and Lucas and only Falco ***** us. However, Olimar completely outclasses us, Falco does not.

 

[DtJ Composer]

Who needs a reflector when you can beat projectiles by having YOUR projectile attached to someone?

There's not even timing involved like with reflectors!

 

[-Crews-]

Allow me to add lucario to the list. I(as of recently) personally find a good lucario quite challenging to face as samus. She can easily rack up the damage, which is usually good, but I can never seem to quickly kill lucario. I feel like I'm helping him by adding damage half the time. And his spot dodge to utilt can just go eff itself. Negro can't even land a smash or dtilt in most of the time.

 

[Rohins]

I vote MK.

 

[Dragonmaster_Omega]

I personally fight a pretty decent Lucario and don't find him truely annoying until he gets to the upper 150's, which he WILL most of the time, becuase this is when he gets REALLY dangerous. His Nair, AS, dair, utilt, fsmash, dsmash, usmash....hell, almost ALL his moves become kill moves >.<

 

[Karcist]

Wow, how could you say Olimar? Samus is the second best projectilist in the game, so someone with reflctors is obviously going to be more effective. Zelda, Fox, Falco, Wolf, Pit (especially), Mario, and even Lucas and Ness. But Olimar?

Falco

10falcos

 

[Hive]

Ledge planking is the only reason I don't think Falco is as hard as MK. It also makes it the most boring matchup in samus existence.

 

[Crystanium]

Wow, how could you say Olimar? Samus is the second best projectilist in the game, so someone with reflctors is obviously going to be more effective. Zelda, Fox, Falco, Wolf, Pit (especially), Mario, and even Lucas and Ness. But Olimar?

I hope you're not basing that off of how much projectiles Samus has. Falco is the best, and I'm not sure who is second. But I know Samus isn't. Her projectiles can be stopped with ease. Not only that, but they're not really all that efficient in fire rate.

 

[IYM!]

Samus is good at quantity, but not at quality

 

[Crystanium]

Samus is good at quantity, but not at quality

Efficiency, actually. Ignoring the Missiles and Super Missiles, let's check the Charge Shot.

• Can be stopped by reflectors, including Ness' bat and Lucas' stick.
• Can be stopped by absorption.
• Can be stopped by solid projectiles.
• Can be countered.

This means that the Charge Shot can be stopped by Falco, Fox, Ice Climbers, Ike, King Dedede, Lucario, Lucas, Mario, Marth, Mr. Game & Watch, Ness, Olimar, Peach, Pit, Snake, Wolf, and Zelda.

That is over half the roster.

 

[KillerJawz]

Bowser can also stop it with Fortress and Jab. Luigi and Jiggs can stop ti with their nairs. The list goes on and on and on.

 

[DtJ Composer]

Pikmin being ON you stops projectiles.

They don't even have to be in the air mang.
Also i think Snake can tilt missiles lol

 

[IsmaR]

tl;dr - Samus is better off throwing tomatoes at her enemies. They might be slightly more useful than peanuts.

 

[DtJ Composer]

tl;dr - Samus is better off throwing tomatoes at her enemies.

It worked for Toejam and Earl so it must work for all interstellar heroes.

 

[IYM!]

This means that the Charge Shot can be stopped by Falco, Fox, Ice Climbers, Ike, King Dedede, Lucario, Lucas, Mario, Marth, Mr. Game & Watch, Ness, Olimar, Peach, Pit, Snake, Wolf, and Zelda.

That is over half the roster.

you forgot mention to Link and Toon Link, they can stop the CS with his shield, they only need kee stand and done, also the bombs can do the job

 

[Jalen]

I'd say lolimar.
:l

 

[IYM!]

loli ? jajaja, sorry is a joke here in Chile, jajaja


Olimar is too dificult for Samus, but gimp him is easy, even with Link, so we have hope.


What abot MK? What reai adventages we have agains him?

 

[KillerJawz]

Uair beats nado, zair can beat nado, he's light... I'm sure there are others, I'm just nothing thinking very hard atm.

 

[IYM!]

what means atm?

 

[KillerJawz]

At the moment.

 

[Hive]

zair doesn't beat his nado at normal spam distances, (the same with uair too pretty sure). Meaning you have to preemptively use it to counter any nados, assuming mk uses nado in situations where that is even practical given timing, distance, etc.... And doing these preemptively put you in a vulnerable state when you guess wrongly, which mks will exploit. Samus having legitimate counters to nado is a myth imo (in terms of realistic dmg tradeoffs even with "counters"). Nado decimates samus' almost entire moveset capabilities in the time she has to react to it, except like fully charged charge shot if you are lucky enough to have it. Shield is really the only option using shield tilts and spot dodge if you get the full nado and even then you are left vulnerable afterwards. Nado against samus' ledge game sucks too as mks who nado on and off from the ledge not only block samus from getting back on stage but also eat through her entire ledge game at that position, and nado is one of the best moves for getting past samus' spam walls on stage as well as other strengths of mk making onstage gameplay revolve around close range encounters which bode bad for samus.

 

[KillerJawz]

Zair beats nado at the top. Uair beats nado from the sides and bottom.

 

[Hive]

right, I'm saying that you'd usually need to preemptively use those in order to beat it. zair doesn't hit it ats its normal spam height, you have to pretty much set it up to hit nado before he even initiates the move.

 

[Darkshadow7827]

In my experience, Falco, D3, MK. I haven't really played a serious olimar main, so I can't judge.

I find falco hard due to lazers and Samus's being tall. While someone mentioned ledge planking, I typically don't plank in friendlies & half the time the falco usually has a stock up on me. I find it annoying have falco chase me in the air as I personally don't know what options to use -- air dodge to avoid uairs and bairs, but she floats way too much & I occasionally try to dair, but it usually doesn't work in my favor.

I find D3 hard because of his weight. Good players should be PSing our slow missles and zair if we get predictable. A D3 I played did exactly that, although I was less experienced with Samus at the time. I haven't played that person's D3 for the longest time ever, but I think it'd still be somewhat difficult.

MK is hard and I don't feel like posting my opinions at the moment, so I may get to that later on. On another note, hopefully my friend will finally upload our doubles match (Samus + zelda) over winter break. I wanna see my habits to I can fix them :/

 

[Crystanium]

you forgot mention to Link and Toon Link, they can stop the CS with his shield, they only need kee stand and done, also the bombs can do the job

Forgot? Oh, no, no, no, no, no. I just didn't list it because the Links will be moving. A moving target is susceptible to Charge Shot.

 

[IsmaR]

The thing with Charge Shots is that they're supposed to be used with mindgames. If you throw out any predictable ones(unless that's what you want them to think, obv), even against people who can do no more than shield/dodge it, you just wasted several seconds charging(normally a good thing for those running out the time) and could be in immediate danger. Said it before, I'll say it again. I lol at people who think anyone with a reflector counters Samus because of it.

Anyhoo. I used to always use N-air to beat out MK's Nado. Worked for the most part, now I tend to rely more on semi charged CS and the occasional lolbomb as I see fit. Plenty o' moves work fine in the right situations, however. On a related note, I'd say change my vote to MK, Jiggs is only my bane. As if my opinion mattered any of course.