The truth about Brawl and why it will fail

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

So basically, people are bashing Brawl just because it's fun? Stupid reason if you asked me.

 

[Iwan]

All of you "Anti-Brawl" people are so f****** hilarious.

The brawl ladders (doubles and singles) are the second most popular game at gamebattles.com, second only to Halo 3.

There are 1600 teams.
There are more singles players.

Guess who runs GB? MLG.

They'll pick up the game for the circuit after the first event. Anyone who thinks otherwise isn't thinking things through. Brawl is already HUGE, the traffic for brawl at GB is huge...and sunny (sundance...if you dont know who he is dont ask) knows this. MLG is a business, with a goal of making money. And picking up brawl will make them money. LOTS of money.

Because on a competitive level, the turnouts for brawl would already dorf those of ANY previous Melee tournament. Period.

What's my point? Brawl isn't going to fail, its going to blow up...they'll be huge tournaments run by MLG, EVO...whatever.

Competitive brawl is already here, and its only going to get bigger. You can't argue this with the point "uhh...no it sucks".

If you think it sucks, don't come to tournaments.
Don't win anything.
Don't compete.
Keep playing melee.

and for the love of god.

shutup.

you people are turning these boards into a joke.

 

[Avalon262]

All of you "Anti-Brawl" people are so f****** hilarious.

The brawl ladders (doubles and singles) are the second most popular game at gamebattles.com, second only to Halo 3.

There are 1600 teams.
There are more singles players.

Guess who runs GB? MLG.

They'll pick up the game for the circuit after the first event. Anyone who thinks otherwise isn't thinking things through. Brawl is already HUGE, the traffic for brawl at GB is huge...and sunny (sundance...if you dont know who he is dont ask) knows this. MLG is a business, with a goal of making money. And picking up brawl will make them money. LOTS of money.

Because on a competitive level, the turnouts for brawl would already dorf those of ANY previous Melee tournament. Period.

What's my point? Brawl isn't going to fail, its going to blow up...they'll be huge tournaments run by MLG, EVO...whatever.

Competitive brawl is already here, and its only going to get bigger. You can't argue this with the point "uhh...no it sucks".

If you think it sucks, don't come to tournaments.
Don't win anything.
Don't compete.
Keep playing melee.

and for the love of god.

shutup.

you people are turning these boards into a joke.

Too late, this board is already a joke. You would think people would get tired of talking about it after a week but no, its still a hot topic with no end in site. Melee has given most of these players a competitive mindset and if a game doesn't meet their competitive needs, the game fails.

 

[RedMage8BT]

It's really only the SW***s that are *****ing about Brawl. Everyone else is enjoying the game and real competitive circuits are accepting it.

 

[Lawlb0t]

Guess who made that competitive scene noob? Thats one of the reasons why we are pissed off. Bringing up MLG if anything supports us. lmfao.

 

[Super Wec]

good melee players went to brawl, they fought online and lost every time. So the game sucks

 

[RedMage8BT]

Guess who made that competitive scene noob? Thats one of the reasons why we are pissed off. Bringing up MLG if anything supports us. lmfao.

So you're pissed about real professionals stealing you're precious competitive scene? Then Smash Boarders even more like children then I thought. Except, they're not. It's just you and all the other n00bs. The actual pros aren't calling Brawl a "failure", they're playing the game and having fun. Maybe they aren't playing competitively, and that's their choice. Once you actually make a name for yourself, then you'll have the right to call me a n00b.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Personally, I think that anyone who says that Brawl sucks and/or fails must be sick in the head. It's a successful game that needs time for players to get used to.

 

[Sonic XD]

Personally, I think that anyone who says that Brawl sucks and/or fails must be sick in the head. It's a successful game that needs time for players to get used to.

You are correct.

 

[Iwan]

Guess who made that competitive scene noob? Thats one of the reasons why we are pissed off. Bringing up MLG if anything supports us. lmfao.

I'm well aware that MLG did jack **** for Smash. In fact it did next to nothing for it. The smash community MADE competitive melee and will do the same for brawl. I'm aware of this.

But the point i made was that serious tournaments are still going to happen, and *****ing about it non-stop isn't going to stop that. I never questioned who, how, or why competitive smash happened and who made the biggest contribution. I just stated that competitive brawl is big, will be big, and will be a staple in competitive gaming until the next one comes out.

And if you guys are so pissed off about it, don't compete.

you act like competitive melee was made overnight anyway...it wasn't. It took years.

The same thing will happen for brawl. Give it time, one day there could be super WDshing, mega r-canceling....wutever. Who the **** knows man.

But until then, can't you work on getting the physics, game mechanics, and other aspects of the game down?

