Brawl Character Match-Up chart

[~ Gheb ~]

Falco can kill vertical pretty well...

 

[Justblaze647]

Falco can kill vertical pretty well...

Not with his u-smash he can't...

 

[sandwhale]

i really don't see what dk has against falco i mean he can take dk up to 50-60% at the beginning of the match and then his camping game with lasers shine ad phantasm is alot for dk to deal with and then keep in mind that he does not only have lasers but plenty of attacks with good enough speed and priority to stop dk's approach (seeing as he'll have to approach. and enough with the "yeah all you need to do is get falco off stage then gimp him with so and so attack and then falco dead"! falco isn't that easily gimped you have to time your attack almost perfectly to hit him out of his phantasm and he can be very unpredictable while using it!

and about the falco-lucario: i actually think you can cg-pillar lucario but i might have to check that oh and falco's u-smash kills lucario at about ~110%. and falco outcamps lucario.

 

[manhunter098]

and about the falco-lucario: i actually think you can cg-pillar lucario but i might have to check that oh and falco's u-smash kills lucario at about ~110%. and falco outcamps lucario.

Im not sure he can even do the cg pillar, maybe once at like 10% or less. And Lucario is pretty decent against camping because his jumps and air game are both good so he can for the most part safely approach while in the air. Lucario can also gimp Falco pretty well or punish his recovery. Remember that I am mostly stressing the point that its an even matchup. Its certainly not in Falco's favor though.

 

[Crackle]

Im not sure he can even do the cg pillar, maybe once at like 10% or less. And Lucario is pretty decent against camping because his jumps and air game are both good so he can for the most part safely approach while in the air. Lucario can also gimp Falco pretty well or punish his recovery. Remember that I am mostly stressing the point that its an even matchup. Its certainly not in Falco's favor though.

I mained Falco and playing good Lucario players was no cakewalk.

The sad thing is I repeatedly lost with my MAIN FALCO to a Lucario that I could beat with my
very own Lucario! No, I'm not better with Lucario. No, I wasn't approaching like a duface.

Lucario feels all floaty and his close-range game outprioritizes Falco's moves too much.
Also, the Lasers do nothing if the Lucario player manages to find a platform level, and Lucario's f-smash obviously destroys Falco's.

Unless you stop the recovery after doing something like b-air to get Lucario off, you can't manage to do anything but u-smash him for the finish. Lucario has too much control over the roll-game so it's hardly something worth attempting either.

But I guess you can laser and spam side-b, but that seems weak.





Oh and one question, seeing the matchup chart. And I know this probably has been asked like 40 billion times, but
why does Meta Knight have nothing but check marks all over? Is there something about attack priority or the no-lag gliding that makes Meta Knight so favored for almost all matchups?

If no one corrects me I'll just assume it's the lack of lag frames that makes it so. But even so, given the fact that Meta knight is predictable in most situations I'm wondering why heavyweights can't just vertically-**** him for a neutral matchup.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Oh and one question, seeing the matchup chart. And I know this probably has been asked like 40 billion times, but
why does Meta Knight have nothing but check marks all over? Is there something about attack priority or the no-lag gliding that makes Meta Knight so favored for almost all matchups?

If no one corrects me I'll just assume it's the lack of lag frames that makes it so. But even so, given the fact that Meta knight is predictable in most situations I'm wondering why heavyweights can't just vertically-**** him for a neutral matchup.

metaknight can gimp almost everyone and just isn't punishable

 

[Crackle]

metaknight can gimp almost everyone and just isn't punishable

Is it possible he'll be banned from tournaments or is that completely absurd considering the number of people that main him?

 

[Deoxys]

Is it possible he'll be banned from tournaments or is that completely absurd considering the number of people that main him?

It's always possible, if he renders use of any other character downright uncompetitive. Basically, he has obscene recovery, speed, damage, and kill potential.

 

[Crackle]

It's always possible, if he renders use of any other character downright uncompetitive. Basically, he has obscene recovery, speed, damage, and kill potential.

D@rn that's a shame, I've been picking him up lately. And having him to transition into Brawl from Melee as Marth just seems the easiest transition I've suffered yet.

