Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Þe 1 → Way]

So that gets me thinking, who would be your preferred partner to some of your most wanted characters if they got in? Whether it’s a character already playable in Smash or an additional newcomer? I’ll start with one of mine that has two solid options for a partner.

In the same vein as the Belmont's, I think Phoenix Wright could probably bring one or maybe a couple of the other lawyers with him as an echo or alt if he was included. I think there's a pretty solid argument to be made for Apollo, Edgeworth, or Rynosuke depending on the direction, maybe even a composite character of the 4 of them, though I think their personalities are a bit too different for the Steve and Hero treatments.

You could also delve into the nuances of each character like Apollo's bracelet or Phoenix's Magatama for echo differences. Most fan movesets I see use MvC 3 as something of a base, which I think makes sense but kinda downplays the potential of a goofy lawyer character with exaggerated judicial and psychic abilities.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Seeing all the crazy new **** in Mario Kart World, especially after a decade of 8 and 8 Deluxe, only reinforces my desire for a new Smash game with new ideas.

Maybe that team game idea is the next step. I don't think rigid duos would be a good idea if for no reason other than it creates some arbitrary limitations on the roster, but perhaps allowing players to select two or three characters at once is what's needed to revitalize the series.


My only concern with this conceptually is the fact that it kind of necessitates the removal of Pokémon Trainer since swapping to a swap character in a team game is kinda weird. Pyra/Mythra could get separated (or be similar enough to get away with the gimmick), but Pokémon Trainer is a glorified background element and having Squirtle and Ivysaur without them is kinda pointless.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

In the same vein as the Belmont's, I think Phoenix Wright could probably bring one or maybe a couple of the other lawyers with him as an echo or alt if he was included. I think there's a pretty solid argument to be made for Apollo, Edgeworth, or Rynosuke depending on the direction, maybe even a composite character of the 4 of them, though I think their personalities are a bit too different for the Steve and Hero treatments.

You could also delve into the nuances of each character like Apollo's bracelet or Phoenix's Magatama for echo differences. Most fan movesets I see use MvC 3 as something of a base, which I think makes sense but kinda downplays the potential of a goofy lawyer character with exaggerated judicial and psychic abilities.

Ryunosuke would be a good option, since he uses a lot of the same animations as Phoenix, due to them being family.

And The great ace attorney is separate enough from the rest of the series so having a character from alongside mainline would be good.

 

[SharkLord]

There has been a NS2 edition game announced that had DLC, Breath of the Wild. I’m not sure but there’s a chance that the DLC isn’t included with the base game + upgrade pack. If that’s the case, then they’d already be selling an incomplete experience that you have to pay extra for.3

Well, I can't deny that, so you win on that point. Though the BotW expansion pack is just $20, compared to Ultimate's DLC adding up to $60.

And if the DLC content IS included, that opens up the possibility that the DLC for Switch 1 Ult can just be part of the Upgrade pack as well.

Which then requires renegotiations with third-parties, which complicates things more than just making a quick port and calling it a day, and also opens the possibility of affecting the price tag. It's not impossible, but it's not something you can just pull off on a whim.

As an aside, if the NS2 Edition games ARE indeed ports, that’d make the Switch 2 presentation a lot more impressive than I initially thought. That’s a lot of technically new games that’s been shown, lol. Also my hypothetical also acknowledges the possibility that Ultimate NS2 Edition might’ve been developed alongside or simultaneously with Air Riders. Not the first time Sakurai’s worked on multiple projects at once, lol.

And that simultaneous project was a full game (Brawl) and a teeny-tiny Mushiking handheld that he did in between brakes. Kirby Air Riders is a whole-ass game, and what's effectively a third Fighter's Pass won't be quite as simple as a little virtual pet device.

I just don’t think it’s all that impossible or impractical as you’re making it out to be.

You've been framing this scenario as a near-perfect slam dunk where everything lines up towards it happening, and it's not as cut-and-dry as that. Especially considering that Smash is one of the Switch's best sellers, and they just didn't show anything for it during the Switch 2 reveal, which would've been a great opportunity.

 

[Wonder Smash]

Speaking of Ace Attorney, I remember you saying Herlock Sholmes would be a Legendary Spirit:

He would be Ace Attorney's legendary spirit.

