Nickelodeon All-Stars Brawl General Thread - All Star Brawl 2 Available Today!

[LimeTH]

they got 80s tmnt

And, you know. Garfield.

 

[Master Hero Sock-on-Rye]

And, you know. Garfield.

Fair on both charges, but they eventually folded them into the Nick umbrella after acquiring them. Especially TMNT.

 

[LimeTH]

Fair on both charges, but they eventually folded them into the Nick umbrella after acquiring them. Especially TMNT.

Which is weird in Garf's case because they still haven't done anything with the IP besides merchandise and crossover game appearances.

 

[fogbadge]

And, you know. Garfield.

I suppose there’s a couple things from Garfield and friends

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

I am only 8 minutes into the new Nick Knacks, the character has only been on screen for like 20 seconds, and I'm already convinced that Artie, the Strongest Man in the World NEEDS to be the live action rep in the non-existant NASB sequels, there is no other option.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

Well guys, we did it: Michelangelo, Sandy, CatDog, and Lincoln are back in a Nickelodeon brawl. Of sorts. Not exactly.

 

[FazDude]

Been a while since I posted here, but I figured y'all would be interested in this - An attendance record of every character in the Nick Brawl series (counting the Super Brawl series and both NASB games). Some interesting data here, specifically that if you look at it through a certain lens, Timmy has appeared in just one less game than "modern" SpongeBob.

Nick Brawl Attendance Record

docs.google.com

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

Introducing... Project N! Coming soon.... 👀 pic.twitter.com/s07fo3P9QM

— NS | Cherry 🔜 PlatFight (@Cherrynasb) September 5, 2024

 

[Master Hero Sock-on-Rye]

Introducing... Project N! Coming soon.... 👀 pic.twitter.com/s07fo3P9QM

— NS | Cherry 🔜 PlatFight (@Cherrynasb) September 5, 2024

That son of a [dolphin] is actually modding NASB. Good luck.

 

[Ze Diglett]

Introducing... Project N! Coming soon.... 👀 pic.twitter.com/s07fo3P9QM

— NS | Cherry 🔜 PlatFight (@Cherrynasb) September 5, 2024

Based. Playing the hell out of this when it's done.

 

[RileyXY1]

Based. Playing the hell out of this when it's done.

I wonder what this even is going to be.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

I wonder what this even is going to be.

Are you familiar with Project M or Hewdraw Remix?

 

[RileyXY1]

Are you familiar with Project M or Hewdraw Remix?

Yes I am.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

Yes I am.

It's that basically. A mad tailored for competitive play. Don't expect much in the way of characters/content (Cherry, who posted this tease, isn't making the mod AFAIK, so their "eyes emoji" towards a mention of new characters probably means nothing - and hopefully so until the mod is fully refined and has a clear direction)

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

So, I decided to start a retrospective series...

 

[Fields - Ultimate's Great]

If this is the end of NASB 2, well as someone who thinks the game is good but never came back to play the DLC, I just hope they can make a game that's actually great without some massive drawback that rightfully pushes away players from the game. "This game is good buuuut-" type deal.

Please free this team from Gamemill lmao. Maybe one day they'd have a corp that isn't so greedy/cheap. One small thing I hope is that they don't repeat the mistake of continuing to try to center everything around Smash creators too. Like randomly giving Aang certain Sheik stuff just because Void played him. Or everything with Nigel.

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

If this is the end of NASB 2, well as someone who thinks the game is good but never came back to play the DLC, I just hope they can make a game that's actually great without some massive drawback that rightfully pushes away players from the game. "This game is good buuuut-" type deal.

Please free this team from Gamemill lmao. Maybe one day they'd have a corp that isn't so greedy/cheap. One small thing I hope is that they don't repeat the mistake of continuing to try to center everything around Smash creators too. Like randomly giving Aang certain Sheik stuff just because Void played him. Or everything with Nigel.

Completely agreed.

I don't mind them pulling good ideas from Smash, but having Melee players determine character movesets was a terrible idea. Giving Lincoln FLUDD or Reptar some of Bowser's moves at least makes sense - its in character for them. Nigelpuff isn't.

 

[Guynamednelson]

Nigelpuff isn't.

I preferred how NASB1 Nigel was partially inspired by Jigglypuff instead of just being Jiggs in a Klasky-Csupo safariman costume.

 

[Opossum]

I preferred how NASB1 Nigel was partially inspired by Jigglypuff instead of just being Jiggs in a Klasky-Csupo safariman costume.

The loss of the original Falcon Dive down air is my single biggest gameplay related issue with NASB2. Nigel in general is so different compared to 1 that it was completely offputting...he was my main in 1 but he's just not at all the same character anymore.