Instead of complaining?

 

[SmashBro99]

The guy who posted right after Gimpy knows his ****.

 

[mario brawler]

Why does this game have to be like everything else. The man had a vision this game was his artwork and it got intrepreted in a way he didnt intend and that wasnt the message he wanted to give out. So he changed it. Good for him, if i didnt like it i'd sell it. The game is meant for fun, fun. That why he made it. Im having fun reguardless of techs. So if your not having fun move on. It entertainment thats all.

that's what I've been tryin to say all this time,YOU DONT NEED TO TELL SAK HOW TO DO HIS JOB PEOPLE!

Fun fact: the Smash Bros. series are not real fighting games, like those others you mentioned. True fighting games are designed with fair, balanced competition in mind. Smash obviously was not. Just because people play 1v1 on Final Destination with no items, that doesn't make it on par with a Street Fighter game for instance.

Smash is a party game, and it should be played that way. That doesn't mean people won't go super hardcore with it, but those same people have no right to be surprised when the game reveals its true colors as a casual-oriented party game.

wow you hit it right on the money dude

It's a shame that Sakurai designed the game to be fun, but actually killed the long lasting fun for those 1% of competitive players, thus destroying his ideal of a game.

<_<

Like melee, brawl could've appealed to all audiences and sold even more, but it seems sakurai had a different idea in mind... Melee is still selling, I wonder how long brawl will last when everyone have had their "fun" with the game. <_<

your post is crap...im sorry but it just is" how long brawl will last"????hahahahahahahaha,and your saying because sak let down 1% of his audience he killed his ideal of his game???...wow...

good melee players went to brawl, they fought online and lost every time. So the game sucks

 

[xanst]

So basically, people are bashing Brawl just because it's fun? Stupid reason if you asked me.

How did you get that? Anti-Brawl people still think it's fun, just isn't as competetive. The tourney's by MLG are huge, but competition =! Competetive... ness. Just because Soul Calibur III had larger tourneys than Soul Calibur II didn't make that game anymore competetive.

 

[Ragingtsunami726]

I knew from the start SSBB wasn't gonna last, i've tried and tried but I just can't get into it. Its been sitting untouched for a week already.....hope melee gets repacked for Wii with wifi.

Embrio, you seem like a good guy but I found this to be hilarious coming from someone who's name is Embrio and who's sig is "It's time to evolve"!

 

[Iwan]

How did you get that? Anti-Brawl people still think it's fun, just isn't as competetive. The tourney's by MLG are huge, but competition =! Competetive... ness. Just because Soul Calibur III had larger tourneys than Soul Calibur II didn't make that game anymore competetive.

Wait...i totally agree that competition doesn't equal competitiveness, but this doesn't apply with Brawl.

The good players are still separated from the bad players.
And good players are still separated from the best players.

In the end, the best brawl players will win games (and tournaments) consistently.
Just like they did in melee.

How is this not as competitive?

 

[Sonic XD]

This thread is a piece of crap.

 

[Lawlb0t]

Iwan, thx for realizing who I was talking to. Its just that Sakurai went way out of his way to stab us. Thats just dirt. I thought he was respectful, but he obviously isn't. Trying to destroy the competitive scene. I have seen other games go down the drain the same way, devs trying to destroy the competitive scene, it obviously doesnt work, but they destroy what could have been an ever better game. Brawl is great, but its lacking.

 

[Iwan]

Iwan, thx for realizing who I was talking to. Its just that Sakurai went way out of his way to stab us. Thats just dirt. I thought he was respectful, but he obviously isn't. Trying to destroy the competitive scene. I have seen other games go down the drain the same way, devs trying to destroy the competitive scene, it obviously doesnt work, but they destroy what could have been an ever better game. Brawl is great, but its lacking.

lol can i say something? Just to be clear, i like melee better than brawl. A lot better.

I miss WDshing, and more than anything...l-canceling. I miss l=canceling .

But what my point was, the whole time...was just that competitive brawl will be successful. Really successful, and anyone predicting the game "dying" within a year or two is ridiculous (someone mentioned that...and honestly.....are you joking? That's possibly the dumbest post iv'e ever read. Anywhere).

I'm just psyched because as a competitive player, im pysched to see our community get bigger.

And in turn...it'll become more competitive.

This is all just my opinion, so whatever.


and i wasn't bashing you lawlbot....just saying what i think .

 

[xanst]

Wait...i totally agree that competition doesn't equal competitiveness, but this doesn't apply with Brawl.

The good players are still separated from the bad players.
And good players are still separated from the best players.

In the end, the best brawl players will win games (and tournaments) consistently.
Just like they did in melee.