That reminds me, if these characters appeared as spirits, we'd know who'd be representing them.

 

[PersonAngelo53]

If SSBU DX is possible, Nintendo must give the audience a good reason to upgrade other than visuals and processing power.View attachment 401187

Better online and some quality of life features like being able to toggle stage hazards on the stage select screen or just allowing squad strike to be available in online rooms at least would be a solid enough upgrade for me personally.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Speaking of Ace Attorney, I remember you saying Herlock Sholmes would be a Legendary Spirit:



That reminds me, if these characters appeared as spirts, we'd know who'd be representing them.

View attachment 401214View attachment 401216

It writes itself.

 

[Ivander]

That reminds me, if these characters appeared as spirits, we'd know who'd be representing them.

View attachment 401214View attachment 401216

It writes itself.

Yep. Wario and Waluigi.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Better online and some quality of life features like being able to toggle stage hazards on the stage select screen or just allowing squad strike to be available in online rooms at least would be a solid enough upgrade for me personally.

Yes.

And THEN they can sell me more Fighters Passes.

 

[Captain Shwampy]

My opinion is that Bananza was planned as a Switch 1 game but was moved to the Switch 2 either early or middle of development. Not sure why the Switch 1 didn't have an original game outside of Retro being busy.

Im pretty certain Bananza is the Main Nintendo teams big new game designed for a new console in mind.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Honestly, if Donkey Kong Bananza makes me think about anything, it makes me wonder if DKC would be Retro's next project after Prime 4 or if they might make something else, since they usually just work on Prime and DKC, but now we have Prime 4 covered and a new DK game coming out in 3 months.

Like maybe they still could since 2D DK instead of 3D DK and we'll end up getting 2 big new Donkey Kong games in the first half of the Switch 2's life, but I'm kind of curious if they'll take the opportunity to maybe try something brand new or potentially another franchise, like how they tried to work on Star Fox that one time.

 

[SharkLord]

And that simultaneous project was a full game (Brawl) and a teeny-tiny Mushiking handheld that he did in between brakes. Kirby Air Riders is a whole-ass game, and what's effectively a third Fighter's Pass won't be quite as simple as a little virtual pet device.

Addendum, since I genuinely forgot - There is also Smash 4, which was split into the Wii U and 3DS versions during development. That said, both games were developed as part of the greater Smash 4 package - While they had some exclusive modes and stages, they also share some stages and modes, as well as all fighters (Including physics, movesets, and I believe models) and most songs, which likely meant the development cycle wasn't exactly the same as juggling two entirely different games at once.

Also, after some thought, I've realized that releasing a Smash Ultimate Deluxe would probably require re-negotiations no matter what. SSBU's negotiations were probably made along the lines of "we're using your characters in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate for the Nintendo Switch, sold at $60." SSBU DX would be sold in stores, both physically and digitally, under a new price tag and for a new system. Even if the negotiations go smoothly, they'd still probably need to contact all the rights owners regarding royalties and licenses in this new context. With that in mind, I don't think Nintendo can just plop out an Ultimate DX on a whim.

 

[Dukefire]

Addendum, since I genuinely forgot - There is also Smash 4, which was split into the Wii U and 3DS versions during development. That said, both games were developed as part of the greater Smash 4 package - While they had some exclusive modes and stages, they also share some stages and modes, as well as all fighters (Including physics, movesets, and I believe models) and most songs, which likely meant the development cycle wasn't exactly the same as juggling two entirely different games at once.

Also, after some thought, I've realized that releasing a Smash Ultimate Deluxe would probably require re-negotiations no matter what. SSBU's negotiations were probably made along the lines of "we're using your characters in Super Smash Bros. Ultimate for the Nintendo Switch, sold at $60." SSBU DX would be sold in stores, both physically and digitally, under a new price tag and for a new system. Even if the negotiations go smoothly, they'd still probably need to contact all the rights owners regarding royalties and licenses in this new context. With that in mind, I don't think Nintendo can just plop out an Ultimate DX on a whim.