 

[Fields - Ultimate's Great]

Pandering to Smash players is a source of one of NASB's flaws as a franchise and doesn't help the stigma of plat fighters being Smash copies. I don't like the absence of originality and just blatantly taking moves without more of a twist. Why does Zuko have a falcon punch, when did he ever fight like this in the show for example.

 

[Wario Wario Wario]

Something that annoys me about NASB discourse is really that I think a lot of people who talk about NASB are just within the overlap of Nick fans and Smash fans and like the idea of combining the two, but don't really like NASB for its own distinct identity - quirky, Melee-inspired, competitive, fast, experimental - to me those are all just core elements of both NASB games, much moreso than just Da Bob being in it.

 

[Capybara Gaming]

Something that annoys me about NASB discourse is really that I think a lot of people who talk about NASB are just within the overlap of Nick fans and Smash fans and like the idea of combining the two, but don't really like NASB for its own distinct identity - quirky, Melee-inspired, competitive, fast, experimental - to me those are all just core elements of both NASB games, much moreso than just Da Bob being in it.

There is literally nothing wrong with people wanting a Nickelodeon Smash game and this elitist "well they don't appreciate it for what it does different" mentality comes off supremely snobby

I appreciate that they're doing their own thing but I don't mind them doing callbacks to the original series that kick-started the genre. Feeling familiar to a wide audience is important if you want to compete, and innovating on the formula can (and did in the case of NASB2) still happen even with the game targeting that demographic.The fact the games haven't done amazingly isn't based on the fact they aren't more unique - they would have done even worse if they were more different and everyone knows it.

 

[DrifloonEmpire]

Pandering to Smash players is a source of one of NASB's flaws as a franchise and doesn't help the stigma of plat fighters being Smash copies. I don't like the absence of originality and just blatantly taking moves without more of a twist. Why does Zuko have a falcon punch, when did he ever fight like this in the show for example.

Completely agreed. Granted, Zuko HAS thrown flames with his fists, but they were projectiles, not a literal Falcon Punch. Some moves feel like they're included for the sake of making a reference. Like as hilarious as Krabs' stubbing his toe attack is, I doubt he'd actually use that in a fight. Or as hilarious as it is, I cannot see Garfield transforming to do a Fox reflector (unlike PTM, where the toast shield at least seems like something he'd actually do)

 

[RileyXY1]

There is literally nothing wrong with people wanting a Nickelodeon Smash game and this elitist "well they don't appreciate it for what it does different" mentality comes off supremely snobby

I appreciate that they're doing their own thing but I don't mind them doing callbacks to the original series that kick-started the genre. Feeling familiar to a wide audience is important if you want to compete, and innovating on the formula can (and did in the case of NASB2) still happen even with the game targeting that demographic.The fact the games haven't done amazingly isn't based on the fact they aren't more unique - they would have done even worse if they were more different and everyone knows it.

PSASBR was torn to shreds for doing something different from Smash, especially considering that “something different” didn’t work out that well.

 

[LimeTH]

PSASBR was torn to shreds for doing something different from Smash, especially considering that “something different” didn’t work out that well.

Well yeah, it wasn't lambasted for doing something different. It was lambasted because that something different happened to suck, If it did more of the kind of stuff NASB, MVS, and other plat fighters did, it might have fared better.

Also in all fairness, another problem was the roster selection, but that can't really be blamed on the devs so much as Sony letting really integral IP get away from them.

 

[Ze Diglett]

Making a platform fighter is so weird. People either think it's too similar to Smash and don't bother, or don't like how it differs from Smash and don't stick around for more than a month. (Or in the case of NASB, both at the same time, apparently.) Personally, I value my own enjoyment of these games over the opinions of the peanut gallery, so I'd prefer for each game to simply try its own thing and hopefully find a niche that way. It's working well enough for Rivals, even with the inspiration that game and its movesets take from Melee. Of course, that probably wasn't in the cards for NASB to begin with given GameMill's questionable practices and Nick's tendency to drop even modestly successful projects at the drop of a hat.

 

[Fields - Ultimate's Great]

PSASBR was torn to shreds for doing something different from Smash, especially considering that “something different” didn’t work out that well.

PSASBR was torn to shreds in general even when it did copy Smash it got **** on. It was an unlucky game that's defined by "wrong place at the wrong time".

 

[Capybara Gaming]

PSASBR was torn to shreds in general even when it did copy Smash it got **** on. It was an unlucky game that's defined by "wrong place at the wrong time".

