Pokétch App: Damage Calculator - A look at key KO percents

[T-block]

just wondering what your approach was... i wasn't sure how to do non-vertical moves

a lot of time i d-throw considering what happens if they DI basically vertically. i know it's not ideal to be depending on suboptimal DI from the opponent, but d-throw is so hard to DI that sometimes they reflexively hit up-back and end up going basically straight up. it'd be interesting if you could get an idea of how much lower the percent would have to be in that case, etc. etc. idk if anyone else does the same thing.

 

[CoonTail]

T-Block I know exactly what your talking about because I feel like the higher the opponent's % gets the more they have to DI back and less up. Quite a few times I have seen players die from D-throw vertically at higher %'s (anywhere from 130%-160%). The only time I see anyone die horizontally anymore is when I specifically pummel until I hear them mash and then D-throw them immediately. That causes the most "PatG DI" situations where D-throw kills horizontally.

Long story short if we could find the %'s that people will die vertically from d-throw it would very well be some very key %'s to remember.

 

[T-block]

yeah, even among those i fight regularly, very few are able to consistently DI squirtle's d-throw into the corner. even when i play PT dittos i often find myself thinking "man that is weird to DI properly".

so against people who don't have PT exp, i think it is okay to be d-throwing and considering they will go basically straight up.

i think the numbers myo are taking are the right numbers to record though. they are more important to learn, and we can do the mental adjustment in our heads if we decide to risk it.

 

[Myollnir]

I'm DIing up, and I die in the corner (no background death animation). I tested Up + towards Squirtle and I die earlier (I die vertically).

 

[Myollnir]

Sorry for the double post, I wanted to delete the previous and post a new one, but I can't do it. :/

Anyway, I've finished the DThrow values, I don't think I'll test on other places because I think the place I tested on is where we're most likely to grab (+ Squirtle slides a bit when he grabs, but whatever).

Next move is Charizard's DThrow. I don't know how powerful it is yet O:

 

[CoonTail]

^It's pretty rough with Proper DI, which almost always happens figuring the animation takes forever unlike Squirtle's D-throw

 

[Myollnir]

Yeah that's what I was thinking. That's still nice to have a throw that can kill, even if it's at very high %.

 

[T-block]

my rule for charizard is 160% for medium weight characters at the edge of the stage at zero fatigue =\

it'd be interesting to see how conservative that is

 

[Myollnir]

This is not dead. I'll start Charizard's DThrow next week end (holidays <3 ). After my tournament, of course

 

[TheReflexWonder]

my rule for charizard is 160% for medium weight characters at the edge of the stage at zero fatigue =\

it'd be interesting to see how conservative that is

Not very. U-Throw is almost always a better option. Deals more damage, has a faster animation, and it KOs earlier against everyone but, like, Link and Dedede.

I suppose U-Throw might be stale, though. It's definitely my preferred throw, though B-Throw at low percents gives you nice frame advantage that can net you another grab or a U-Smash/Rock Smash.

 

[Myollnir]

Bump!

Charizard's D-Throw | Final Destination
Character | Fresh / Tired
King DeDeDe | 210% / 235%
Snake | 205% / 220%
Wario | 190% / 205%
Marth | 165% / 190%
Mr.Game&Watch | 165% / 185%
MetaKnight | 150% / 180%

____________________________________________________________________________________

Summary :

Squirtle's U-Smash | Final Destination
Character | Fresh / Tired
| 145% / 205%
| 135% / 195%
| 115% / 165%
| 110% / 155%
| 95% / 140%
| 90% / 130%

Ivysaur's U-Smash | Final Destination
Character | Fresh / Tired
| 95% / 140%
| 90% / 135%
| 80% / 120%
| 70% / 110%
| 65% / 100%
| 60% / 90%

Charizard's U-Smash | Final Destination
Character | Fresh / Tired
| 155% / 225%
| 145% / 205%
| 130% / 185%
| 120% / 170%
| 105% / 150%
| 100% / 145%

Ivysaur's U-Throw | Final Destination
Character | Fresh / Tired
| 215% / 290%
| 200% / 275%
| 175% / 240%
| 170% / 230%
| 145% / 205%
| 140% / 190%

Squirtle's D-Throw | Final Destination
Character | Fresh / Tired
| 175% / 230%
| 165% / 215%
| 145% / 190%
| 140% / 180%
| 135% / 180%
| 130% / 170%

Charizard's D-Throw | Final Destination
Character | Fresh / Tired
| 210% / 235%
| 205% / 220%
| 190% / 205%
| 165% / 190%
| 165% / 185%
| 150% / 180%

 

[T-block]

reflex, can you give myo control of the OP? if he wants it, that is

are those from the centre of FD?

 

[TheReflexWonder]

You should do Charizard U-Throw. That's a better KO move than D-Throw against most characters.

 

[Myollnir]

It's often staled though!

 

[TheReflexWonder]

If you get the opponent to that high a percent, surely you can start using other throws in that scenario.

Also, the OP is yours.

 

[Myollnir]

Okay, I'll probably do U-throw then.

Thanks, but I don't think I'll edit the first post, I mean, I just need to add my last post but that's it.

 

[T-block]

Feel free to do whatever you want with it, Myo ^^

 

[Bomber7]

Do these %'s include the use of DI?

 

[Myollnir]

Yes, DI, momentum cancel, things like G&W's bucket, Wario's bike [for the D-throws only, I don't think it helps for the U-smashes ], etc...

The DI is tricky at times though ; for instance, with Charizard's D-throw on Marth, you have to DI with the direction between :stick8: and :stick9: to go to the corner of the blastzone if Charizard isn't tired.

I did my best to survive, but the numbers could be wrong (not by much). Oh also, you can see they're approximate, if it kills at like 156%, I wrote 155%.

 

[Bomber7]

Yes, DI, momentum cancel, things like G&W's bucket, Wario's bike [for the D-throws only, I don't think it helps for the U-smashes ], etc...

The DI is tricky at times though ; for instance, with Charizard's D-throw on Marth, you have to DI with the direction between :stick8: and :stick9: to go to the corner of the blastzone if Charizard isn't tired.

I did my best to survive, but the numbers could be wrong (not by much). Oh also, you can see they're approximate, if it kills at like 156%, I wrote 155%.

That's fine. I know it's probably hard doing this kind of stuff by yourself. At least it will give us an idea of what the KO % is.

 

[Myollnir]

It's very hard for non-vertical killmoves.

You can rely on these numbers imo. Some of the moves are very difficult to DI properly.