That's why it might take 2-3 years before confirmation if Smash Bros is going deluxe on ultimate or resetting the roster (soft or hard) with a new title. I don't think Nintendo is going to give a teaser or ideas this year.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I love this moveset idea for Funky Kong. Giant Punch has been reworked into a showstopping forward aerial (kinda, it's the same attack concept, but it's not actually based on Giant Punch). He has his gun, but the "he really shouldn't have a projectile" thing was solved by turning it into a command grab that uses other players as ammo which is genius. They even managed to make Flame Runner interesting compared to characters with similar move concepts like Bowser Jr. Rivals of Aether characters do have to differ in design from Super Smash Bros. characters, but something at least in this ballpark is what I'd want from a playable Funky Kong, clone or not.

 

[PeridotGX]

The Switch 2 is in a weird position where a lot of Nintendo's biggest series just... won't be getting games for a while.

• With the Odyssey team working on Bananza, 3D Mario is shelved for awhile.
• Wonder is still fairly recent, so I wouldn't expect a new 2D Mario for a couple years (Mario Maker 3 feels like it's still plausible though)
• 3D Zelda development takes forever, so we definitely aren't getting one until the second half of the Switch 2's life.
• Similarly, we just got Echoes of Wisdom last year, so 2D Zelda is benched for a few years.
• There's nothing stopping us from getting Animal Crossing or Splatoon... but because they share developers, it's very much an "or" situation and we'll have to wait on the other.
• And as we all know, Kirby Air Ride means we almost assuredly aren't getting a new Smash for awhile.

It's ironic that a Nintendo home console is being carried by Pokemon, between Z-A getting a Switch 2 version and Gen 10 inevitably releasing next year. There's also Mario Kart of course.

 

[RileyXY1]

The Switch 2 is in a weird position where a lot of Nintendo's biggest series just... won't be getting games for a while.

• With the Odyssey team working on Bananza, 3D Mario is shelved for awhile.
• Wonder is still fairly recent, so I wouldn't expect a new 2D Mario for a couple years (Mario Maker 3 feels like it's still plausible though)
• 3D Zelda development takes forever, so we definitely aren't getting one until the second half of the Switch 2's life.
• Similarly, we just got Echoes of Wisdom last year, so 2D Zelda is benched for a few years.
• There's nothing stopping us from getting Animal Crossing or Splatoon... but because they share developers, it's very much an "or" situation and we'll have to wait on the other.
• And as we all know, Kirby Air Ride means we almost assuredly aren't getting a new Smash for awhile.

It's ironic that a Nintendo home console is being carried by Pokemon, between Z-A getting a Switch 2 version and Gen 10 inevitably releasing next year. There's also Mario Kart of course.

Yeah. From the looks of it they're saving so many of their big franchises for later on in the Switch 2's lifespan, except for Mario Kart, DK and Pokémon of course.

 

[fogbadge]

The Switch 2 is in a weird position where a lot of Nintendo's biggest series just... won't be getting games for a while.

• With the Odyssey team working on Bananza, 3D Mario is shelved for awhile.
• Wonder is still fairly recent, so I wouldn't expect a new 2D Mario for a couple years (Mario Maker 3 feels like it's still plausible though)
• 3D Zelda development takes forever, so we definitely aren't getting one until the second half of the Switch 2's life.
• Similarly, we just got Echoes of Wisdom last year, so 2D Zelda is benched for a few years.
• There's nothing stopping us from getting Animal Crossing or Splatoon... but because they share developers, it's very much an "or" situation and we'll have to wait on the other.
• And as we all know, Kirby Air Ride means we almost assuredly aren't getting a new Smash for awhile.

It's ironic that a Nintendo home console is being carried by Pokemon, between Z-A getting a Switch 2 version and Gen 10 inevitably releasing next year. There's also Mario Kart of course.

or alternatively: Mario, Kirby and Donkey Kong are all slated for this year and both Metroid and Poekmon will have enhanced versions for it

 

[PersonAngelo53]

The Switch 2 is in a weird position where a lot of Nintendo's biggest series just... won't be getting games for a while.