Then again, the Meta Knight players like Eggz are arguing that it's bullsh*t for anyone to complain that Meta Knight is overpowered.

 

[Browny]

if someone says mk isnt broken, and is an mk main at the same time, their argument is instantly void.

 

[Eggz]

D@rn that's a shame, I've been picking him up lately. And having him to transition into Brawl from Melee as Marth just seems the easiest transition I've suffered yet.

Then again, the Meta Knight players like Eggz are arguing that it's bullsh*t for anyone to complain that Meta Knight is overpowered.

Instead of complaining like a bitch you could just improve is all ive been saying. hes not unbeatable lol. you just suck.

ive been going all dedede recently and i handle most of our mk players pretty well and go even with the ones who are around my level.

 

[Crackle]

I doubt MK is in threat of being banned because people don't ALWAYS lose to him. Tournament finals aren't all MK's because all the decent-bad MK players get knocked out regardless of their character's ability.

Also, too many players use MK competitively, especially the regular tournament goers like m2k. They wouldn't cut out those players just for the sake of a few whiny individuals.

 

[Ace55]

Wow, I havn't looked at this thing in a while because I was kinda dissapointed in it. I had hoped for some improvement. I can handle a faulty disadvantage against Pikachu, and a suprising disadvantage against Pit. But listing Wario's #1 bane Dedede as a neutral matchup is just too much. Who have you been talking to?

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Not with his u-smash he can't...

Usmash is decent. Uair is deadly and even utilt can finish

 

[Praxis]

The Peach section is so wrong it's not even funny.

I'd put Wario as an even matchup- the grab release lets us kill him at 93% and I think Peach can CG him?

Link is probably in Peach's favor slightly. Ike definitely is. Diddy Kong is even or slight advantage to Peach (float can't trip on bananas). I don't know if I see Pikachu as a disadvantage, and Toon Link is neutral as far as I know. ZSS is neutral at best, possibly advantaged, and Olimar Peach HARD COUNTERS, no small advantage. She DEFINITELY has a small advantage on ROB, and I think the Snake matchup is even but I think the Peaches agreed on Snake's advantage so whatever. And I'd give Peach a small advantage on Donkey Kong and Pit.

 

[Justblaze647]

Stuff...

Leave to a Peach main to get so defensive...lol

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

The Peach section is so wrong it's not even funny.

I'd put Wario as an even matchup- the grab release lets us kill him at 93% and I think Peach can CG him?

Link is probably in Peach's favor slightly. Ike definitely is. Diddy Kong is even or slight advantage to Peach (float can't trip on bananas). I don't know if I see Pikachu as a disadvantage, and Toon Link is neutral as far as I know. ZSS is neutral at best, possibly advantaged, and Olimar Peach HARD COUNTERS, no small advantage. She DEFINITELY has a small advantage on ROB, and I think the Snake matchup is even but I think the Peaches agreed on Snake's advantage so whatever. And I'd give Peach a small advantage on Donkey Kong and Pit.

adding and detracting from this
Peach is one of zelda's harder matches normally.... it's essentially even. Though I agree with the OP on Link going even with peach... sorry.

 

[Crackle]

The Peach section is so wrong it's not even funny.

I'd put Wario as an even matchup- the grab release lets us kill him at 93% and I think Peach can CG him?

Link is probably in Peach's favor slightly. Ike definitely is. Diddy Kong is even or slight advantage to Peach (float can't trip on bananas). I don't know if I see Pikachu as a disadvantage, and Toon Link is neutral as far as I know. ZSS is neutral at best, possibly advantaged, and Olimar Peach HARD COUNTERS, no small advantage. She DEFINITELY has a small advantage on ROB, and I think the Snake matchup is even but I think the Peaches agreed on Snake's advantage so whatever. And I'd give Peach a small advantage on Donkey Kong and Pit.

I disagree with too much of that statement for it to be considerable, and I'm sure many others do too.

 

[Praxis]

adding and detracting from this
Peach is one of zelda's harder matches normally.... it's essentially even. Though I agree with the OP on Link going even with peach... sorry.

