The blade of two fates - Marth/Lucina guide

[EternalFlame]

I'm curious as to how people feel about this game and the shield stun being so low. I feel like as a Marth player it limits our potential a lot. I feel like no matter what im doing I'm never truly safe, because shield throw always punishes. So, what do you all feel is a reasonable solution to this problem or how do you deal with opponents who are very patient and use shield grab to punish down tilts and all.

Now that is indeed a tricky question, especially considering that I fight a very defensive player. that I still struggle against. The advantage that we have as Marth is our ability to outreach and outspeed. Emblem Lord makes a good point that through the usage of dtilt, that's one of your safest poking tools that don't get punished, along with the shield jump cancel + Dolphin Slash. But as for being unable to play Marth agressively is a bit debatable.

Indeed, Marth has a lot of commitment, but approaches like SH FAir/NAir can be safe as long as you don't stop infront of your opponent. What I usually do is SH Forward, attack with one of the above, then back off once I see the attack hit the shield. As long as you are in the air, you still have control over your momentum. We can take this a step further through the usage of the FAir assault strategy I wrote on; protecting your FAir landing with a b move as you land. Unless your opponent is incredibly fast like Shiek or Sonic, most opponents will be unable to punish a shield breaker before you land, or at best, will break their shield. I've broken a good number of shields through this method, and even without actually hitting with it, it keeps your opponent at a sword's length, which a lot of the cast can't easily close the distance of. Another thing you can do is cross up using FAir, go overhead, then reverse b SB or DB. SB will make them fear blocking, and if you tip with it, you either will shatter their shield or keep them in block stun and spaced well that they can't punish you back.

Another way to get them is to fake them out with the SH DB setup. As you stall infront of your opponent, they may take it as an opportunity to attack, but you'll usually get to act first if you spaced them right. It's one part a luring into false security, and a second part strong setup tool.

A major point that Emblem Lord and many other Marths stress on is spacing. Marth's movements now have more commitment than ever before, but as long as you keep your target at a sword's length, you should be able to pressure and punish more than your opponents can answer to.

Since this is really the first Smash I'm taking to a semi competitive level, I don't have much complaints about it. Since playing fast games like BBCP and more calculated movements like in SF, this sort of stuff I don't feel is too difficult to adjust to. I just play to make my opponents act how I want them to, or just download their patterns if I am able xD

That defensive player I fight against (Hukster) is amazing at punishing and stuff with grabs and the whole chilada. Once I get more free time to record, I'll do a few matches with him, and I'll show off what I do against defensive players. Anyways, hope this helps

 

[Kinslayer]

Your d-tilt shouldnt be getting punished. You shouldnt be getting shield grabbed ever. That tells me you are too close. BTW low shield stun is why Marth can Dolphin Slash punish virtually anything that touches his shield. And as you said only a few moves from each char is truly safe. So find out what isnt and punish your opponents for it. Marth is one of the best defensive chars. If balls out aggression is your thing Marth is not the character you want to play.

Here we go with the not needed stuff. I was asking because i just finished a set, and while yes I did win i seemed to have my d-tilts punished and my down tilts were being shielded> dash grab by sonic and pit.

I never said balls out aggression was my thing so don't go with the Marth might not be the character for you stuff. I was asking is there a way to make my pressure/bulldogging a little safer.
I never have issues punishing other people because marth makes that very very easy. I asked how do I prevent myself from being punished on shield a bit more consistently.

Also, it was slightly laggy with spikes, but not extremely horribly. It did make it hard to tipper however.

@ EternalFlame : Thank you for your amazing advice. I main kof as my main game so a lot of adjustments are easy to make. Only thing as I said that is odd in this game to me is the low amounts of block stun and it gets even lower with power shielding meaning we can be exposed on basically everything if blocked properly.

Also I have 85% win rate in for glory so I know how to do it, but I was curious on if you had a more consistent way to beat defensive/patient players who consistently punish things.

 

[EternalFlame]

Here we go with the not needed stuff. I was asking because i just finished a set, and while yes I did win i seemed to have my d-tilts punished and my down tilts were being shielded> dash grab by sonic and pit.