• With the Odyssey team working on Bananza, 3D Mario is shelved for awhile.
• Wonder is still fairly recent, so I wouldn't expect a new 2D Mario for a couple years (Mario Maker 3 feels like it's still plausible though)
• 3D Zelda development takes forever, so we definitely aren't getting one until the second half of the Switch 2's life.
• Similarly, we just got Echoes of Wisdom last year, so 2D Zelda is benched for a few years.
• There's nothing stopping us from getting Animal Crossing or Splatoon... but because they share developers, it's very much an "or" situation and we'll have to wait on the other.
• And as we all know, Kirby Air Ride means we almost assuredly aren't getting a new Smash for awhile.

It's ironic that a Nintendo home console is being carried by Pokemon, between Z-A getting a Switch 2 version and Gen 10 inevitably releasing next year. There's also Mario Kart of course.

Oof, not looking good for me. I don’t personally care much for Pokemon so I only have Mario kart and Donkey Kong that I look forward to on switch 2. Well Metroid prime 4 too I guess tho that’s also a switch 1 title.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Donkey Kong and Mario Kart are kind of a big deal. I don't get this. Seems like a very solid start. Except for the prices.

 

[Thegameandwatch]

Donkey Kong and Mario Kart are kind of a big deal. I don't get this. Seems like a very solid start. Except for the prices.

Outside of core fans, I think the pricing has overshadowed the games on the Switch 2.

 

[Ivander]

The Switch 2 is in a weird position where a lot of Nintendo's biggest series just... won't be getting games for a while.

• With the Odyssey team working on Bananza, 3D Mario is shelved for awhile.
• Wonder is still fairly recent, so I wouldn't expect a new 2D Mario for a couple years (Mario Maker 3 feels like it's still plausible though)
• 3D Zelda development takes forever, so we definitely aren't getting one until the second half of the Switch 2's life.
• Similarly, we just got Echoes of Wisdom last year, so 2D Zelda is benched for a few years.
• There's nothing stopping us from getting Animal Crossing or Splatoon... but because they share developers, it's very much an "or" situation and we'll have to wait on the other.
• And as we all know, Kirby Air Ride means we almost assuredly aren't getting a new Smash for awhile.

It's ironic that a Nintendo home console is being carried by Pokemon, between Z-A getting a Switch 2 version and Gen 10 inevitably releasing next year. There's also Mario Kart of course.

I might just be content since I got a big back catalogue, but Mario Kart, Donkey Kong, Metroid Prime 4 and Kirby Air Riders this year, the Gamecube NSO and Nintendo Switch 2 Editions of games I have and the free updates to games like ARMS and Super Mario Odyssey will last me for a long time. Even more so if games like Hyrule Warriors & Age of Calamity and Monster Hunter Rise get a notable boost from the Switch 2.

 

[Gengar84]

Outside of core fans, I think the pricing has overshadowed the games on the Switch 2.

I am a core fan (I’ve bought every Nintendo console and handheld since the NES other than the original Gameboy and Virtual Boy) and it’s definitely overshadowed the games for me too. I might still pick up a Switch 2 down the line once there’s enough games I’m excited about and hopefully there’s some kind of sale or price drop, but it’s no longer a must have day one buy for me.

 

[Noipoi]

Mario Kart World, Bananza, and Z-A will be enough to carry the year for me. Not to mention GameCube NSO. I’ll have to declare bankruptcy but at least I’ll have the Moo Moo Cow.

Though I still feel like there’s a holiday game coming. It’d be weird to let the new console’s first winter pass without a big new exclusive.

 

[Thegameandwatch]

I am a core fan (I’ve bought every Nintendo console and handheld since the NES other than the original Gameboy and Virtual Boy) and it’s definitely overshadowed the games for me too. I might still pick up a Switch 2 down the line once there’s enough games I’m excited about and hopefully there’s some kind of sale or price drop, but it’s no longer a must have day one buy for me.

I think consoles in general shouldn’t be bought at launch although at least the launch titles for the Switch 2 will be stronger compared to the original Switch which mainly had BOTW and Bomberman.

 

[fogbadge]

Do you all think Nintendo should just release all their big franchises at once?

 

[Gengar84]

Do you all think Nintendo should just release all their big franchises at once?

I don’t think that’s smart or even possible. I think they should spread out huge releases over the life of the console to keep it relevant. However, I do think consoles do need strong launches to drive the initial hype and interest. Mario Kart and DK may be enough for most fans so it’s probably fine but I’ve personally got mixed feelings about the DK game and I’m not a huge fan of the less fantastical MK tracks so the price became a bigger focus to me.