PSASBR had two fundamental issues that contributed to it being **** on:

1. Having to score KOs by super just doesn't work in a game that involves platforming because it incentivizes running away too much.
2. The roster was OK at best and had way too much fluff while simultaneously missing the most important pulls. Crash, Spyro, Lara Croft, and using classic Dante alone would've taken it from OK to pretty solid, and dumping Evil Cole for say, Dart would have been a massive improvement. It also didn't help that the DLC only had one pick that really got core Playstation fans excited - Kat - and the remaining three ranged from "Alright Zeus is fine I guess" to "who the **** is Emmett Graves."

 

[Fields - Ultimate's Great]

PSASBR had two fundamental issues that contributed to it being **** on:

1. Having to score KOs by super just doesn't work in a game that involves platforming because it incentivizes running away too much.
2. The roster was OK at best and had way too much fluff while simultaneously missing the most important pulls. Crash, Spyro, Lara Croft, and using classic Dante alone would've taken it from OK to pretty solid, and dumping Evil Cole for say, Dart would have been a massive improvement. It also didn't help that the DLC only had one pick that really got core Playstation fans excited - Kat - and the remaining three ranged from "Alright Zeus is fine I guess" to "who the **** is Emmett Graves."

It did have fundamental issues. But at the time, Smash style games weren't accepted especially from Nintendo's biggest competitor at the time. Fans were very weird toward the game before it even came out.
A lot of the roster was another symptom of wrong place at the wrong time. They wanted a lot of things but couldn't get it.

 

[Capybara Gaming]

It did have fundamental issues. But at the time, Smash style games weren't accepted especially from Nintendo's biggest competitor at the time. Fans were very weird toward the game before it even came out.
A lot of the roster was another symptom of wrong place at the wrong time. They wanted a lot of things but couldn't get it.

I mean yeah but they absolutely could have tried harder even with first party characters. It felt like they wanted to use it more to promote upcoming or just-released games rather than be an actual "All-Star" lineup. It seems silly nowadays, but Thieves in Time had just come out which is why Sly has a Robin Hood skin; Twisted Metal had just had a new entry, all of the third parties in base had upcoming games releasing soon - not to mention they had a DLC character to promote a game nobody cared about on the dying PS Vita.

Regardless... a sequel could make for a good game. They have more iconic characters now, and choosing the right third party options could open up a lot of fun matchups - IF they make the gameplay worth a damn. You can be different but they gotta drop the killing with specific moves mechanic.

 

[Fields - Ultimate's Great]

I mean yeah but they absolutely could have tried harder even with first party characters. It felt like they wanted to use it more to promote upcoming or just-released games rather than be an actual "All-Star" lineup. It seems silly nowadays, but Thieves in Time had just come out which is why Sly has a Robin Hood skin; Twisted Metal had just had a new entry, all of the third parties in base had upcoming games releasing soon - not to mention they had a DLC character to promote a game nobody cared about on the dying PS Vita.

Regardless... a sequel could make for a good game. They have more iconic characters now, and choosing the right third party options could open up a lot of fun matchups - IF they make the gameplay worth a damn. You can be different but they gotta drop the killing with specific moves mechanic.

There's lots of documented history where the devs did try hard, but they didn't have Sony's backing and negotiations were pretty much impossible back then. Playstation All Stars came out at the wrong place at the wrong time. They couldn't even get OG Dante because Capcom insisted on trying to market that new version. They couldn't get Crash, they couldn't get Spyro, etc. etc. It was really unfortunate lmao.

 

[LimeTH]

There's lots of documented history where the devs did try hard, but they didn't have Sony's backing and negotiations were pretty much impossible back then. Playstation All Stars came out at the wrong place at the wrong time. They couldn't even get OG Dante because Capcom insisted on trying to market that new version. They couldn't get Crash, they couldn't get Spyro, etc. etc. It was really unfortunate lmao.

They should try again off the heels of Astro Bot's cameo calvacade having the roster PSAS should have had.

 

[Master Hero Sock-on-Rye]

They should try again off the heels of Astro Bot's cameo calvacade having the roster PSAS should have had.

115% agreed.

 

[Guynamednelson]

They should try again off the heels of Astro Bot's cameo calvacade having the roster PSAS should have had.

Nah, there's no Sweet Tooth bot in that game.

No but seriously even if PSAS has less budget and corporate mandate issues, I still think a lot of the roster would stay the same. I've posted about it before in this thread:

I'd say Kratos, Sly Cooper, Ratchet & Clank, Jak & Daxter, Sackboy, Sweet Tooth, Parappa, Heihachi, Nathan Drake are all completely worthy of a roster of a game called "Playstation All-Stars"

...and beyond those I'd also say Spike, Toro, one of the Coles, Colonel Radec, Sir Daniel, and Dante (albeit the classic one) are likely to stay, and it's not like they could cram every single character someone could consider a "Playstation All-Star" into the fighter roster, they wouldn't have enough time for that. Hell, they still struggle trying to get FFVII content into the Astro series: Astro's Playroom had a Buster Sword statue instead of a Cloud bot, and Astro Bot doesn't even have that.