I dunno, I've fought with Deva a few times. Peach has 60% combos on Link because of his weight and can edgeguard him very effectively (one offstage turnip = a kill usually, and she can float against the ledge and release to edgehog him).

However, I could settle at even.

I have no clue the Zelda matchup sadly, the one time I've fought a Zelda it felt pretty even.

Leave to a Peach main to get so defensive...lol

lol, I'm not being defensive, but some of the matchups really need to be updated. I mean, some of the entries are blatantly wrong- ROB is considered in general to be disadvantaged to Peach because of his blind spots (he has no way to punish a floating dair at an angle above him, and his weight gives Peach 60% combos out of a dair).

Also, I'd give Lucario a slight advantage on Peach. I'd probably give Falco an advantage on Peach- laser camp ***** float.

Samus is definitely an even matchup, but I'm pretty sure Peach has an advantage on Sheik, but don't hold me to that.

I disagree with too much of that statement for it to be considerable, and I'm sure many others do too.

Explain to me what you disagree with then, please?

 

[gantrain05]

I dunno, I've fought with Deva a few times. Peach has 60% combos on Link because of his weight and can edgeguard him very effectively (one offstage turnip = a kill usually, and she can float against the ledge and release to edgehog him).

However, I could settle at even.

I have no clue the Zelda matchup sadly, the one time I've fought a Zelda it felt pretty even.



lol, I'm not being defensive, but some of the matchups really need to be updated. I mean, some of the entries are blatantly wrong- ROB is considered in general to be disadvantaged to Peach because of his blind spots (he has no way to punish a floating dair at an angle above him, and his weight gives Peach 60% combos out of a dair).

Also, I'd give Lucario a slight advantage on Peach. I'd probably give Falco an advantage on Peach- laser camp ***** float.

Samus is definitely an even matchup, but I'm pretty sure Peach has an advantage on Sheik, but don't hold me to that.



Explain to me what you disagree with then, please?

well as a peach mainer also, i agree she has an advatage to link, he just gets gimped so easily. but as for shiek, i dont know, a needle spamming shiek can give peach alot of trouble, not because she can kill you easily, because shiek cant, its just if they play very defensive its hard to actually land kill moves on her. and yeah i agree, there needs to be like a 70-30 advantage peach on rob, the only thing he can do to beat out a floating Dair combo is to jump up and actually Fair you before you start, which probably won't happen lol.

 

[Justblaze647]

Peach has 60% combos on Link because of his weight and can edgeguard him very effectively (one offstage turnip = a kill usually, and she can float against the ledge and release to edgehog him).

LMAO! Who can't edge-guard Link effectively?

 

[Praxis]

LMAO! Who can't edge-guard Link effectively?

LOL, good point, but Peach has some special advantages.

As I mentioned, the ability to float against the ledge means I can just sit there floating and the moment he's about to hit me with up-B I release the float and bam, he gets edgehogged. And the turnips destroy him almost instantly offstage.

well as a peach mainer also, i agree she has an advatage to link, he just gets gimped so easily. but as for shiek, i dont know, a needle spamming shiek can give peach alot of trouble, not because she can kill you easily, because shiek cant, its just if they play very defensive its hard to actually land kill moves on her. and yeah i agree, there needs to be like a 70-30 advantage peach on rob, the only thing he can do to beat out a floating Dair combo is to jump up and actually Fair you before you start, which probably won't happen lol.

He can't do the fair fast enough, and you can usually punish his fairs with your nair since it comes out faster.

The only Sheik I've ever fought IRL was Gimpyfish, and he was dang good. He also spent a minute mumbling about how terrible the matchup vs Peach is before the match, and after the match. xD So I'm kind of basing it off that.

It was really slow because neither of us could land kill moves. LOL

I don't think the ROB matchup is 70-30 (that's Olimar, haha) but it's definitely in Peach's favor. Low percentages float/dair spam is ridiculously hard for him to punish and racks up a ton of damage, and you can hold on to his gyro and perform aerials out of float and he never gets it back.