 

[fogbadge]

I don’t think that’s smart or even possible. I think they should spread out huge releases over the life of the console to keep it relevant.

well it’s what they’re doing

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Game Release Guestimations:

Spoiler: 2025

• Mario Kart, Metroid, Tomodachi Life, and Donkey Kong are getting new entries.
• The Legend of Zelda is getting 2 enhanced ports and a spin-off.
• Kirby is getting an enhanced port, and a spin-off.
• Pokémon is getting a spin-off.
• Xenoblade Chronicles is getting a remake (but not for Switch 2).
• If we're getting a currently unnanounced big holiday title, I'm assuming it's going to be Animal Crossing.
• I also think we could be seeing Fire Emblem this year. They've had a lot of time to cook since Engage, especially with them sitting on it for a while.
• Ring Fit Adventure might get a new game this year as well, especially with backwards compatability wonkiness with the Switch 2.

Spoiler: 2026

• Pokémon Gen 10 will debut this year unless for some stupid reason it debuts the year prior.
• Metroid may get a 2D entry this year.
• Assuming there's no Fire Emblem the year prior, it's coming this year.
• WarioWare might show up this year since this is a lower budget series.
• Mainline Kirby may show up this year.
• If not the year prior, I'm pretty confident in Ring Fit Adventure coming out this year.

Spoiler: 2027

• The absolute earliest we could see Super Smash Bros.
• 2D Mario might show up now.
• If not the year prior, mainline Kirby will probably show up.

Spoiler: 2028

• The absolute earliest we could see ARMS.
• If not in 2025, Splatoon 4 will likely come out now. If it does come out in 2025, Animal Crossing will be coming this or next year.
• If not the year prior, 2D Mario could show up now.

Spoiler: No Idea

• Yoshi games release pretty much at random so I'm not even gonna try and predict when it'll come next.
• Star Fox might not show up at all, but there's still a chance.
• Pikmin I'm confident will get more stuff, but when is a big question mark, especially with Pikmin 4 taking about a decade to come out.
• A new Xenoblade Chronicles entry could come fairly soon, or take quite a while. It really depends on who's working on the remake, and how long the new entry takes to develop.
• Astral Chain might show up, but that's a big question mark.
• Game & Watch is pretty much just a collector's item at this point, so I dunno when they'll put out a new one.

Probably not gonna see anything new from EarthBound, F-Zero, Ice Climber, Kid Icarus, Wario Land, Wii Fit, R.O.B., PUNCH-OUT!!, or Duck Hunt series. Though other than with EarthBound and Wii Fit, the former of which has concluded and the latter of which doesn't make sense to continue, I would say that anything is possible, even if it isn't likely.

 

[Gengar84]

well it’s what they’re doing

Right, and I’m not saying they’re wrong for doing so. It’s just that no game is going to appeal to everyone so it’s understandable why some might not want it at launch, especially considering the price.

 

[Louie G.]

I don't think there's very much wrong with this launch lineup. Mario Kart is as perfect and widely appealing a first party launch title as you can get, Donkey Kong is the 3D Mario expy and likely has a lot of the same appeal / recognizability across a general audience. We're getting Prime 4 this year too for a flashy new 'hardcore' action title, albeit cross platform, plus that new Pokemon Legends game. Air Riders and the new Hyrule Warriors are solid flavor picks.

We'll probably get another direct this summer that will lay out the holiday lineup and 2026 more clearly. Otherwise the focus of this early launch seems to have been conveying Nintendo's capability to keep up with the competition. I'm not sure if it was the best course of action yet, since you can already play a bunch of these big ticket games on other consoles, but for those dubious of the Switch's hardware this presentation wanted to make it as clear as possible that isn't something we have to worry about as much anymore.

 

[PeridotGX]

or alternatively: Mario, Kirby and Donkey Kong are all slated for this year and both Metroid and Poekmon will have enhanced versions for it

Donkey Kong, Kirby, and Metroid are definitely nice to have, but they're a bit "B-Tier" . I was talking about the massive series that sell 10 million+ units. Bananza will probably bring DK back into that tier, but he's not there yet.