 

[Kirbeh]

PSAS definitely had some design and roster issues but it was doomed to fail because Sony had no faith in the project to begin with. They pulled the plug the first chance they got and completely screwed over Superbot.

As much potential as a sequel could have, I don't see modern day Sony being all that interested either, nor do I think they'd handle it any better than the original tbh.

To get a sequel, an established dev/studio that Sony is actually willing to give the time of day to would probably need to propose and spearhead the project.

 

[LimeTH]

Nah, there's no Sweet Tooth bot in that game.

No but seriously even if PSAS has less budget and corporate mandate issues, I still think a lot of the roster would stay the same. I've posted about it before in this thread:

...and beyond those I'd also say Spike, Toro, one of the Coles, Colonel Radec, Sir Daniel, and Dante (albeit the classic one) are likely to stay, and it's not like they could cram every single character someone could consider a "Playstation All-Star" into the fighter roster, they wouldn't have enough time for that. Hell, they still struggle trying to get FFVII content into the Astro series: Astro's Playroom had a Buster Sword statue instead of a Cloud bot, and Astro Bot doesn't even have that.

Not to say every character in the roster doesn't deserve to be there. They all do. It's just at the time, there were a lot of characters people associated with Playstation that were completely absent. Wrong place, wrong time. Now that a lot of those characters are allowed to make cameos in Astro stuff, that could be fixed but this is Sony we're talking about.

In all fairness, I can't blame Sony for the FFVII thing. Square seems to be butts about FFVII in crossovers in general these days.
Remember how stingy they were with FFVII content in Smash until Sephiroth showed up? Cloud felt like a character they wanted to give the world to but were restrained by what Square allowed them to do (unlike Sonic where a case could be made that they didn't give a hot **** and just slapdashed a cheap moveset) and when let off the leash with Sephiroth they went absolutely bonkers with him.

That all said...

PSAS definitely had some design and roster issues but it was doomed to fail because Sony had no faith in the project to begin with. They pulled the plug the first chance they got and completely screwed over Superbot.

As much potential as a sequel could have, I don't see modern day Sony being all that interested either, nor do I think they'd handle it any better than the original tbh.

To get a sequel, an established dev/studio that Sony is actually willing to give the time of day to would probably need to propose and spearhead the project.

I don't really trust Sony to be interested in doing anything right. Astro Bot is most likely a fluke and they're probably going to fire the entire dev team because because. They literally don't even believe they have that much IP (they've said so publicly!) despite the treasure trove that they're sitting on doing nothing with until they need someone to kiss the nugget. Youre exactly right. Sony won't do a PSAS sequel because they could not give less of damn if they tried about anything besides their movie games, live service slop and charging extra for disc drives and stands.

 

[fogbadge]

Not to say every character in the roster doesn't deserve to be there. They all do. It's just at the time, there were a lot of characters people associated with Playstation that were completely absent. Wrong place, wrong time. Now that a lot of those characters are allowed to make cameos in Astro stuff, that could be fixed but this is Sony we're talking about.

In all fairness, I can't blame Sony for the FFVII thing. Square seems to be butts about FFVII in crossovers in general these days.
Remember how stingy they were with FFVII content in Smash until Sephiroth showed up? Cloud felt like a character they wanted to give the world to but were restrained by what Square allowed them to do (unlike Sonic where a case could be made that they didn't give a hot **** and just slapdashed a cheap moveset) and when let off the leash with Sephiroth they went absolutely bonkers with him.

That all said...



I don't really trust Sony to be interested in doing anything right. Astro Bot is most likely a fluke and they're probably going to fire the entire dev team because because. They literally don't even believe they have that much IP (they've said so publicly!) despite the treasure trove that they're sitting on doing nothing with until they need someone to kiss the nugget. Youre exactly right. Sony won't do a PSAS sequel because they could not give less of damn if they tried about anything besides their movie games, live service slop and charging extra for disc drives and stands.

that was due to legal issues not stinginess

 

[LimeTH]

that was due to legal issues not stinginess

Such as?

 

[fogbadge]

Such as?

the fact that had to renegotiate the rights for every song in every region

 

[Master Hero Sock-on-Rye]

I guess this whole debacle means we should rally for the Men in Black to get into NASB?

But seriously, the whole thing reeks of "we're a realistic Nintendo, we swear" ever since the PS1.