How is this not as competitive?

I, personally, don't think they will win as often (which hink it's less competitive, just like on that huge thread about the two terms), but I thought your point about having the big tournies at MLG made the game as competitive.

 

[Embrio]

It's natural for sequels to be compared to there predecessors and obviously Brawl is no exception. In the mind of a lot of players (myself included) we view Brawl as inferior to melee as far as being a competitive tittle. No one is arguing the game's mainstream/casual appeal, the only thing that we've been arguing is it's viability as a legitimate competitive tittle. IMO I don't like the game, I think it has shallow and overly simplified gameplay with laughable depth that produces a dull combat to play or watch..

 

[NoVaLombardia]

your post is crap...im sorry but it just is" how long brawl will last"????hahahahahahahaha,and your saying because sak let down 1% of his audience he killed his ideal of his game???...wow...

Not saying i agree with him, but im using this post as an example.


Neither yay or nay, Nintendo still makes money. This is an online game now, but its not an online game that has a MONTHLY SUBSCRIPTION, so there is no fear of people cancelling any sort of subscription to their game they've already payed once and never to pay again. They've made their money and they are probably already working on the next smash game.

That's what WoW is like, it caters to a casual player through PVP gear, heroic badge gear, all equal and some greater than the latest raid dungeon. Only they have to keep their customers happy, or they will lose their rivers of cash.

 

[0RLY]

But online brawl is ridiculously laggy. Plus, it's the competitiveness of games that keeps it alive. Fun only encourages sales in the beggining.

Why else would melee be on Nintendo's top sellers list for over 5 years?

 

[Darkslash]

wth double post :/

 

[Darkslash]

People really need to adjust. Alot of people here have been playing Melee for over what 5 years. Brawl isn't even a month old yet and you say it sucks

Spoiler

(will get flamed for using the same reason that some people can't get though their heads)

 

[messiahfreak2000]

maybe "anti-brawl" should be changed to "anti-competitive brawl" since people aren't anti-brawl per se but against/doubt the competitive nature. makes it more specific and less encompassing.

 

[brandutt845]

I agree with Gimpy, but brawl wont "FAIL" like this thread starter says. Sheer stupidity. It's been out for almost 2 weeks. What a piece of crap. I want you people to tell me when Melee became competitive because I have no clue. GIVE BRAWL SOME REAL TIME

 

[SkylerOcon]

Okay. From what I've seen the core of people being upset has to do with this:

1) ZOMG NO MORE ATS *cry*
2) Final Smashes aren't fair >=C
3) Stages r 2 randum!1 KILL THEM!1
4) Melee was different, so therefore it must be better!

Listen. It's not melee. Can't you read? Super Smash Brothers Brawl. Not, Super Smash Brothers Melee. They're different games. A new physics engine, new characters, and new move-sets.

You shouldn't be upset because its different from melee. You should have expected this from the very beginning. Every person who's mad at Brawl because it wasn't Melee 2.0 are stupid.

Also, to that guy who said that everybody who was good at Melee got online and lost every match at Brawl... I didn't lose.

 

[reincarN8ed]

what? how could you possibly say Brawl is going to fail? it is the single most anticipated and played game for the Wii right now. it takes everything from the previous titles and adds to that with an abundance of characters, stages, gameplay features, graphics, and even online play. arguing that Brawl cant compete w/ other fighting games is like saying the Wii cant compete w/ the 360 or PS3, but it's in a class all it's own, same as Brawl. Brawl is a simpler fighting game with all the excitement of a fighter, but w/ alot more simplicity. most fighting games like for example Soul Caliber have you moving the analog stick in about 15 different dirrections and pressing a series of 3 or more buttons to execute 1 attack, and most often you're hit before u can finish or the game reads your controls wrong and performs a different move. i love the control scheme for Brawl! its simple but experienced players can use these simple controls to execute complex combos. and the difference in character strengths and fighting styles varies much greater than in other fighting games providing a more broad difference in play styles. in other words: there's a character for everyone whether you like dashing around doing hit-and-runs, or using brute force and devastating smash attacks to throw opponents around like ragdolls, or taking to the skies for a series of aireal assaults.

bottom line: i dont think Brawl will be dying any time soon. because its the game for everyone. whether you're new or experienced, anyone can play it and everyone will play it.

 

[FalconPunch]

Okay. From what I've seen the core of people being upset has to do with this:

1) ZOMG NO MORE ATS *cry*
2) Final Smashes aren't fair >=C
3) Stages r 2 randum!1 KILL THEM!1
4) Melee was different, so therefore it must be better!