Donkey Kong and Mario Kart are kind of a big deal. I don't get this. Seems like a very solid start. Except for the prices.

I'm not saying it's a bad launch lineup. It's just unusual that so many of Nintendo's big IPs are going to be waiting multiple years to get new games on Switch.

 

[fogbadge]

Donkey Kong, Kirby, and Metroid are definitely nice to have, but they're a bit "B-Tier" . I was talking about the massive series that sell 10 million+ units. Bananza will probably bring DK back into that tier, but he's not there yet.

You mean like the Mario, Zelda and Pokemon games already announced?

 

[cashregister9]

Xenoblade Chronicles is getting a remake (but not for Switch 2).

Xenoblade already got a remake on the Switch 1. and aside from that, I couldn't really see another Xenoblade thing happening this year considering how X already came out.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I’m not a huge fan of the less fantastical MK tracks so the price became a bigger focus to me.

It's kinda weird because they do have fantastical tracks. It's got stuff like Dino Dino Jungle (ft. even more dinos), Wario Shipyard, Sky High Sundae, and even some fantastical new tracks like DK Spaceport and Boo Cinema. For the most part, because of the open world, they look a lot more seamless with the world rather than big landmarks all on their lonesome. Especially true for the not so fantastical tracks like Moo Moo Meadows, SNES Mario Circuit, and DK Pass. As far as the visuals are concerned though, this isn't the problem, and I think most of the tracks are quite charming. The actual problem is that you don't actually race on most of these tracks, so they don't stick in your mind as much, and a lot of the clarity on where the tracks begin and end is lost. Like, I've seen them go through Moo Moo Meadows several times and still don't really know how it's layed out.

It does seem like the transitions can be turned off though, and if true, I think it'll be fine, with my main complaint being that a couple of cups reuse tracks (Crown City is one of them, but there may be a second in the probably unlockable Star Cup), and Moo Moo Meadows being in the later cups is super weird.

 

[Thegameandwatch]

Pokémon Gen 10 will debut this year unless for some stupid reason it debuts the year prior.

Gen 10 is definitely either 2026 or 2027 since the timeframe for them to announce a new mainline game has already passed (February).

Also Z-A (which is considered a mainline game) is probably taking the slot as the November Pokemon release of 2025.

 

[CosmicEternity44]

I have a question; is the Switch 2's preordering day delayed indefinitely?

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Xenoblade already got a remake on the Switch 1. and aside from that, I couldn't really see another Xenoblade thing happening this year considering how X already came out.

Wait it's out already?

I mean, that doesn't really change what I said since Xenoblade Chronicles X was what I was referring to, but dang. I need to go get it.

 

[cashregister9]

Wait it's out already?

I mean, that doesn't really change what I said since Xenoblade Chronicles X was what I was referring to, but dang. I need to go get it.

Yeah it came out a few weeks ago, for all the ads it had, the actual release seemed weirdly under the radar.

 

[Louie G.]

I mean, is Donkey Kong a B-lister? Donkey Kong Country, sure, but Donkey Kong the character? That name moves general audiences much more than Metroid or Kirby does. I think this game could have more overarching reach than the average game in his series given its relative isolation and similarities to a traditional big budget 3D Mario title.

Nintendo clearly doesn't see him that way. He's in blockbuster movies, he has a theme park, and he's got that much anticipated signature 3D platformer spot on the new console. How well this game does is TBD, I'm not saying it will make Odyssey money, but I think suggesting Donkey Kong is a weaker link is underestimating how much pull he has as an individual character. At the end of the day it's just about how appealing the package looks to everyone.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

I have a question; is the Switch 2's preordering day delayed indefinitely?

If it's tariff related, probably. There's just no telling what may or may not change for better or worse.

Is Trump gonna get mad and put more tariffs?
Is the House gonna pass the legislation that stops him from doing this?
Are Trump's supporters (by which I mean billionaires) going to get mad enough about the recession he caused to get him to lift the tariffs?
Is the public going to get mad enough to actually put some pressure on him to lift them?
How long before any of these outcomes, and how many of these outcomes happen in what order?

Nobody knows.