Ask a Qusestion. Get an Answer.

[Ultimate~Anarchy]

Hey guys, I have some quick questions about DI ect.

1. Which way do you DI pikachu's down smash?

2. For momentum canceling, are you supposed to use bair or U-air?

3. How and which way are you supposed to DI fox's dair?

4. How and which way do you DI Falco's dair off the ledge? Also do you dual stick or just use the control stick?

5. Are you supposed to dual stick DI snakes ftilt or just use the control stick?

 

[1PokeMastr]

Hey guys, I have some quick questions about DI ect.

1. Which way do you DI pikachu's down smash?

2. For momentum canceling, are you supposed to use bair or U-air?

3. How and which way are you supposed to DI fox's dair?

4. How and which way do you DI Falco's dair off the ledge? Also do you dual stick or just use the control stick?

5. Are you supposed to dual stick DI snakes ftilt or just use the control stick?

It's always better to use Dual Stick SDi because you get the most out of it that way.

1. You SDi Pikachu's Dsmash up, just up.

2. Momentum cancel is Uair.

3. SDi away from Fox so you get out of it faster.

4. You SDi it up and toward the stage.

 

[teluoborg]

Luxingo you should really just try it on a very large custom stage.
Try FF aerial + jump with any normal character, then try the same thing with MK or Jiggs.

 

[Ultimate~Anarchy]

It's always better to use Dual Stick SDi because you get the most out of it that way.

1. You SDi Pikachu's Dsmash up, just up.

2. Momentum cancel is Uair.

3. SDi away from Fox so you get out of it faster.

4. You SDi it up and toward the stage.

Thank you very much.

 

[luxingo]

4. How and which way do you DI Falco's dair off the ledge? Also do you dual stick or just use the control stick?
4. You SDi it up and toward the stage.

I personally prefer to hold towards the stage with the control stick and mash up with the cstick. This way, I'm DIing up and towards the stage, and if I don't get spiked, I'll uair, which finishes fastest anyway. I also hold jump (using a shoulder button) and prepare for a tech, so that if I hit the ground, I'll tech-roll towards the stage and away from the opponent, and if I hit the ledge or the wall, I'll wall jump and be able to recover more easily.

Luxingo you should really just try it on a very large custom stage.
Try FF aerial + jump with any normal character, then try the same thing with MK or Jiggs.

Is it perhaps just because MK and Jiggs are light and have poor FF speeds? I rarely play as either of them, but I do often use Pit, who has multijumps and doesn't seem to have much difference in momentum cancelling. I will try your suggestion though.

 

[teluoborg]

Then try with Pit, or even with D3 and compare it to someone like Link.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Pikachu's Dsmash is one of those moves you can get out by auto smash DI or simply hold the control stick in a direction. From experience, its not enough at lower percents, but it nearly guaranteed at anything above 60% I believe.Might have depend upon how quickly you get around to holding to get more chances for ASDI.

 

[Attila_]

di-ing pikachu's dsmash can be scary, since it's pretty hard to choose which direction you'll fly out at. at lower percents, i'll normally choose not to sdi it, espc if i'm near a ledge.

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

You don't have to SDI to get out, you can simply hold up and you definitely don't want it dealing full damage as opposed to 3-8% and then putting you above Pikachu.

 

[luxingo]

What should I do to punish someone who always Nairs or Zairs after a dthrow?

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

Why are you getting grabbed by someone with a Zair?

What character is it?

 

[luxingo]

Haha no, I may have worded my question badly.

After I dthrow my opponent with Falco, I often like to punish the opponent's airdodge with a charged DACUS. After I dthrow them, other opponents like mashing nair or use zair (like Toon Link). So what should I do if I expect them to nair or zair after I dthrow them?

 

[-LzR-]

I'm not a Falco, but it's simple, you wait for the nair/zair and punish them afterwards. This is Brawl, where your opponents can counterattack really fast when attacked, so counter it with a shield JC usmash or something.

 

[teluoborg]

You kinda answered your own question lol.
You dacus to punish airdodges,
Opponent doesn't airdodge,
Then don't dacus.