Listen. It's not melee. Can't you read? Super Smash Brothers Brawl. Not, Super Smash Brothers Melee. They're different games. A new physics engine, new characters, and new move-sets.

You shouldn't be upset because its different from melee. You should have expected this from the very beginning. Every person who's mad at Brawl because it wasn't Melee 2.0 are stupid.

Also, to that guy who said that everybody who was good at Melee got online and lost every match at Brawl... I didn't lose.

You are the dumbest ****ing person ever.

 

[Demon Kirby]

You are the dumbest ****ing person ever.

And then you realize Paris Hilton exists.

 

[Iwan]

And then you realize Paris Hilton exists.

HAHAHAHA. wow...nice man .

and can this thread be locked now...or end...or something....

Competitive brawl is here.
it's staying.
it's going to be bigger than competitive melee.

whether some of us want that or not.

/thread

 

[OmegaXF]

This makes you think... HARD! It's like being kicked in the nuts with heels. But..... It just cant be changed the world will undergo change. Brawl is one of those changes. We can't get enough of this game. Even if Sakurai downgraded the game one thing stays true to all of the competitive players of Super Smash Bros. Brawl. When there is a will there is a way. If people want Brawl to be another Melee it could possibly happen. But there is no way that the Brawl Community will stop because of this. If anything, the Brawl community will become better.

 

[The Grinch]

I can never understand this. Why wouldn't the game be fun for everyone if it has advanced options to combo & wave dash? Casuals don't give a **** about those options, they'd have loved it and had tons of fun anyway from the characters, pretty colors and mayhem.

Why not offer the OPTIONS?

I definitely agree with this, I don't see what the harm is with giving you the options.

I guess you could say, "Oh, but then if a casual goes to a tourny they'll get smoked."

Thing is, I wouldn't expect a casual player to go to a tourny, or at least not too many lol =P Maybe just make tournies with your friends I suppose.

 

[The Grinch]

Brawler you seem insightful but the ultimate truth is that Brawl has hurt the credibility of the franchise amongst the hardcore fighting community. Every franchise has its black sheep and smash is no expcetion, in fact ill run down some other popular fighters to ilustrate me point.

Capcom: Capcom Fighting Evolution, Hyper Alpha

SNK: SNK VS Capcom Chaos, KOF 03

Namco: Tekken 4, Soul Caliibur 3

Smash brothers: Brawl

The simple truth is that brawl is just one of those "black sheep" that needs to be forgotten, maybe the 4th game will play more to the greatness that is melee and not this slow,stale and incredibly superficial brawl gameplay.

CFE was definitely just cut and paste, still own it though because I'm too much a Capcom fan, aha.

As for the rest:

SVC Chaos was amazing, it was just CVS but with the KOF engine rather than the Capcom engine, what was wrong with that? Not to mention they purposely made Dan amazing in that game...you can't beat that.

I didn't play KOF 03 all that much, just 97-01, and now XI. How did 03 ruin anything?

lmao, how did Hyper Alpha ruin anything? =P It's just a freaking side thing you unlock to have fun with and mess around. I consider it the Street Fighter MUGEN. It's not like there's going to be Hyper Alpha tournies.

 

[The Grinch]

This makes you think... HARD! It's like being kicked in the nuts with heels. But..... It just cant be changed the world will undergo change. Brawl is one of those changes. We can't get enough of this game. Even if Sakurai downgraded the game one thing stays true to all of the competitive players of Super Smash Bros. Brawl. When there is a will there is a way. If people want Brawl to be another Melee it could possibly happen. But there is no way that the Brawl Community will stop because of this. If anything, the Brawl community will become better.

Couldn't have said it better.

Regardless of the loss of Wavedashing, L-canceling, the advanced edgeguarding game etc, tourny smashers can and WILL make it competitive.

I loved Melee, I felt weird not WD'ing and whatnot, however, I'm loving Brawl, and will continue to go to tournaments, teach newer, not so advanced players how to improve your game, and take Luigi to new heights I had not yet even dreamed of.

In the end, a much more skilled player playing against a much less skilled player will still come out on the top---THAT is competition, THAT is the fighting spirit, the drive to learn and make use of what you have to come out on top. It's not 20 different advanced techs, it's the fighting spirit.

When you look at newer fighters and compare them to older ones, the new techs don't make the older games any less competitive. Look at Street Fighter III---it added parrying, kara canceling, super canceling, etc. It was an amazing game that was very competitive, but SFII is still HIGHLY competitive, if you don't believe me, go tell that to Daigo and challenge his Balrog and let's see what happens... =P

 

[PXG]

I respect Gimpy, but his post was totally unnecessary and illogical. Why admit that Smash was never intended to be competitive, then talk about how it "sucks", and then conclude how it is "somewhat" competitive (or "lacking" compared to Melee)? Gimpy's post was a subjective diatribe. It was a circular laundry list of why he thinks Brawl sucks...oh wait no.....its competitive....hold on....not as competitive. Seriously....Make up your mind.