I never said balls out aggression was my thing so don't go with the Marth might not be the character for you stuff. I was asking is there a way to make my pressure/bulldogging a little safer.
I never have issues punishing other people because marth makes that very very easy. I asked how do I prevent myself from being punished on shield a bit more consistently.

Also, it was slightly laggy with spikes, but not extremely horribly. It did make it hard to tipper however.

@ EternalFlame : Thank you for your amazing advice. I main kof as my main game so a lot of adjustments are easy to make. Only thing as I said that is odd in this game to me is the low amounts of block stun and it gets even lower with power shielding meaning we can be exposed on basically everything if blocked properly.

Also I have 85% win rate in for glory so I know how to do it, but I was curious on if you had a more consistent way to beat defensive/patient players who consistently punish things.

Ouch, yeah, Sonic or any speed character in general will be very troublesome if they play defensive against Marth. As safe as Dtilts usually, speed characters can close that said sword's length quite easily, and if not perfectly spaced, they will get you. Anyone that can match Marth's speed, range, or both, tend to make Marths fight harder than usual. Marth's commitments make it really difficult to pressure speed characters, even with what I've mentioned. I'll have to go out and fight some Sonics and Shieks so I can try figure something out. Don't help that Marth gets hit hard in lag, especially the way I fight with him.

As for Pit, the principle of him having a projectile that can curve can be a bit troublesome, but the fact that he has similar reach adds to the troubles. The dash cancel shielding will be essential, as I'm sure you've used, for approaching anything projectile based. Though I think Pit can be bested by outspeeding him with your attacks, and keep the pressure going (though this is based on fighting 2 Pit players only, so take it with a grain of salt xD). What you could do is run in with the dash cancel shield, then cancel the shield by either grabbing or SH. Don't give him any breathing room and make him make the mistakes you want. But remember that I play Marth passive agressive, so it may or may not suit your playstyle preferences xD

Also sweet, another KOF fan xD I practice 98 and 13 myself, which just have lots of hitstun/blockstun to work with. But yeah, classic fighters usually have blockstrings that keep the offensive player safe, but in Smash, it is much different as a fighter due to the out of shield cancels and such. I sorta treat power shielding the equivalent of SF3rd Strike parrying - cancels the danger of the immediate move, but doesn't necessarily stop the threat of the next one coming behind it. But the advantage in Smash is that though we commit to a move, it doesn't need to be always unsafe. You really have to get into your opponents head, and continue to build on your fundamentals. Fundamentals in Smash, unlike classic fighters, I find is 50% of the gameplay due to lack of extensive combos or blockstrings.

 

[Emblem Lord]

Edit: Nevermind

 

[Kinslayer]

Ouch, yeah, Sonic or any speed character in general will be very troublesome if they play defensive against Marth. As safe as Dtilts usually, speed characters can close that said sword's length quite easily, and if not perfectly spaced, they will get you. Anyone that can match Marth's speed, range, or both, tend to make Marths fight harder than usual. Marth's commitments make it really difficult to pressure speed characters, even with what I've mentioned. I'll have to go out and fight some Sonics and Shieks so I can try figure something out. Don't help that Marth gets hit hard in lag, especially the way I fight with him.

As for Pit, the principle of him having a projectile that can curve can be a bit troublesome, but the fact that he has similar reach adds to the troubles. The dash cancel shielding will be essential, as I'm sure you've used, for approaching anything projectile based. Though I think Pit can be bested by outspeeding him with your attacks, and keep the pressure going (though this is based on fighting 2 Pit players only, so take it with a grain of salt xD). What you could do is run in with the dash cancel shield, then cancel the shield by either grabbing or SH. Don't give him any breathing room and make him make the mistakes you want. But remember that I play Marth passive agressive, so it may or may not suit your playstyle preferences xD

Also sweet, another KOF fan xD I practice 98 and 13 myself, which just have lots of hitstun/blockstun to work with. But yeah, classic fighters usually have blockstrings that keep the offensive player safe, but in Smash, it is much different as a fighter due to the out of shield cancels and such. I sorta treat power shielding the equivalent of SF3rd Strike parrying - cancels the danger of the immediate move, but doesn't necessarily stop the threat of the next one coming behind it. But the advantage in Smash is that though we commit to a move, it doesn't need to be always unsafe. You really have to get into your opponents head, and continue to build on your fundamentals. Fundamentals in Smash, unlike classic fighters, I find is 50% of the gameplay due to lack of extensive combos or blockstrings.

