Luigi's Changes from Brawl to SSB4

[DJ Delta]

Did anyone notice that Luigi's down tilt pops opponents up regardless of percent. With the increased hitstun, it could possibly combo into stuff like reverse up smash or angled up fsmash.

 

[Shuckle89]

The stuff I read here seems pretty damn amazing. I've always liked luigi and my luigi was pretty good in tourneys despite it's low tier (brawl). I remember beating several people with it. If he's truly as buffed as you guys are saying... he's going to be amazing in my hands.

 

[DJ Delta]

The only significant nerfs I see are the fact that nado can't rise as high and a possibly weaker up b. Also it seems they fixed the missle hitbox where it's at the head instead of closer to the neck. This should make it a little harder for people to hit him out of it when he's recovering.

 

[Yonder]

In general, everything looks better cept his Up B which got...massacred :s. it's debatable if it's worth using now because of the same cool down and harder to land. if it had it's Melee cooldown maybe but...idk. F smash looks to be a better alternative since it is just slightly weaker now than Up b while retaining it's original strength. except without the lag.

 

[DJ Delta]

I don't mind the nerf in the power as long it can still be used as a kill move. I mean it ko'd some characters at under 70 in brawl. As long as it kills most characters in the 100 range i'm fine with that. Otherwise it wouldn't make sense to not have a good reward for a move that puts you in a such a bad position if missed. Perhaps the up b set ups are just a little more subtle or complex as supposed to just jab up b. Most people only got play a small sample, so hopefully landing up b will just take some getting used to, as opposed to not being able to land it at all.

 

[Tino]

Only changed I've seen in Luigi from Brawl is his final smash. That's pretty much all I know of.

P.S. I actually liked his final smash from Brawl, unlike most people.

 

[Yonder]

Only changed I've seen in Luigi from Brawl is his final smash. That's pretty much all I know of.

P.S. I actually liked his final smash from Brawl, unlike most people.

His Brawl FS was definitely more effective gameplay wise, but made no sense character wise.

 

[Dunk Master]

A lot of impressions say Zelda is somehow worse than Brawl in this game so far...I didn't use her so I wouldn't know. Other than that, yeah. I used Luigi in Smash run and FFA. I can definitely say he's faster. Also has a bit more traction. That could just be the game physics though. F Smash still has stupid good knockback too.

She isn't really worse than her Brawl iteration. It's more the fact that she didn't get buffed as much as other veteran characters. She needed a lot in order to be competitive, and it doesn't look like she is getting some needed changes. Din's Fire still puts her in helpless fall and she still has virtually no combo potential. Who knows though, the game isn't out yet.

Anyway, back to the topic. Good to see Luigi getting some attention. Does anyone know if his up special still has that sweet spot KO potential?

 

[DJ Delta]

Up b is still pretty strong, the debate is how strong. It still does 25% damage, but it seems uncertain if it's up there in ko power like in brawl

 

[ThatGeoDude]

I heard somewhere that Luigi's up b was significantly nerfed in terms in knockback. Does anybody have any input on this or landed it a few times in the demo to know how strong or weak it is? I ko'd little mac at 100, but I'm not sure how heavy he is. I feel like it's weaker than brawl but a little stronger than melee.

I really hope this isn't the case. It was hard enough to land, unless you got a good jab > uppercut (and even then it wouldn't work on everybody)

Perfect example of high risk, high reward type of moves. Taking the power away from it kind of doesn't make it worthwhile to use. Guess we'll have to see.

 

[SmashWolf]

If only he had his godly up-B from Smash 64....

Still, if Weegee can muster some decent horizontal speed in some way, he'll definitly be a good character. Having his dash attack be usefull surely contributes to that.

 

[Yonder]

If only he had his godly up-B from Smash 64....

Still, if Weegee can muster some decent horizontal speed in some way, he'll definitly be a good character. Having his dash attack be usefull surely contributes to that.​

​

Agreed. If he wasn't so horribly slow moving in the air and ground, he may actually be able to approach a bit better
​

 

[Luigi160]

If only he had his godly up-B from Smash 64....

Still, if Weegee can muster some decent horizontal speed in some way, he'll definitly be a good character. Having his dash attack be usefull surely contributes to that.

Yeah, his Smash 64 up-B was much more useful.

Less lag and more range on his fireballs would be nice.

 

[Zanwald]

I always called his side smash 'Ham Sandwich'. Because it looks as if he's handing his opponent a ham sandwich.. and a deadly one at that.

 

[Deleted member]

It seems that luigi will have (almost) completely different animations from mario this time around :3

 

[asia_catdog_blue]

I always called his side smash 'Ham Sandwich'. Because it looks as if he's handing his opponent a ham sandwich.. and a deadly one at that.

It's called, "Trowel Stab."

