Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Deleted member]

I wish we could get Simon and Bomberman while keeping Snake. Too bad that would be too many third parties.

I've noticed that when it comes to third-parties, of the five I'd like to see (Mega Man, Geno, Tails, Slime and Bomberman), only Mega Man and Geno have even the remote chance of getting in and I highly doubt Geno is getting in. If Mega Man is confirmed at E3 2013 (assuming he's in), I will leave the third-party scene (I'll also hope for Snake and Sonic, but that'll be it for my support of third-parties) and focus only on Nintendo characters.

Ironic how I used to be one of the biggest supporters of third-parties (especially back in 2008/2009) but can now only bring myself to support Mega Man.

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

Robin

Thoughts?

 

[Deleted member]

Robin

Thoughts?

Don't really see it happening and don't want him in anyway. Beside, if we're getting a Robin, it should be this guy:

For those wondering, his name is Robin in Japan.

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

Don't really see it happening and don't want him in anyway. Beside, if we're getting a Robin, it should be this guy:

For those wondering, his name is Robin in Japan.

Yes, but I think Robin at least makes some sense and he/she could be a new class type for Fire Emblem. He/she is behind Micaiah for me in that category.

Also yes Matthew/Adult Isaac should be in.

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

I've noticed that when it comes to third-parties, of the five I'd like to see (Mega Man, Geno, Tails, Slime and Bomberman), only Mega Man and Geno have even the remote chance of getting in and I highly doubt Geno is getting in. If Mega Man is confirmed at E3 2013 (assuming he's in), I will leave the third-party scene (I'll also hope for Snake and Sonic, but that'll be it for my support of third-parties) and focus only on Nintendo characters.

Ironic how I used to be one of the biggest supporters of third-parties (especially back in 2008/2009) but can now only bring myself to support Mega Man.

Mega-Man is my most wanted 3rd party as well, and I assume most people would say the same thing.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

I'm going to throw out my opinion on particular character choices, such as Zoroark vs. Lucario or Mewtwo. When it comes to a series that has several choices, the company will choose something that will hype fans, or something that people will recognize.

In the case of Pokemon, Zoroark , in my honest opinion, will be overlooked when considering the fact that Lucario is still more popular than it, along with the fact that the newest generation (and potential rep) has been revealed, and will eventually overshadow Gen 5. With this in mind, I believe that Smash 4 will give us Lucario and Mewtwo/Newtwo for Pokemon. As for characters such as Ridley, popularity will be the overpowering factor, giving him and several other top characters an advantage.

Other characters, such as Pac-Man or Lloyd Irving will get in depending on whether they get in because of what a developer wants/Sakurai wants, or for advertisement/ hype.

To compare, think of it like this. Would a company choose to advertise something outdated when they have something new? Probably not.

 

[Pazzo.]

I'm going to throw out my opinion on particular character choices, such as Zoroark vs. Lucario or Mewtwo. When it comes to a series that has several choices, the company will choose something that will hype fans, or something that people will recognize.

In the case of Pokemon, Zoroark , in my honest opinion, will be overlooked when considering the fact that Lucario is still more popular than it, along with the fact that the newest generation (and potential rep) has been revealed, and will eventually overshadow Gen 5. With this in mind, I believe that Smash 4 will give us Lucario and Mewtwo/Newtwo for Pokemon. As for characters such as Ridley, popularity will be the overpowering factor, giving him and several other top characters an advantage.

Other characters, such as Pac-Man or Lloyd Irving will get in depending on whether they get in because of what a developer wants/Sakurai wants, or for advertisement/ hype.

To compare, think of it like this. Would a company choose to advertise something outdated when they have something new? Probably not.

That's true, and something overlooked often.

 

[Noler_Mass]

It seems that when people create rosters, there are very few things they can agree on...

I feel like most people agree that king k, Ridley, takamaru, little Mac, and mewtwo will all be in it and shulk, palutena, and Isaac too. I would be surprised if any of them didnt make it.

 

[Noler_Mass]

I've noticed that when it comes to third-parties, of the five I'd like to see (Mega Man, Geno, Tails, Slime and Bomberman), only Mega Man and Geno have even the remote chance of getting in and I highly doubt Geno is getting in. If Mega Man is confirmed at E3 2013 (assuming he's in), I will leave the third-party scene (I'll also hope for Snake and Sonic, but that'll be it for my support of third-parties) and focus only on Nintendo characters.

Ironic how I used to be one of the biggest supporters of third-parties (especially back in 2008/2009) but can now only bring myself to support Mega Man.