You can try faster options like dash attack or Ftilt (hit them before they hit you),
You can dash and shield their hit, punish oos,
You can outspace it, then punish with a long burst range attack like dacus,
Or you can simply jump and SHDL their faces, it's not like Falco is disadvantaged when he's far from his opponent lol.

In short : mix up and don't get predictable.

 

[kismet2]

lol falco has so many options. don't get stuck on one thing because falco has so many ways he can deal with stuff. teluoborg gave a list of probably the strongest options that you can use in that situation. it really depends on what you want to do whether it's trying to apply pressure or being safe just remember that falco can do both so you're never really doing wrong.

 

[Kuro~]

Kismet when u gonna get to my vids?

 

[kismet2]

i actually forgot lol but i'll do it now and send your critique in pm

EDIT: done! if you have any questions plz ask and hope you learned something from it

 

[Attila_]

Question:

Where is the mk/falco mu sitting at these days? are there any players in particular that demonstrate how this mu is to be played correctly?

cheers.

Also, why does no one ledge cancel their phantasms while recovering?

 

[zFlashyStyle]

So i been practicing SHDL,Side B cancel,Glide Toss,B reverse with the SHDL,wall jump to reversed laser what else should i practice?

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Question:

Where is the mk/falco mu sitting at these days? are there any players in particular that demonstrate how this mu is to be played correctly?

cheers.

Also, why does no one ledge cancel their phantasms while recovering?

I believe the match-up is seen as in MK's favor as it always has been, but not by much. The usual -1 to falco or 45/55 by the old scheme. It generally the same sort of thing in every match-up. Falco makes it hard to approach, but MK can destroy falco once an opening is made.

Regarding phantasm, I bet you already have a few ideas. You have to time a 3 frame window roughly 1/3 of a second later. And obviously a smaller window of a 1/60 of a second if you want to get the right distance. Also, its brawl, so you can often get by without needing to cancel at all. Maybe everyone is pretty bad at this game too. You might only see consistent canceling from like a fraction of the falco players in the world. Most of whom are already make up the small fraction of money-winners.

So i been practicing SHDL,Side B cancel,Glide Toss,B reverse with the SHDL,wall jump to reversed laser what else should i practice?

Now, learn when to use it properly. Always the next step. You'll often find self teaching is often the only path and not many people will give you very substantial advice which will set you down the path of infinite knowledge or something like that.

 

[zFlashyStyle]

Yea i need to go to more offline tounies to try an apply to actual gameplay. My last tourny was Apex 2012

If i link you guys to a stream where there's a few games of me vs a DDK can u guys give me tips?

 

[luxingo]

So i been practicing SHDL,Side B cancel,Glide Toss,B reverse with the SHDL,wall jump to reversed laser what else should i practice?

DACUS, BDACUS, CG -> Spike, jab cancels, retreating SHL, and the boost pivot grab.

But what Xeylode said.

Do people even use the walljump -> reverse laser now?

 

[teluoborg]

Why would you do that when you can 1 simply ledge jump double laser or 2 wall jump double Bair (which btw gets you rid of rco).

 

[1PokeMastr]

Teluoborg is right, ledge jump double laser is better because it allows for two lasers at some of the lowest possible heights, which is really helpful.

I've never done double Bair, sounds interesting.

 

[Attila_]

Regarding phantasm, I bet you already have a few ideas. You have to time a 3 frame window roughly 1/3 of a second later. And obviously a smaller window of a 1/60 of a second if you want to get the right distance. Also, its brawl, so you can often get by without needing to cancel at all. Maybe everyone is pretty bad at this game too. You might only see consistent canceling from like a fraction of the falco players in the world. Most of whom are already make up the small fraction of money-winners.

i was referring to ledge cancelling the phantasm, not regular cancelling it. it allows you to get off the ledge without lag (appears to be normal landing lag, around 2 frames or so), and without yet using your rco lag. especially useful if your opponent is baiting a regular distance phantasm, and in the past, i have got grabs out of this set up.

looks like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETN7Z8qNm_o#t=12m58s

obviously with a less unnecessarily dangerous followup.