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

sheik has a hard time with peach. trust me... I switch to zelda, use zelda AND sheik or counterpick link.

it's Zelda I was talking about. Peach is pretty good about baiting whiffs with float aproaches. if she pokes effectively she is **** hard to fight. it still might be a slight advantage for zelda.... but not much. it's even

 

[Praxis]

Counterpick Link? Really?
That matchup is even at worst based on my time with Deva, but I'm almost convinced Peach has a slight advantage. Eh, I'd be alright with even though.

BTW- I'd suggest counterpicking G&W, or if you're good at camping, Falco. Peach is ok against Falco up close, but laser camping DESTROYS her. And Peach has no good way to punish G&W's Bair.

*looks at list of characters you play*
Ness is a pretty even matchup too, because Peach has horrible spike recovery. But I'd agree with Zelda being even as well.

EDIT: A match from my last set with Deva about 1.5 months ago:
http://allisbrawl.com/video/video.aspx?id=4632

I did lose the set, but mostly cause I suicided in the third round, and he ***** me using Yoshi's Island's platform as turnip cover on the first xD I think this set was the only one with vids online though.

Actually, I think it's really stage specific. Link'll **** Peach on any stage that gives him mobility or cover (Yoshi's Island, Norfair, etc).

 

[Sonic The Hedgedawg]

Counterpick Link? Really?
That matchup is even at worst based on my time with Deva, but I'm almost convinced Peach has a slight advantage. Eh, I'd be alright with even though.

BTW- I'd suggest counterpicking G&W, or if you're good at camping, Falco. Peach is ok against Falco up close, but laser camping DESTROYS her. And Peach has no good way to punish G&W's Bair.

*looks at list of characters you play*
Ness is a pretty even matchup too, because Peach has horrible spike recovery. But I'd agree with Zelda being even as well.

it's not just the charcter... it's the style. My link's style normally answers the style of the peaches that give me problems... though I'll have to take a stronger look into ness and falco now.

 

[NDUDE]

Captain Falcon counters Bowser and Meta Knight. Read before laughing, plz.

Okay, this chart makes CF look worse than he really is. Yes, he sucks, but COME ON (Blue Falcon)! He has his own strengths.

Bowser is an absolute knee magnet. He's easy to combo with grabs and aerials (especially uair and nair), and he takes knees better than the freaking Sandbag.

MK...if you play cautiously, you CAN beat MK as CF. Most MK players are predictable, so spot dodge and air dodge when you're sure you see something coming. Also, CF has knockback. MK isn't exactly heavy. A well-placed dsmash can send MK flying. Also, Falcon Kick is incredibly useful, AND, if MK's using his whorenado right above you, usmash can out-prioritize it and strike from underneath.

This is all from personal experience and having faced various MKs and Bowsers.

Also, Ness can completely sodomize a bunch of his "bad" matchups...

 

[Mmac]

Ndude, If I can't convince Ivan the Biased that Yoshi is even with MetaKnight with Statistics, Charts, Months of debate, Discussions with some of the top MetaKnight Mains, Techniques, Videos, Agreement with the METAKNIGHT MAINS THEMSELVES, and a Cookie Basket, then I don't think you'll stand a chance in hell trying to convince him that Falcon is even with MetaKnight.

Not to mention that 90% Matchups with Yoshi are just plain wrong anyways

 

[unwelc0med]

lol mk has no bad matchups

 

[Ussi]

how does MK have an even match with zelda???

MK has the advantage on DK and G&W, I have video prove of advantage DK and there is a thread made by Hylian about G&W

 

[Dynomite]

isnt snake > MK? and marth and mk ~

 

[Ussi]

Nope, MK > Snake.

 

[adumbrodeus]

Marth's even vs Snake and ROB, where is it?

MK...if you play cautiously, you CAN beat MK as CF. Most MK players are predictable, so spot dodge and air dodge when you're sure you see something coming. Also, CF has knockback. MK isn't exactly heavy. A well-placed dsmash can send MK flying. Also, Falcon Kick is incredibly useful, AND, if MK's using his whorenado right above you, usmash can out-prioritize it and strike from underneath.

Lol, "MK players are so predictable" means that you mindgamed them.