I am sick and tired of people complaining about the lack of ATs, or how you can't combo, or how people can't die. For those who say such things, I have one question...What game are you playing. I'm playing Brawl, just so you know. Maybe if you didn't play it like Melee, and realize its a new ****ing game, then maybe you could do combos and kill people. How long did it take you guys to realize that you couldn't play Melee like 64? Hmmmmm?

 

[mario brawler]

It's natural for sequels to be compared to there predecessors and obviously Brawl is no exception. In the mind of a lot of players (myself included) we view Brawl as inferior to melee as far as being a competitive tittle. No one is arguing the game's mainstream/casual appeal, the only thing that we've been arguing is it's viability as a legitimate competitive tittle. IMO I don't like the game, I think it has shallow and overly simplified gameplay with laughable depth that produces a dull combat to play or watch..

hmm I admire that you don't respond like some other crazy people on this site and that you respond very maturely which is some thing very rare to find in people these days,but aside the point,I know everyone is entitled to their own opinion but it's just that,your thoughts are so...different that I can't stop arguing,I see you insult my favorite game and I can't live with that "laughable depth"?"dull combat"? "shallow,over simplified"?COME ON!,brawl has everything you think it lack's,I mean how do you play brawl?alone or do friends actually come over and you do free for all's?it's impossible not to enjoy brawl I just can't get over the fact some people think brawl is shallow or boring,brawl is not melee so stop trying to play it like it's melee,I heard someone once say "we need to go into brawl with the mind of a n00b and look for what's their,rather than the mind of a melee player expecting what to find"it's not word for word but it makes alot of sense

 

[Big Burn]

I respect Gimpy, but his post was totally unnecessary and illogical. Why admit that Smash was never intended to be competitive, then talk about how it "sucks", and then conclude how it is "somewhat" competitive (or "lacking" compared to Melee)? Gimpy's post was a subjective diatribe. It was a circular laundry list of why he thinks Brawl sucks...oh wait no.....its competitive....hold on....not as competitive. Seriously....Make up your mind.

I am sick and tired of people complaining about the lack of ATs, or how you can't combo, or how people can't die. For those who say such things, I have one question...What game are you playing. I'm playing Brawl, just so you know. Maybe if you didn't play it like Melee, and realize its a new ****ing game, then maybe you could do combos and kill people. How long did it take you guys to realize that you couldn't play Melee like 64? Hmmmmm?

you are correct obviously....yeah it's definitely a new game...a shi-tty terrible game....but yeah a new game nonetheless

 

[PXG]

you are correct obviously....yeah it's definitely a new game...a shi-tty terrible game....but yeah a new game nonetheless

"****ty, terrible game"...... Hmmmm. Thats really objective right there.

Just admit that you (and everyone else) is pissed because it doesn't play like Melee. Brawl sucks because you can't "****" your friends anymore. Its not because its not balanced, or that there are game breaking elements (assuming items and FSes are off). No, its because you refuse to learn new aspects of the game. You're stuck in the past and don't want to have to learn new moves and strategies. You want all of your "skill" to have carried over so that you don't have to put in much effort in beating other people.

Winning and competition isn't supposed to be easy. You have to work hard and earn your victory. Great you were good at Melee. But guess what, just because your were good the last game, doesn't mean you should or deserve to be good at Brawl. Some tactics and skill does carry over from Melee. Its all a matter of adjusting to the new physics and properties and effects of the attacks.

If you honestly don't like Brawl (probably because of your own insecurity and frustrurtion), then either get better at the game, or go back and play Melee. People need to stop posting threads about why it "sucks" or why they believe its "not competitive". One is enough. And its really messed up and disheartening when GIMPYFISH, of all people, sounds some grim and morbid. I have nothing against him, but its kind of messed up (the way his posts are written) that he isn't supporting Brawl that much. Shouldn't he, of all people, be trying to get more support for Brawl?

 

[Veil2222]

I do wish there was one complaint thread, well, there is one but for some reason people don't use it. No one here even tries to be objective, everything I've been hearing people say is garnished with phrases like "that could be correct.... if you weren't a noob", "no one's heard of you, so you're not right" "Brawl just isn't as competitive, it's a really bad game and you should believe my opinion because I'm a respectable member of the community (<-- this guys sig. is "Brawl sucks lawl")' etc. etc.