Whatever happened to Sheik being number one in the Tiers?

[Plairnkk]

dk can't be CGed for whatever reason

i hear DK is a sheik counterpick but i don't see it as sheik's comboes are just...ghey

i will say from personal experience i will NOT use sheik vs a good DK, i just get destroyed. Idk if its just cuz im bad at it, or what.

I lost to this one DK player from NY named kwan MULTIPLE times with sheik in MM's, but 3 stocked him with luigi and 3 stocked him with zelda

****ing monkey

as far as sheik not being top on the tier list anymore, its because with the evolution of tech skill and falco/fox's metagame paired with sheik's weight and comboability, they've gianed the upper hand on her.

 

[APImagine]

Yet Sheik whips more random characters than anyone else, right?

 

[Shack]

Are "easy to combo characters" factored into tiers? Cuz yeah fox and falco can **** with their combos, but they are a lot easier to kill than others. I use Sheik and would much rather fight a fox or falco in a tourney than most others cuz fox/falco r so easy to combo and gimp once they try to recover. Plus fox and falco r prolly easier matchups for a lot of lower tier characters just b/c they can be chain grabbed and juggled to death. I know Roys, Mewtwos, Marios, etc. love playing fox's

 

[Plairnkk]

they love playing bad or mediocre foxes, not good ones

 

[terr13]

Ask Taj what he would use against Chillin or DaShizWiz. Obviously Fox and Falco are esier to combo and gimp, but they usually just take control of the whole match and force you into submission.

 

[cablepuff]

sheik vs fox is even
1.) needle camping > laser camping.
2.) sheik can gimp fox too.. needle of the edge and run off fair or netural air.
3.) sheik out ranges fox with back-air camping.

sheik vs falco is even.
1.) Power shield laser + down smash or grab ftw.
2.) you can dash attack through reflector or down air (if falco ever tries to pillar you anticpate it) and dash attack it.
3.) netural air > phantasm.

** When you can whip chain on fox and falco recovering below you.. theres something wrong..

sheik only has slight disadvantage vs ice climbers.

Sheik should definitely be one of the best character in the game.

That is all.

 

[Tope]

Sheik is never = to fox


Failure.

 

[cablepuff]

my bad.. sheik has slight advantage on fox.

 

[KevinM]

Cablepuff... just no

 

[terr13]

Fox vs Sheik is not that even, I really don't see many high level Sheik's winning against Foxes, but Falco and Sheik is pretty even. By the way, Marth is not the 5th best, Marth is in like the top 3 guaranteed. Sheik is one of the best in the game, top 5 for sure.

 

[APImagine]

Would anyone agree that the matchups between Sheik, Fox, and Marth are kind of like rock, paper, scissors, with the advantage ultimately going to Fox if you've mastered him?

(I'm not saying this is what I believe, I'm only asking if you would think this to be true)

 

[Shack]

na not fox cuz marth ***** fox, chain grab to up tilts to fsmash edgegaurd.

And Ice Climbers are only hard for most sheiks b/c they can chain grab her and they are almost impossible to grab (a big part of most sheik's game). If you learn to play without grabs, they shouldnt be as hard (unless theyre top pro and then it doesnt matter.)

 

[terr13]

Uhh.. Marth doesn't **** Fox, PC is pretty even with M2K from what I've seen. Marth obviously has the advantage on FD, but on PS and YS Fox has the advantage. Ice Climbers are hard since I don't think that many people really know how to play against them, or if they do, it's more like they countered the person playing ICs rather than the character itself, since I don't think many regions have multiple ICs.

 

[h1roshi]

because fox and falco do generally better in tournaments and they place higher. so they were moved up. also, IMHO, fox and falco have a 60/40% advantage over sheik. no matter what percent you are at, they can punish you pretty hard. fox can drillshine/waveshine at any percent which really hurts. falcos shine combos work whenever he connects. while sheik has to wait till like 40% for her tilts to become effective. and the main thing she has on them is tech chasing, which is not a sure thing. and requires much skill to keep it going longer than three successful tech chases....peace

-hiroshi

 

[APImagine]

It all comes down to that godly Shine, doesn't it?

 

[Plairnkk]

yeah... to quote Aho

"sheik would be the best but...she doesnt have a shine"

 

[Brookman]

Marth doesn't seem to care about the shine too much.

 

[Plairnkk]

but he has a sword. i mean come on, honestly.

 

[Brookman]

Quit making johns and just beat those suck *** fox players.

 

[Drephen]

i beat those suck *** fox players!

 

[JFox]

People started playing characters that did well against the top tiers. People purposely began playing Fox and Falco because of how well they do vs Sheik. People began playing IC's because they do well against Fox Falco and Sheik. People started playing Peach because less Sheik's were around, and she does well against Falco, and even with Fox. People played Marth to counter spacies IC's and Peachs. And now people are once again starting to play sheik to stop Marth.

Its a vicious cycle.

 

[Brookman]

The following message is NOT sarcasm.

i beat those suck *** fox players!

you're special.

People started playing characters that did well against the top tiers. People purposely began playing Fox and Falco because of how well they do vs Sheik. People began playing IC's because they do well against Fox Falco and Sheik. People started playing Peach because less Sheik's were around, and she does well against Falco, and even with Fox. People played Marth to counter spacies IC's and Peachs. And now people are once again starting to play sheik to stop Marth.

Its a vicious cycle.

I think that IC's gets ***** by fox/falco, and probably by sheik too, but since I don't play ICs or Sheik I can't really say. Peach also gets handled like a rag doll by fox/falco/marth/sheik.

 

[APImagine]

So... Peach does well against characters that are below her in the Tiers?

 

[Brookman]

For the most part, I'd think so.

 

[APImagine]

Whereas Sheik, Fox, Falco and Marth look at Peach and go "Heh, look at that little Peach, thinks she can wear the daddy pants, eh?"?

 

[Brookman]

kinda .

 

[damage incorperated]

dis thred wus a gud read

ty

 

[Junpappy]

Space animals beat Peach now?......wtf?

 

[Brookman]

Space animals beat Peach now?......wtf?

When haven't they? People think that peach beats falco for some reason, and it is a relatively hard match up for falco, but what match up isn't hard for falco?

 

[Zankoku]

Peach's physics let her get wrecked by any character in the game able to combo. It's just that she punishes mistakes extra hard, so Peach is a counterpick to people who don't pay attention or space well.

 

[Junpappy]

In regional crew battles, Peaches go in against space animals and IC's

 

[choknater]

I think that IC's gets ***** by fox/falco, and probably by sheik too, but since I don't play ICs or Sheik I can't really say. Peach also gets handled like a rag doll by fox/falco/marth/sheik.

Ur right actually. ic's countering sheik is a big misconception and was only true when chudat was first showing his cg skills. shes still easy to cg, but sheik players like shu/forward prove that ics are pretty beatable in the right hands

 

[Brookman]

Well, I wouldn't say that sheik ***** ICs seriously, but she is sheik for a reason.

 

[jdmelody]

Peach is extremely good against IC's though

 

[Brookman]

Nobody is trying to dispute that, thanks though.

 

[Sinz]

JD That was completely unnecessary.

Sheik is overall gay which is why she was 1. then People found shine is gayer than we thought.

 

[Mew2King]

there aren't enough sheik players around that's why she's not ranked as high as she should be