Honestly why would you want slime as a character... It's recognizable but moveset wise it would be about as diverse as grimmer from pokemon

 

[Dark Phazon]

I feel like most people agree that king k, Ridley, takamaru, little Mac, and mewtwo will all be in it and shulk, palutena, and Isaac too. I would be surprised if any of them didnt make it.

Thats the suprise though..not a nice one...

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Educated guesses on my prediction roster!
View attachment 458

Cutting Ike and Lucario is dumb, Masked Man is a long shot, as is having TWO characters from Awakening.

Not sure about Paper Mario, Krystal, and Balloon Fighter.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Cutting Ike and Lucario is dumb, Masked Man is a long shot, as is having TWO characters from Awakening.

Not sure about Paper Mario, Krystal, and Balloon Fighter.

Blah I don't feel like arguing about my cuts write now just read what I've said earlier in this thread and the Ike thread and at least try to be open minded. Cuts will likely happen and they are the top candidates so I did what I felt like doing. I added Claus to put diversity into earthbounds roster instead of having two clones. If I had to cut a few from my roster Lucas would get cut before Claus. Robin isn't just from awakening (well the name is) but the tactician more represents the series as a whole. Paper mario is under appreciated, Krystal would have a bit of diversity in the star fox franchise, and balloon fighter is the retro character I support.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Blah I don't feel like arguing about my cuts write now just read what I've said earlier in this thread and the Ike thread and at least try to be open minded. Cuts will likely happen and they are the top candidates so I did what I felt like doing.

I wouldn't have minded cutting Lucario as much if you hadn't put Zoroark in his place. Lucario wasn't just put in because Game Freak wanted to use him to promote Gen 4(Lucario wasn't actually the 1st Gen 4 Pokemon revealed IIRC), but also because he was fairly popular and well received. Zoroark was a blatant attempt by Game Freak to replicate that success, and whatever you think of Zoroark herself she simply hasn't reached that level of popularity.

And Ike getting cut is really dumb. Remember, Ike may not be "relevant"(or whatever the buzzword of the month is) anymore, but he was still popular enough for IS to give him a descendant in Awakening(something that no Lord besides Marth and possibly Alm got). So I think it's unrealistic to expect him to be cut.

I added Claus to put diversity into earthbounds roster instead of having two clones. If I had to cut a few from my roster Lucas would get cut before Claus.

Lucas isn't really a clone. But it's been established you have dumb criteria for evaluating whether characters are clones or not.

Robin isn't just from awakening (well the name is) but the tactician more represents the series as a whole.

...how? The character himself has only been in ONE game, and there have only been player avatars in two other games.

 

[8-peacock-8]

Don't really see it happening and don't want him in anyway. Beside, if we're getting a Robin, it should be this guy:

Fixed

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Blah I don't feel like arguing about my cuts write now just read what I've said earlier in this thread and the Ike thread and at least try to be open minded. Cuts will likely happen and they are the top candidates so I did what I felt like doing. I added Claus to put diversity into earthbounds roster instead of having two clones. If I had to cut a few from my roster Lucas would get cut before Claus. Robin isn't just from awakening (well the name is) but the tactician more represents the series as a whole. Paper mario is under appreciated, Krystal would have a bit of diversity in the star fox franchise, and balloon fighter is the retro character I support.

I disagree with you on a few things. Saying a character can be "unique" is applicable to everyone. It is also something that could prove false. For example, Krystal is perfectly capable of being another clone if it is seen as fit. Mind you, it is unlikely to happen, but that is not a great point to include a character for.

By that same logic, why cut a character for Claus when you can just modify Lucas to not be a clone of Ness? then you have a perfectly unique character without subtracting from the roster.

As far as Fire Emblem, Marth is essentially considered the mascot of the series, so including a character to serve the same purpose is a bit unlikely imo.

I believe that the only characters that have a rather large potential to be axed are Snake and Sonic. Ike and Lucario have proven to be quite popular, and would likely produce quite the uproar if they are removed.

This is only what I believe, so whether you agree or disagree with me is up to you as it is with everyone. Just my two cents.

 

[Noler_Mass]

I wouldn't have minded cutting Lucario as much if you hadn't put Zoroark in his place. Lucario wasn't just put in because Game Freak wanted to use him to promote Gen 4(Lucario wasn't actually the 1st Gen 4 Pokemon revealed IIRC), but also because he was fairly popular and well received. Zoroark was a blatant attempt by Game Freak to replicate that success, and whatever you think of Zoroark herself she simply hasn't reached that level of popularity.