 

[meleebrawler]

That down throw definitely leads to combos too. Dash attack isn't used super effectively in this video though. He grabs with one hand now too, for whatever reason.[/quote]

Mario does the one-handed grab too... and so does Bowser. Weird.

Also, Luigi's Fists of Fury make a very funny noise when they hit.

 

[meleebrawler]

In general, everything looks better cept his Up B which got...massacred :s. it's debatable if it's worth using now because of the same cool down and harder to land. if it had it's Melee cooldown maybe but...idk. F smash looks to be a better alternative since it is just slightly weaker now than Up b while retaining it's original strength. except without the lag.

First Jiggly's Rest and now this why u no like these moves developers?

 

[meleebrawler]

​

Agreed. If he wasn't so horribly slow moving in the air and ground, he may actually be able to approach a bit better​

Nobody seems to remember how fast his Luigi Cyclone is on the ground... I remember a Toon Link vs. Luigi match
on 3DS in SDCC tournament and the Luigi player never used his cyclone once.

 

[Yonder]

Nobody seems to remember how fast his Luigi Cyclone is on the ground... I remember a Toon Link vs. Luigi match
on 3DS in SDCC tournament and the Luigi player never used his cyclone once.

Because the player used dash attack, dash attack, and dash attack.

Oh, Dash attack apparently sucks again according to the final E3 build. :/

 

[Luigi#1]

Because the player used dash attack, dash attack, and dash attack.

Oh, Dash attack apparently sucks again according to the final E3 build. :/

What?

 

[Yonder]

What?

I'm going off Zipso's final build impressions thread. [Then again, he had nothing but bad things to say about him though...]

Pretty sure the dash was nerfed back to its former bad self though, regardless. Could be wrong.

 

[DJ Delta]

I'm going off Zipso's final build impressions thread. [Then again, he had nothing but bad things to say about him though...]

Pretty sure the dash was nerfed back to its former bad self though, regardless. Could be wrong.

Zipzo did admit that he doesn't know much about Luigi. He gave very little information about any of his moves. He seemed to base his impressions off his mobility and range, which are Luigi's two worst traits. Though he's trying to get as much info from the game as possible and seems to spending more times on newcomers and the gameplay overall, so it's understandable. Basically I wouldn't put too much weight into his impressions, at least from a Luigi standpoint.

 

[Zanwald]

Don't understand why people don't use his Up-B and Cyclone correctly. Normal hit draws them in then immediately follow with Up-B for the home-run uppercut.

 

[meleebrawler]

Don't understand why people don't use his Up-B and Cyclone correctly. Normal hit draws them in then immediately follow with Up-B for the home-run uppercut.

The last hit of cyclone knocks them away and the move recovers too slowly to follow up with fire punch.

 

[Zanwald]

The last hit of cyclone knocks them away and the move recovers too slowly to follow up with fire punch.

Then it's time to change strategy. Not write Luigi off.

 

[asia_catdog_blue]

That down throw definitely leads to combos too. Dash attack isn't used super effectively in this video though. He grabs with one hand now too, for whatever reason.

Mario does the one-handed grab too... and so does Bowser. Weird.

Also, Luigi's Fists of Fury make a very funny noise when they hit.

Fists of Fear

 

[thewarjoe]

"Luigi has gained the ability to wall climb".

Liars! Now this could have been a solution.

 

[crazyhandmasterhand]

I use Luigi quite a bit still in this game. Okay that's an understatement considering he is still my main, lol.
I can definitely say that his Dash attack is NOT nerfed from the E3 build. The majority of the time (95% or so) I am able to chain all hits of the dash attack together. If it is nerfed, it may have been damage-wise, but it is still the most useful his dash attack has ever been.

He does not have a Wall Jump either from what I have tested. I wish it were true, but it does not seem to be the case. He can still "tech" off of walls to pseudo Wall Jump, but that goes with every character in the game. Luigi is definitely solid in this game though. He still has slight problems with approaching, but when he gets in, he can pack a wallop! Down throw to short hop Luigi Cyclone seems to work even at higher percentages and considering he still has low endlag to his aerials, plus the fact that his Back Air can KO... he is a scary character.

Not Yoshi, Zero Suit Samus, and Sheik level, but I think he's better than he has ever been.

 

[Yonder]

I use Luigi quite a bit still in this game. Okay that's an understatement considering he is still my main, lol.
I can definitely say that his Dash attack is NOT nerfed from the E3 build. The majority of the time (95% or so) I am able to chain all hits of the dash attack together. If it is nerfed, it may have been damage-wise, but it is still the most useful his dash attack has ever been.

He does not have a Wall Jump either from what I have tested. I wish it were true, but it does not seem to be the case. He can still "tech" off of walls to pseudo Wall Jump, but that goes with every character in the game. Luigi is definitely solid in this game though. He still has slight problems with approaching, but when he gets in, he can pack a wallop! Down throw to short hop Luigi Cyclone seems to work even at higher percentages and considering he still has low endlag to his aerials, plus the fact that his Back Air can KO... he is a scary character.