 

[Elyssa Xey Hexen]

Normally when I see this occur, it is by accident and never does someone get onto the stage. They usually just fall in place. Something to look into.

 

[1PokeMastr]

You still get RCO Lag from that.

 

[Attila_]

Normally when I see this occur, it is by accident and never does someone get onto the stage. They usually just fall in place. Something to look into.

if you hold forward, you will always land on stage. alternatively, you can immediately do another phantasm, which will begin just above the ground and can mess up an opponents timing.

You still get RCO Lag from that.

iirc its carries, but its not active on the landing. it will become active next time you land.

 

[1PokeMastr]

It's active during the landing.
Since the ledge "interrupted" phantasm before it ended, giving you the RCO lag.
It's the same thing for Marth's Dolphin Slash Cancel and Wolf's Scarring, Etc.


You still get RCO because you were interrupted before the special fall began.

 

[luxingo]

Which ledge option (get up, attack, roll, jump) 'hogs' the ledge for the longest time?

 

[#HBC | Ryker]

+100 attack, I believe. It may be +100 roll.

Under 100, all of them are fast and I have no idea.

 

[Kuro~]

uhhh no that's not correct.

U get the rco yes...

but not AT THAT LANDING. It's the next time u land after the "scar"

 

[Darktega]

uhhh no that's not correct.

U get the rco yes...

but not AT THAT LANDING. It's the next time u land after the "scar"

Yeah, same happens if you recover with the ledge (with your special, obviously) and don't jump in (recover getting up, rolling, attacking, I mean), you get RCO lag next time you land.

 

[BigMilk]

Are there any threads explaining phantasm distances and execution?

 

[Darktega]

Are there any threads explaining phantasm distances and execution?

Well, not at my knowledge but if this helps you:
There are 2 types of phantasm: Normal and cancelled. Normal is the full phantasm you make by doing SideB and cancelled is the one you make by double tapping B at the right time executing phantasm, you can cancel this at two distances: the half and at the very beggining of it. Cancelled phantasm will give you some side momentum while you are in the air, at the contrary of normal phantasm, (or full, let's call it full) that will give you almost no side momentum. (Air phantasm can spike if you hit the upperbody of your opponent)
There's this AT called Instant Aerial Phantasm (IAP) that you execute a phantasm jumping and INMEDIATLY you SideB giving you much more less lag than a normal phantasm on the ground. This is used for resets and racking some damage. I don't have the percentages for this.
The previously question talked about RCO lag, RCO lag is a lag specific to some characters that gives them landing lag when they use certain recoveries, as said there, if you sweetspot your recovery to the ledge and you used phantasm to get there, next time you land on the ground you will have some landing lag, so be smart using it.
Generally speaking, you can use phantasm to recover; to aid your landings far from your opponent (usually using cancelled phantasm beacuse of the momentum; use whatever distance suits better the situation) and finally, to rack damage and escaping, oh, and you can use it for mindgames too.

Hope that helps you, I covered what came into my mind about phantasm.

 

[teluoborg]

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=11140332&postcount=5098
Someone should just sticky this post or something.

 

[Darktega]

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=11140332&postcount=5098
Someone should just sticky this post or something.

Good to know that post exist.

 

[BigMilk]

Thanks guys

 

[AmKhokar]

Can you bdacus after an empty fast fall / landing or do you have to preface it with an attack, role, aerial, etc? Also is it possible to bdacus opposite to the direction I'm facing when buffering? If so, what is the input for a "reverse bdacus"?

 

[luxingo]

You can bdacus (3 inputs) in the landing animation of an empty landing if it's a hard landing (4 frames) from a fastfall or a landing with RCO lag (15+ frames), rather than a non-fastfall soft landing (2 frames). However, you may as well land with an airdodge or a laser to make it easier to BDACUS.

Apparently, it is theoretically possible to BDACUS in the opposite direction, but you'll have to do 5 inputs in 11 frames. Alternatively, if you're landing and want to BDACUS in the other direction, do a turn-around laser so that you're facing the right way so that you'll only have to do 3 inputs.