And Ike getting cut is really dumb. Remember, Ike may not be "relevant"(or whatever the buzzword of the month is) anymore, but he was still popular enough for IS to give him a descendant in Awakening(something that no Lord besides Marth and possibly Alm got). So I think it's unrealistic to expect him to be cut.



Lucas isn't really a clone. But it's been established you have dumb criteria for evaluating whether characters are clones or not.



...how? The character himself has only been in ONE game, and there have only been player avatars in two other games.

Okay I'm a bit on edge about zoroark but I just felt like pokemon will likely get a new pokemon from somewhere and zoroark has potential for a fairly unique in his illusion ability. The fact that his game has gone by the wayside does cut his chances. I think that he could get axed especially if mewtwo has two forms with different move sets.

First of all the fact that Ike has a descendant doesn't automatically mean he's popular. In fact he wouldn't be popular at all if it wasn't for brawl and similarly if a different fire emblem character were to appear in ssb4 they would get popular as well. Truth of the matter is PoR and RD did not sell well at all. But enough of this go read the freaking book I wrote about Ike in his veteran thread before you come back or I will judge you.

They could have done better with his moveset. Also I didn't even cut him so be quiet I simply like Claus better. Game needs more villains.

Robin is the tactitian, and the tactitian has been featured in a number of fire emblem games and basically represents you.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Robin is the tactitian, and the tactitian has been featured in a number of fire emblem games and basically represents you.

By "A number" you must mean 3. And he only had a major role in two of those games, one of which was a remake of another game.

Also, the player Avatar in all 3 games is completely different. The Tactician(aka Mark) in Blazing Sword is a non-combatant with basically zero story importance. Kris(MU in New Mystery) has an even less defined than Robin appearance and NO defined playstyle/physical characteristics. Robin is an alleged player Avatar with barely any more customization that any of the other characters in the game.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

Also the idea that a character is only popular from Smash doesn't even matter. They're still popular.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Also the idea that a character is only popular from Smash doesn't even matter. They're still popular.

Plus I'm pretty sure Ike was popular before his appearance in Brawl, but I wasn't around pre-Brawl so I wouldn't be the best source of info in that regard.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Also the idea that a character is only popular from Smash doesn't even matter. They're still popular.

It shouldn't influence the choosing of the characters though. Consider it this way what if the black knight had made brawl instead of Ike? Well then Ike would be a nobody and black knight would make everyone foam at the mouth instead. But instead the black knight sits in the shadow of Ike even though he is the one character who outmatches Ike's badass level in PoR. But I think sakurai doesn't just take popularity of characters into account as we can see from his controversial additions at the time like rob, or mr. Game and watch, or young link. He also isn't afraid to cut characters that don't compliment the series any more even if they are popular for just being in smash like Roy and mewtwo. And since there are new characters that come from more popular games who, if included in ssb4 will end up being just as popular as Ike and will help sell the games and systems that Nintendo is currently trying to sell and could take the adopt the highlights of Ike's moveset into theirs, Ike will be left out.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Plus I'm pretty sure Ike was popular before his appearance in Brawl, but I wasn't around pre-Brawl so I wouldn't be the best source of info in that regard.

He was brought in for recent ness, the same reason Chrom will be in ssb4 and Roy was in ssbm. He was a nobody before brawl.

 

[Deleted member]

He was brought in for recent ness, the same reason Chrom will be in ssb4 and Roy was in ssbm. He was a nobody before brawl.

Neither Roy nor Ike were added because of "recentness". This shows how ignorant you really are.

 

[Deleted member]

He was brought in for recent ness, the same reason Chrom will be in ssb4 and Roy was in ssbm. He was a nobody before brawl.

It wasn't just recentness. Ike had to prove that he would make a popular addition into the cast (and he didn't need to be popular to get in, just have the ingredients to be popular), would be unique, fit in and be able to counter other characters. Sakurai saw Ike as being able to do all that and added him in.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Neither Roy nor Ike were added because of "recentness". This shows how ignorant you really are.

................. Roy's game hadn't even come out yet if it wasn't for recent ness what was it lol it's pretty funny that you think everything I say is wrong.

 

[Deleted member]

It wasn't just recentness. Ike had to prove that he would make a popular addition into the cast (and he didn't need to be popular to get in, just have the ingredients to be popular), would be unique, fit in and be able to counter other characters. Sakurai saw Ike as being able to do all that and added him in.

And a suggestion from IS when he went to them for a character idea. Don't forget that detail.