Trust me I have good fundamentals, you can't play kof without them especislly at then level I play at.lol I play a lot of kof games 94, 98,02, 02 um, 13 is my main tourney game and the one im most known in the fgc for. I play Duo Lon/Claw Iori/Terry so I know all about spacing. Kof is a game of mind games and that's no different than in smash, but I do truely feel at times the shield stun is a little low. However, I absolutely understand that what you're saying and i truely agree.

When you say passive aggressive do you mean defensive until you get a hit and then rush them down after you have them off balance?

 

[EternalFlame]

Trust me I have good fundamentals. You can't play kof without them especislly at then level I play at.lol I playy a lot of kof games 94, 98,02, 02 um, 13 is my main tourney game and the one im most known in the fgc for. I play Duo Lon/Claw Iori/Terry so I know all about spacing. Kof is a game of mind games and that's no different than an smash, but I do truely feel at times the shield stun is a little low. However I absolutely understand that what you're saying and i truely agree.

When you say passive aggressive do you mean defensive until you get a hit and then rush them down after you have them off balance?

Well, when I say fundamentals, its Smash specific fundamentals xD General fighting game fundamentals transfer through quite well, but things like using the out of shield options, single attack poking and backing off, and just general movement between platforms, ledges, and midair. Blockstun, as far as I can tell with Smash, it's never been much of a thing except in the case of Project M and perhaps Melee (though in both cases, it has to do with the attack speed over actual blockstun, so the blockstrings are just hard to break out of). I feel like its a good enough balance in 4, and more than any of the others before it, I know I can dedicate myself to this Smash.

I don't play KOF to a particularly high level, but I like to think I do well enough on it xD I'm a EX Kyo, Kim, and Andy/Elisabeth. Granted, I'm yet to fight an opponent to push me farther than I currently am at in terms of ability, so the need to practice hasn't arisen in a while. It's good you already play a different fighter at a high level, as you've mentioned, some of the skills transfer over nicely.

As for passive agressive, its the best way my friends describe my playing style. I tend to pressure alot, and I switch between defensive and offensive styles often until I see a favourable reaction from my opponent. That's also why I'm deemed a download player, as I lose alot until I see a pattern to follow and exploit. The agressive side comes from once I find that weak point, I keep exploiting it and act ahead of where they would normally go (regardless of which style they tilt towards). Guess we could just call it adapting to the player more than the character, since I can lose miserably once they break their patterns or just go for something completely random xD

 

[Kinslayer]

Well, when I say fundamentals, its Smash specific fundamentals xD General fighting game fundamentals transfer through quite well, but things like using the out of shield options, single attack poking and backing off, and just general movement between platforms, ledges, and midair. Blockstun, as far as I can tell with Smash, it's never been much of a thing except in the case of Project M and perhaps Melee (though in both cases, it has to do with the attack speed over actual blockstun, so the blockstrings are just hard to break out of). I feel like its a good enough balance in 4, and more than any of the others before it, I know I can dedicate myself to this Smash.

I don't play KOF to a particularly high level, but I like to think I do well enough on it xD I'm a EX Kyo, Kim, and Andy/Elisabeth. Granted, I'm yet to fight an opponent to push me farther than I currently am at in terms of ability, so the need to practice hasn't arisen in a while. It's good you already play a different fighter at a high level, as you've mentioned, some of the skills transfer over nicely.

As for passive agressive, its the best way my friends describe my playing style. I tend to pressure alot, and I switch between defensive and offensive styles often until I see a favourable reaction from my opponent. That's also why I'm deemed a download player, as I lose alot until I see a pattern to follow and exploit. The agressive side comes from once I find that weak point, I keep exploiting it and act ahead of where they would normally go (regardless of which style they tilt towards). Guess we could just call it adapting to the player more than the character, since I can lose miserably once they break their patterns or just go for something completely random xD

The yolo randomness gets everyone man don't feel bad! One time I was reading this mr karate so hard, it was 3-1 karate and was his last character. This man empty hopped DPd me, did drive cancel to cadallic kick, then level 2 super. The yolo saved his soul

 

[EternalFlame]