Not Yoshi, Zero Suit Samus, and Sheik level, but I think he's better than he has ever been.

It's nice to finally hear someone call Luigi something than bad in this game for once! I myself just think he's a "different" Luigi in this game. Not bad, we just hav to adjust our playstyles a bit more in accordance to his new changes.

 

[ThegreatVaporeon1]

His Luigi Cyclone is literally his PM Cylclone minus a follow up (since it takes too long for him to go back into regular position). And I love it. SDi in this game is essentially non-existent which makes it impossible to escape if it hits (I swear this move is broken). His dash attack is very good, however, it's still punishable if it misses, but when it hits, its amazing. His back air has also been buffed drastically from previous games, making it a good finisher. He also stops charging missile if you hold it for too long (thank god). His fireballs have a lot less lag which make them better and his super jump punch has the same power has brawls (i.e. amazing).

What I dont get though, is why they removed his side b to snap onto. His side b will never grab ledge and youre basically forced to use down b or up b to reach it. It's not a big issue considering how good his recovery is, but I dont get why they did it.
His misfire is a 1/10 chance now as opposed to 1/6 from brawl/melee. But this misfire is much better than both imo. In melee, you dont expect it and you'll go flying across the stage, which makes you gimpable. In brawl, the misfire was too slow. (PM's misfire is perfect in my opinion). But this one is done right. It is SO satisfying to get misfire combos with Luigi in this game. I wish I could share replays because I managed to save two that I got (I had more but didn't know how to save replays).

His aerial mobility is pretty bad, however, and I'm quite upset that they did nothing to fix it. His fair and dair are weak combo moves and are very unsafe on shield. His up b, while strong if it hits, is very hard to land a sweetspot in the air. Maybe it's just me, but I can never pull it off in the air, which I could do in melee, brawl (a small amount) and PM. His up also has A LOT of landing lag if it misses, which puts him in a bad position. Luigi also struggles against characters with range and projectiles, which both limit his approach options. This was his issue in pretty much every smash game thus far, but it's even worse in Brawl/Smash 4 due to lack of wavedash and waveland/good ground mobility. But a smart Luigi will try to get around it; but it will take a lot of work.

In my previous posts in another thread, I said Luigi is one of the worst characters in the game, and I don't think that way anymore. At worst he is in the middle, tier wise. His kill options are limited, but again he has bair, rising tornado, up/forward/down smash, and up b. A lot of my kill however are out of shield up b and up smash, with some fsmashes and bairs thrown in there. Some rising cyclones I get too, which are also amazingly satisfying.

I still think Project M's incarnation of Luigi is the best, but yes, this character is good in smash 4. He's hard to use and you have to be smart with approaching, but when you get in, you will decimate the opponent. And I still think his best neutral stage is battlefield. It's time some people paid attention to WEEGEE.

Did anyone notice that Luigi's down tilt pops opponents up regardless of percent. With the increased hitstun, it could possibly combo into stuff like reverse up smash or angled up fsmash.

Yup. It's actually his melee dtilt essentially. It's awesome

 

[Sidoran]

His down air seems to spike much easier now. I did it once by accident then again on purpose. I could NEVER get that to work in Brawl.

Cyclone seems to only gain height if you already have upward momentum now. Either that or I simply can't tap the buttons fast enough on the 3DS. On the upside, it works a lot better as an actual attack. I've had a lot of luck using it on the way down from the air and it always seems to catch people off guard and take them for a ride. It's much more reliable than down air for out prioritizing a waiting opponent's up smash/tilt/air.

 

[Luigi#1]

Okay, after having alot of time playing my sister's game:

Luigi is hella awesome to me.
Dash attack is better, combos are good, and with the burial head, straight missile, and bouncing fire ball I am awesome.

 

[Yonder]

His down air seems to spike much easier now. I did it once by accident then again on purpose. I could NEVER get that to work in Brawl.

Cyclone seems to only gain height if you already have upward momentum now. Either that or I simply can't tap the buttons fast enough on the 3DS. On the upside, it works a lot better as an actual attack. I've had a lot of luck using it on the way down from the air and it always seems to catch people off guard and take them for a ride. It's much more reliable than down air for out prioritizing a waiting opponent's up smash/tilt/air.

For max height out of the cyclone, you need to jump forward very fast and use it right away. Works for me anyways. Cyclone is beautiful as an attack. It can be used on the way down and up. I've gotten many a kill with it rising to the top of the screen, kills at 100%.

The only negative about the cyclone I can honestly say is if you start a little too far away from the opponent using it as an approach...and stop right in from of them. Of course, that's more player error anyways...