 

[Noler_Mass]

It wasn't just recentness. Ike had to prove that he would make a popular addition into the cast (and he didn't need to be popular to get in, just have the ingredients to be popular), would be unique, fit in and be able to counter other characters. Sakurai saw Ike as being able to do all that and added him in.

That he was, but the reason he was chosen over all the other fire emblem characters who would've fit into the roster was recentness

 

[Robert of Normandy]

................. Roy's game hadn't even come out yet if it wasn't for recent ness what was it lol it's pretty funny that you think everything I say is wrong.

Roy was added because Sakurai wanted a character that could be a last-minute Marth clone and saw Roy when he went to IS for ideas.. Given that the alternatives were (realistically) Alm, Celice, Leif, and maybe Sigurd, if I were Sakurai I would have gone with Roy as well.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Roy was added because Sakurai wanted a character that could be a last-minute Marth clone and saw Roy when he went to IS for ideas.. Given that the alternatives were (realistically) Alm, Celice, Leif, and maybe Sigurd, if I were Sakurai I would have gone with Roy as well.

Because you knew so much about a character whose game hadn't even been released in Japan yet.
Leif was considered for the game, but was held back because they wanted to advertise Roy because of RECENTNESS

 

[Noler_Mass]

And a suggestion from IS when he went to them for a character idea. Don't forget that detail.

They suggested him because they wanted people to buy their most recent game it's not hard to wrap your head around it really geez

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Because you knew so much about a character whose game hadn't even been released in Japan yet.

But it was in development during the same time as Melee, so yes, Sakurai would have likely had a general idea of what Roys abilities were.

Edit: Also, you should really stop double and triple posting.

 

[Deleted member]

................. Roy's game hadn't even come out yet if it wasn't for recent ness what was it lol it's pretty funny that you think everything I say is wrong.

Exactly.
Roy's game hadn't come out yet. Ergo, it wasn't RECENT.
By the recentness logic, it would have been Leif instead!

And what you say is wrong, because Sakurai said why he went with Roy.
-Roy was not initially going to be in Melee in the first place. Clones were added last minute to help boost the roster.
-Because Sakurai is a fan of Fire Emblem, he went to Intelligent Systems to get approval for another one of their characters to serve as Marth's clone and they gave him a sneak peak at Roy.
-Sakurai saw potential in the character, and believed that Roy had a certain charm that would make people like him. Also, his fire sword stood out more in comparison to the other potential options.
-Sakurai had Roy advertise not only his future game, but the series as a whole, to get people interested in it. (Needless to say, he succeeded.)

They suggested him because they wanted people to buy their most recent game it's not hard to wrap your head around it really geez

You have got to be one of the biggest dumbasses on this forum.

 

[Noler_Mass]

But it was in development during the same time as Melee, so yes, Sakurai would have likely had a general idea of what Roys abilities were.

Because his abilities really stick out from all of the other fire emblem characters hahaha. No I played his game and he is the blandest lord I have ever played as.

 

[Robert of Normandy]

Because his abilities really stick out from all of the other fire emblem characters hahaha. No I played his game and he is the blandest lord I have ever played as.

Must not have played FE5.

Read Goldens post. Sakurai wanted a Marth clone. "Marth w/ fire sword" sure sounds a heck of a lot more interesting than "slightly slower Marth" or whatever Alm/Sigurd/Celice/Leif would have been.

 

[Deleted member]

Because you knew so much about a character whose game hadn't even been released in Japan yet.
Leif was considered for the game, but was held back because they wanted to advertise Roy because of RECENTNESS

Source or shut the **** up.
You want to claim your points as fact, better have a legitimate source to back it up. It's pretty much Sakurai's word against yours. So I suggest you stop posting blatant lies.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Exactly.
Roy's game hadn't come out yet. Ergo, it wasn't RECENT.
By the recentness logic, it would have been Leif instead!

And what you say is wrong, because Sakurai said why he went with Roy.
-Roy was not initially going to be in Melee in the first place. Clones were added last minute to help boost the roster.
-Because Sakurai is a fan of Fire Emblem, he went to Intelligent Systems to get approval for another one of their characters to serve as Marth's clone and they gave him a sneak peak at Roy.
-Sakurai saw potential in the character, and believed that Roy had a certain charm that would make people like him. Also, his fire sword stood out more in comparison to the other potential options.
-Sakurai had Roy advertise not only his future game, but the series as a whole, to get people interested in it. (Needless to say, he succeeded.)


You have got to be one of the biggest *******es on this forum.