The yolo randomness gets everyone man don't feel bad! One time I was reading this mr karate so hard, it was 3-1 karate and was his last character. This man empty hopped DPd me, did drive cancel to cadallic kick, then level 2 super. The yolo saved his soul

The power of yolo is great indeed xD Speaking of which, maybe we should have a match or two on 13 sometime, just to see if it'll be motivation enough to practice it again. Of course, playing Smash too would be just as fun, since I need more ditto experience, as well as more recording material for my youtube channel xD

Though we can discuss that in PMs (or conversations as they call it here xD)

@ Emblem Lord
I didn't get to say this earlier, but I do appreciate the help with answering the question brought up by Kinslayer. I believe that you meant well, as you were trying to narrow down the problem and all.

 

[Kinslayer]

I Curious about how you choose to approach and deal with yoshi. It seems his tongue readh on his grab gets us on a lot of things especially when we extend our hitboxes out for attacks, his egg throw is good for rushing in on us and defensive uses as well.

 

[EternalFlame]

I Curious about how you choose to approach and deal with yoshi. It seems his tongue readh on his grab gets us on a lot of things especially when we extend our hitboxes out for attacks, his egg throw is good for rushing in on us and defensive uses as well.

I imagine I'd do the usual FAir assault and SH DB to bait out forms of retaliation, and figure out where exactly their hitboxes are. FAir assault will likely be the one I use to keep myself from being grabbed then poke them from trying. One important trick is that going overhead version, since it is harder for opponents to effectively turn around and grab, so mixing it up between poke and back off and poke and go overhead if grabbing is the main tactic the Yoshi goes for.

Keep in mind its all hypothetical, since my MU experience with Yoshi is limited. Yoshi's speed is fairly decent, and has the kind that will almost keep up with Marth's That said, it may be favourable to go a bit more defensive against him at first until the Yoshi's pattern's have been identified. But that's all I've got on it atm xD

 

[Crawfish]

while we are talking about marth dtilt lemme tell you this story about how jigglypuff's jab beat marth's dtilt

 

[Emblem Lord]

Hitbox interaction. Its a thing. Depending when you hit a button and which buttons you and your opponent choose youmight lose in a poking battle.

Also known as footsies.

Had you done your own jab or ftilt you may have stuffed her completely. No way to be certain 100% of the time. Spacing us also a huge factor.

 

[EternalFlame]

while we are talking about marth dtilt lemme tell you this story about how jigglypuff's jab beat marth's dtilt

Hitbox interaction. Its a thing. Depending when you hit a button and which buttons you and your opponent choose youmight lose in a poking battle.

Also known as footsies.

Had you done your own jab or ftilt you may have stuffed her completely. No way to be certain 100% of the time. Spacing us also a huge factor.

Well, in order to properly analyse it, I do need as much details as possible on how exactly it happened xD But it is very likely as Emblem Lord said about hitbox intereaction. We have to factor in the attack speed of both, the time of hitbox activation, and the priority of the moves. There's also character positioning and latency to factor in as well. Typically, Jigglypuff should never beat your poke on the spacing principle alone, so it should come down to a matter of speed and reaction time.


On another note, my responses will be rather slow now due to finals approaching at my university. So I will try to get to people's questions when I can, but please understand that my hands will be tied for the next couple of weeks. I do have videos already set to be uploaded in the future, so I will at least make updates on when those happen.

 

[Crawfish]

Hitbox interaction. Its a thing. Depending when you hit a button and which buttons you and your opponent choose youmight lose in a poking battle.

Also known as footsies.

Had you done your own jab or ftilt you may have stuffed her completely. No way to be certain 100% of the time. Spacing us also a huge factor.

but she has a nub, and i have a sword 3:< i wasn't in her face either. but yeah, i actually realized how jab is sometimes better than dtilt, in order to beat shiek perfect wavedash from ledge grab into dtilt, her dtilt beats marth's in that space(edgeguarding) but jab keeps marths hurtbox away from her attack while still clanking if not hitting her.
woops, this ain't a melee thread. but i'm sure this kind of situation can still apply in smash 4. but seriously, jiggly nub>falchion? wtf

 

[Emblem Lord]

I mean if you are really feeling yourself just do dancing blade or shieldbreaker. Will beat any limb on the ground head on. Only way you lose is if they stuff you on start up or catch your hand.