Falcon has no safe approaches versus MK (he doesn't even have any vs. Ganondorf for God's safe), has no real defensive options that outdo mk's offensive options, too much starting lag, too little priority, need i go on?

The rest of your options are utterly situational.

Sure you can beat him, if you win on skill by a large enough margin.

isnt snake > MK? and marth and mk ~

That was back when MK didn't know how to space.

Wrong on both counts.

 

[wangston]

So doesn't meta have an adv on dk, zelda, and GW. I'm failing to see how they are neutral? Would anyone care to elebarte how those 3 don't get gimped to hell like all the other characters especially DK and Zelda.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Only the TC knows that...

 

[Boolossus]

I've seen dozens of MK vs Snake tourney matches, and I don't see a trend to either character winning consistently. The more skilled player always comes out on top in those matches... which would make them an even matchup.

Also... call me crazy, but I think that Zamus > Snake. I tend to lay the **** on Snake's pretty badly when I play them with Zero Suit, completely opposite of what happens in those disgusting pictures of Snake having his way with Samus that are floating around the web. Armor pieces work really well on slow characters, and Zamus can edgeguard him really well. Her Dsmash to Spike combo can get him a lot, especially when you notice that his up B doesn't sweetspot. She can also keep her distance from him well, and her speed allows her to avoid his projectiles. Her projectile, side B and long grab range can poke at him and set him up for other attacks without putting herself in much danger.

 

[Samuelson]

This matchup chart is so wrong...the Lucario section made me laugh out loud when i saw that Falco and TL are bad matchups.

 

[~ Gheb ~]

Samuelson, your avatar is...cute

 

[Boolossus]

This matchup chart is so wrong...the Lucario section made me laugh out loud when i saw that Falco and TL are bad matchups.

I agree. The problem is that too many players that main one character come to this thread and that flaws the chart. And arguing is pointless, because you'll be shot down by other character mains. The Samus section, for example, is a disgrace. Seriously, over 1/2 of her matchups are incorrect.

What we need is 2 or 3 experienced, sensible and knowledgeable players to represent each character in a committee. These players would debate which matchups are good/bad for their character with the rest of the committee. This way, the sensible people would have their voices heard, and listened to, instead of being shot down by dozens of people who don't know what they are talking about. I suppose that we could hold an election thread on each character board so that each character community could choose the individuals that they feel would represent their character the best.

The members would have to be honest... they couldn't be members that say, "MARTH HAZ NO BAD MATCHUPS, HE ***** ALL CHARACTERS!" Those are the kinds of people that have flawed this chart in the first place. They would have to be willing to admit which characters give their main a hard time, along with the characters that their main tends to do well against.

I admit, this idea seems a little far fetched. But I am 100% positive that having a committee of only a few experienced character mains to represent each character would result in a far more accurate chart.

 

[IvanEva]

I keep meaning to update again for the lower characters (which thus would affect the higher ones as well) but looking for a job has been a part-time job and all that.

Boolossus: I quickly skimmed through the Samus part and it looks fine to me (which of course means nothing since I made it...). Which of Samus' match-ups do you feel are incorrect (apart from Bowser)?

Also, I should probably put a disclaimer on the front that basically writes the chart off as being my opinion only (which it is - it's how *I* see the current metagame), although I am, of course, striving to make it as accurate as I can.

 

[Boolossus]

I keep meaning to update again for the lower characters (which thus would affect the higher ones as well) but looking for a job has been a part-time job and all that.

Boolossus: I quickly skimmed through the Samus part and it looks fine to me (which of course means nothing since I made it...). Which of Samus' match-ups do you feel are incorrect (apart from Bowser)?

Also, I should probably put a disclaimer on the front that basically writes the chart off as being my opinion only (which it is - it's how *I* see the current metagame), although I am, of course, striving to make it as accurate as I can.

I know you're trying your best Ivan. <3 This chart reflects the views of other individuals, not your own. It's certainly better than having no chart at all. And some parts of it, such as the Metaknight section, are nearly perfect. MK seriously does have no bad matchups, he breaks even with characters at worst.

I seem to be really opinionated and nosy lately, when I used to just not care. IDK what's up with me.