I mean at least I'm not insulting anybody.

First of all your blurb at the top is absolutely ridiculous. Obviously if I know that the game hadn't been released yet when Melee came out than I must not have been referring to when the game came out when I said recent. Maybe I could have meant the most recently known about character but oh I couldn't have meant that

And basically your thing at the bottom is saying sakurai needed a clone so IS suggested and supported Roy because oh I don't know maybe RECENTNESS.

Next time you insult someone try to be right

 

[Robert of Normandy]

And basically your thing at the bottom is saying sakurai needed a clone so IS suggested and supported Roy because oh I don't know maybe RECENTNESS.

Sure, maybe that's why IS suggested him. But as GY said in that very post you quoted, that's not why Sakurai chose him.

 

[Deleted member]

Sure, maybe that's why IS suggested him. But as GY said in that very post you quoted, that's not why Sakurai chose him.

This.
It's not like Sakurai is under oath to add whoever's most recent. If he likes the character, he's damn well going to add the character, recent or not.
If Sakurai had not seen potential in Roy, he would not have added him as Marth's clone and would have either gone with someone else or not given Marth a clone.
If Sakurai had not seen an opportunity to turn Ike into a stark contrast to Marth's style, he would not have added him in Brawl.

Aside from that, you haven't really proven yourself to be right Noler, so I can insult your ignorant ass as much as I want (or at least until M&SGuy intervenes).

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I mean at least I'm not insulting anybody.

YES YOU ARE!!!!

Not directly but you're attitude is intolerable. You keep insinuating that since, we do not agree with you that we are somehow lesser human beings.

Really Golden only snaps when:
1. People are douchebags
2. People are idiots

You fall under the first catagory. You have this high and mighty attitude. YOU DON'T cite sources when others have, even when asked and you won't accept some facts.

Frankly I'm confused as to why Golden did snap at you sooner.

 

[Noler_Mass]

Sure, maybe that's why IS suggested him. But as GY said in that very post you quoted, that's not why Sakurai chose him.

Sounds like sakurai chose him because IS showed him off really well and convinced sakurai he would make a good character in the game so they could get better sales fo their most recent game.

If someone else wants to keep this discussion going in a more open minded manner I'm all for it but I'm not responding to GY anymore because he has succeeded in pissing the living **** out of me. You got anger management issues bro. It's a game and I'm merely voicing my opinion on the topic

 

[Deleted member]

YES YOU ARE!!!!

Not directly but you're attitude is intolerable. You keep insinuating that since, we do not agree with you that we are somehow lesser human beings.

Really Golden only snaps when:
1. People are douchebags
2. People are idiots

You fall under the first catagory. You have this high and mighty attitude. YOU DON'T cite sources when others have, even when asked and you won't accept some facts.

Frankly I'm confused as to why Golden did snap at you sooner.

I did; a few pages ago when he kept arguing that Mewtwo and Lucario are the same (arguing that only "competitive" people know the difference despite me posting a clear video in how they have very little matching moves), and because Lucario was recent, he replaced Mewtwo who wasn't recent (despite, you know, Gen 1 Pokémon Trainer being added despite not being a recent character, and Jigglypuff was also a low priority character like Mewtwo), and the opposite is going to happen for the next game since Mewtwo is "recent" again while Lucario is not (despite you know, B/W2 advertising Lucario, Lucario being a heavily marketable Pokémon still, making an appearance in the anime earlier this year, mascot for the Pokémon Smash television show, etc.).

So in reality, he fits both categories.

Sounds like sakurai chose him because IS showed him off really well and convinced sakurai he would make a good character in the game so they could get better sales fo their most recent game.

Sounds to me you're still thicker than a brick wall.
Sakurai isn't some sheep; if he likes the character, he's going to add him. If he doesn't like the character, he's not going to add him despite constant "persuasion".

If someone else wants to keep this discussion going in a more open minded manner I'm all for it but I'm not responding to GY anymore because he has succeeded in pissing the living **** out of me. You got anger management issues bro. It's a game and I'm merely voicing my opinion on the topic

HAH. Your opinion? Bull****; that ain't no opinion, bro. You're stating your beliefs as undeniable fact when you have no backup to your claims other than "durr it obvious dude *sucks thumb* herp"
And I've succeed in pissing the living **** out of you? Good. NOW YOU KNOW HOW I FEEL WHENEVER YOU POST.

And if being driven to the point of insanity by a clueless idiot counts as anger issues, then the entire world has anger issues. So yeah, go ahead and don't reply to me anymore. You'd be doing me a service.