 

[Bullys]

Thanks for the guide, I decided to switch to Marth (still quite new at sm4sh, so its not really destroying much time I'd put in to Capt. Falcon, will just use him as an alt) - this guide really helped the learning curve, weed out the things I was using that I shouldn't and getting me to practice better set ups and strings.

 

[EternalFlame]

Thanks for the guide, I decided to switch to Marth (still quite new at sm4sh, so its not really destroying much time I'd put in to Capt. Falcon, will just use him as an alt) - this guide really helped the learning curve, weed out the things I was using that I shouldn't and getting me to practice better set ups and strings.

Glad to be of service xD I'm also quite new to the competitive scene myself, but a month's practice with info gathered here and there really helped put this guide together. Just keep in mind that some setups/combos I've put out here are not of the usual Marth (more unorthodox by how I see it really xD). This can be both good and bad, but the important thing is developing your style from this info.

I look forward to seeing what you'll be able to do with this ^^

 

[Mangoh862]

Lo! and Behold! I have found it! the thing I have been searching for! A Marth Combo guide for Sm4sh!!! (thanks for making this EternalFlame! you da man!)

 

[EternalFlame]

Lo! and Behold! I have found it! the thing I have been searching for! A Marth Combo guide for Sm4sh!!! (thanks for making this EternalFlame! you da man!)

Haha, glad to be of service dude xD

Anyways...
UPDATE NOTICE :V

Here's what's new guys:

• The SH DB loop has been further explained in the Nair/Uair combo and SH DB sections.
• Additions to the DB setup have also been put in.
• 2 new videos for Marth are up on YT
• Additions to the Dthrow has a new followup after BAir
• Additions to the attack strings section to reflect recent discoveries

Also @ Kinslayer , the videos for Marth may be of interest to you especially. That Ness player is the defensive player I mentioned to you before. So if you want to see my more current gameplay against that type of player, best to check that out xD

 

[Crawfish]

first hit tipper nair combos into usmash, true combo according to tureiningu modu.
tipper uair "true combos" into lot's of stuff, even dtilt at really low %.
like Tipper uair>db, all four hits.

 

[EternalFlame]

first hit tipper nair combos into usmash, true combo according to tureiningu modu.
tipper uair "true combos" into lot's of stuff, even dtilt at really low %.
like Tipper uair>db, all four hits.

The first one I actually did not know about xD good find there.
EDIT: Oh I forgot, this one actually doesn't combo. By the game's standards, Up Smash counts as two hits (one to pick up the opponent, the second to hit them up). I thought it was a combo once before, but unfortunately that wasn't the case ^^"

As for the second one, I was quite aware of that, though that dtilt/Full DB followup I did not put in xD I'll put that in soon enough. Thanks for catching that ^^
EDIT AGAIN: I forgot I typed up on the Full DB followup already xD But that dtilt was definitely missed and has been credited to you for it xD

 

[Kinslayer]

Has anyone else heard that with the c stick we still can't do true retreating fairs?apparently the c-stick now cancels the backward momentum much like on the 3ds, so you still have to go forward first and the back wars. I've been hearing this and it slightly bothers me.

 

[EternalFlame]

Has anyone else heard that with the c stick we still can't do true retreating fairs?apparently the c-stick now cancels the backward momentum much like on the 3ds, so you still have to go forward first and the back wars. I've been hearing this and it slightly bothers me.

You mean with keeping momentum while you do a FAir? Yeah, not too sure to be honest. All the physics and mechanics are exactly the same, with the exception that the c stick is a bit picky of when it will do the smashes over tilts (from a friends POV, not my own since I don't use the GCC)

Edit: dun goofed on reading that, post was corrected xD

 

[Crawfish]

Has anyone else heard that with the c stick we still can't do true retreating fairs?apparently the c-stick now cancels the backward momentum much like on the 3ds, so you still have to go forward first and the back wars. I've been hearing this and it slightly bothers me.

that's in brawl and pm too, you should still be able to

 

[warionumbah2]

If you want to keep the momentum in the air just flick the c stick really quick.

 

[Kinslayer]

If you want to keep the momentum in the air just flick the c stick really quick.

Does that work in this game? I hear some people saying it doesn't

 

[EternalFlame]

Does that work in this game? I hear some people saying it doesn't

Well, hopefully it does work, though my controller preferences have trained me to do it without the c-stick, so I cannot say with any certainty. When I can I'll see if I can test it for you, though I'm sure someone should be able to confirm it for you before I do xD

 

[warionumbah2]

Does that work in this game? I hear some people saying it doesn't

some guys posted a video on it and he was using Marth too lemme find it.try searching cobbs games on youtube can't post it on my phone.

 

[Kinslayer]

Well, hopefully it does work, though my controller preferences have trained me to do it without the c-stick, so I cannot say with any certainty. When I can I'll see if I can test it for you, though I'm sure someone should be able to confirm it for you before I do xD

If it works we should be able to move back further than before making our fairs safer than before. That's the only reason I'm interested.

 

[Crawfish]

just wait a little before you attack! D: i can do it fine, like i said, the same stupid **** is in pm and brawl

 

[Crawfish]

nvm, i have an easier time using A to do retreating fairs, holy moly, this is weird, no big deal any way, you can't do retreating nairs with c-stick btw, has anyone done a nair with their c-stick? idk if it's just this wonky pro controller but i've accidentally done a nair with the c-stick like, 5 times.

 

[EternalFlame]

nvm, i have an easier time using A to do retreating fairs, holy moly, this is weird, no big deal any way, you can't do retreating nairs with c-stick btw, has anyone done a nair with their c-stick? idk if it's just this wonky pro controller but i've accidentally done a nair with the c-stick like, 5 times.

The joys of new tech trying to be old tech xD I've had a friend try for DSmashes and he gets Dtilts instead. Can't tell if he's just tapping it wrong or something, but he is the Smash guy in my local group, so I don't question his legitimacy in that department.

Maybe the c-stick implementation is slightly buggy?

Also guys, got a new section up for reading if you're all interested. I'll make an official update notice later on though once I'm done adding a bit more to it or I make those edits to reflect Lucina as part of the guide.

 

[LIQUID12A]

Wouldn't this be fitting, well, as a Guide in the Guides section?

Jus sayin.

 

[EternalFlame]

Wouldn't this be fitting, well, as a Guide in the Guides section?

Jus sayin.

tl:dr It started as just a list of setups, combos and strategies, but I eventually formed it into a guide xD But I got the story below if you care to read it

Spoiler

When I first made this thread, I hadn't put it as a guide since I didn't think to press it as far as I have. But eventually, through watching the positive responses I got from this post, and wanting to share my own point of view of learning Marth (as I was relatively new to competitive Smash at the time), I just went for it.

Of course, running out of new discoveries was another motivation xD Needed some new material to write up on, and I can't lie about that. But I also figured a beginners perspective alongside the experiences I've gained from fighters in general over the years would be helpful in the learning process for others. So even if I only help one or two players on their way, I'd say I've done my part for the Smash community - especially this early on in Marth's new meta development.

The actual title did not change until two days ago, so at this point I've resigned myself to turning it into a complete guide. Now I'm speaking with a moderator in regards to how I should proceed; whether to keep it in its current format and have a link in the guide section, or transfer all of the info to the guide section and make an update post or something here.

EDIT: Speaking of which, said moderator just told me it's up to me now. So I'll think about it for a bit before I make my choice on how to proceed. I'm currently thinking to just post a link in the guides section to here (or post a copy then update that a little less frequently for less hassle), since I like the opportunity for conversation/questions and being able to notify people of changes simply by bringing it back up on the Marth board.

 

[LIQUID12A]

tl:dr It started as just a list of setups, combos and strategies, but I eventually formed it into a guide xD

*stuff*

EDIT: Speaking of which, said moderator just told me it's up to me now. So I'll think about it for a bit before I make my choice on how to proceed. I'm currently thinking to just post a link in the guides section to here (or post a copy then update that a little less frequently for less hassle), since I like the opportunity for conversation/questions and being able to notify people of changes simply by bringing it back up on the Marth board.

When you make a guide, a thread is created in that character's board alongside it that auto-updates when you post a guide update, but otherwise functions like a normal thread, alerting people when it updates, quoting and posting and blah blah stuff and all that jazz.

I mean, that's just me. If you feel it's ether as it is, well, more power to you.

 

[EternalFlame]

When you make a guide, a thread is created in that character's board alongside it that auto-updates when you post a guide update, but otherwise functions like a normal thread, alerting people when it updates, quoting and posting and blah blah stuff and all that jazz.

I mean, that's just me.

Oh does it? Didn't know that. Though it'd be a waste to disgard what is currently here, along with my habit of making small edits before making an update announcement may make it a bit annoying for people to monitor (not that I'd really mind it myself). Would be nice to just convert the current thread as a guide post or just have this thread listed under the guides thread, but I'm not even sure that's possible.

Another problematic point is that it will be addressed to both Marth and Lucina players, so it showing up on one or the other boards is a bit troubling (though my current work around is just having an update thread on the Lucina board side).

 

[LIQUID12A]

Oh does it? Didn't know that. Though it'd be a waste to disgard what is currently here, along with my habit of making small edits before making an update announcement may make it a bit annoying for people to monitor (not that I'd really mind it myself). Would be nice to just convert the current thread as a guide post or just have this thread listed under the guides thread, but I'm not even sure that's possible.

Another problematic point is that it will be addressed to both Marth and Lucina players, so it showing up on one or the other boards is a bit troubling (though my current work around is just having an update thread on the Lucina board side).

To me, a guide that simply says something akin to "here's a guide, but the guide isn't here, it's in this linked thread" is pointless. It'd be possible to make a post here saying "hey, I'm making this an actual guide, but the thread created alongside it will serve the same purpose and all discussion will be moved there.", but that is ultimately dependent on how you manage the situation.

And honestly, not to stop your efforts, but Lucina already has a full fledged guide; hell, it's a top guide, featured in the sidebar for how many positive ratings it has. I think you should keep the guide strictly about Marth.

 

[EternalFlame]

To me, a guide that simply says something akin to "here's a guide, but the guide isn't here, it's in this linked thread" is pointless. It'd be possible to make a post here saying "hey, I'm making this an actual guide, but the thread created alongside it will serve the same purpose and all discussion will be moved there.", but that is ultimately dependent on how you manage the situation.

And honestly, not to stop your efforts, but Lucina already has a full fledged guide; hell, it's a top guide, featured in the sidebar for how many positive ratings it has. I think you should keep the guide strictly about Marth.

Yeah, that's just the troubling thing really xD I may be overcomplicating the situation to be honest, but I'll take some time to think about it, though what you've said sounds pretty good.

I certainly understand that Lucina has a full guide of her own and I can respect that. But on the same point, some of the setups and combos I do are a bit more unconventional, but are applicable to both Marth and Lucina. Perhaps if I make a disclaimer saying "this is also applicable to Lucina" or just edit inbetween each section for Lucina's applications, which keeping it focused on Marth may work well too. I don't think I'd go to the same lengths of putting in damage percentages and the like compared to the Lucina guide, but what I learned is unique enough I believe that Lucina should be shown to be capable of doing it as well.

 

[LIQUID12A]

Yeah, that's just the troubling thing really xD I may be overcomplicating the situation to be honest, but I'll take some time to think about it, though what you've said sounds pretty good.

I certainly understand that Lucina has a full guide of her own and I can respect that. But on the same point, some of the setups and combos I do are a bit more unconventional, but are applicable to both Marth and Lucina. Perhaps if I make a disclaimer saying "this is also applicable to Lucina" or just edit inbetween each section for Lucina's applications, which keeping it focused on Marth may work well too. I don't think I'd go to the same lengths of putting in damage percentages and the like compared to the Lucina guide, but what I learned is unique enough I believe that Lucina should be shown to be capable of doing it as well.

I mean, don't take my word for it, since it all boils down to your personal preference. I'm just explaining what you probably didn't know.

That bold part is pretty much what I'd do myself.

 

[EternalFlame]

I mean, don't take my word for it, since it all boils down to your personal preference. I'm just explaining what you probably didn't know.

That bold part is pretty much what I'd do myself.

And I appreciate the help dude xD I'll figure it out, and I'm thankful for your suggestion. I'll make up my mind soon enough, I want to just check one final option before I do.