Guide Ice Climber Match Up Guide

[Meme]

Well not too recently I got to play against a Zelda so here are some things...

- Pressure works on her, since most of her moves have a lenghty start-up time compared to ICs.

-If in the aire, try to keep below her poking with U-airs (her d-air's priority is really low).

-Watch out for Rising and late F-airs/B-airs.

-At early percentages be careful on dash attacks since usually setups for B-airs/F-airs.

I usually go for a baiting game Dashdancing, retreating Ice blocks, wavedashing with shield on.

 

[Binx]

I would love to see this thread remade or revived or a new Match Up Thread made.

What information is missing, our match ups havn't changed in quite some time, the characters that aren't finished are largely irrelevant in the current meta game.

 

[PEEF!]

Binx, If you could add all of the info posted in the "vs Character" threads, we could call this guide legitimately up to date.

 

[Binx]

Link me some posts, I dont have time to go searching through stuff anymore, I'll try and add stuff as people request it, just post a link to the post you want, or copy it here.

 

[AshuRawRun]

What can be done against Samus's forward B spam?

 

[Fly_Amanita]

Dammit, I was planning on testing out a few things about that yesterday, but I forgot to.

The standard counter to missiles is to shoot ice blocks. If you hit the front of the missile, the ice block should cancel it. Since you usually shoot two, one will continue towards Samus and apply some pressure, albeit a marginal amount. The problem with this is that Samus can shoot one missile before landing and then immediately shoot another upon hitting the ground, in which case the second missile might hit you while you're still lagging from the ice blocks.

Another option that's really good when Samus isn't too close to you is to just jump on a platform and let the missiles pass below you.

If Samus is close to you when she shoots a missile, you can wavedash fsmash into her; the missile will hit Popo, but Nana will be fine and her fsmash should hit Samus.


Yesterday, I wanted to check how the good the ICs' aerials are for stopping missiles. I'd guess that fair, bair, and certain parts of nair could all stop in missiles. It would probably be better at times to intercept missiles this way instead of just shielding them.

 

[Kyu Puff]

D-air is the best aerial for stopping missiles. I'm guessing f-air and b-air would also work, but the timing would be more difficult. N-air doesn't really work for some reason. Certain ground moves like u-tilt should also work depending on the height.

 

[ChivalRuse]

Is it the standing smash missiles that can be ducked under or the missile-cancelled missiles?

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

I don't know why don't we spot dodge and ice block/down-B if she shoots another one popo can sheild it easily and keep nana safe.

just an idea.

 

[ChivalRuse]

Spotdodging is pretty unreliable in general, since Nana tends to be too slow on hers and get hit anyway. Missiles move pretty fast.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

@ICG: I think the ICs' spot dodge lasts too long for that to work, but I could be wrong.

Kyu: Does short hop dair work? I'm guessing it wouldn't if the missile is too high, although I could just crouch in that case. Also, how about angled-up ftilt?

I'm basically looking for quick alternatives to shielding a missile that allow the ICs to remain mobile, kind of like how Peach can nair through missiles. Like, when I play a Samus on FD, I often end up full jumping around over missiles when my shield gets weak, but it would be better if I could just intercept them on or near the ground in a way that lets me keep moving.

 

[Kyu Puff]

Shorthop d-air works, probably for any relevant height. It can also beat fully charged charge shot.

Powershielding missiles is actually pretty reliable, you just have to run forward a little so that Nana's shield doesn't interfere.

Chivalruse: You can duck under standing smash missile.

 

[ChivalRuse]

I feel like bair is the way to go in that department. Nair lacks range and the hitbox is too stuttered to be reliable. Fair would be hard to react at closer ranges with. Dair doesn't cover very well in front, especially at SH height. Bair seems like a good option, since it auto cancels, which means you do things like bair a standing missile and then immediately wavedash and bair Samus from certain ranges.

I feel like upward angled ftilts could also serve as a useful alternative.

Edit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ircu0TIwzs#t=0m7s

Check out dair's hitbox. I feel like it doesn't have good coverage to their immediate flank. You've got me interested, though, so I might test it out for myself.

 

[Kyu Puff]

I'm not really sure why it works, I think the missile just breaks before it has a chance to hit you. B-air works too, but the hitbox isn't out nearly as long, so it's easy to mess up the timing and get hit.

 

[Fly_Amanita]

Dair's hitbox does look marginally wider than the ICs' hurtboxes and any difference at all there should be sufficient.

When you say nair "doesn't really work," do you mean it can work, but often doesn't?

 

[AshuRawRun]

Ok I mean against something like that:
http://www.youtube.com/user/dphanna#p/u/236/f7dTYVM6E_s
the samus shouldn't be moving, she just stays under the plate-forme and she does her ****y spam...
There are 3 Samus in France, I'm ALWAYS playing against them in tournament and I lose because of that with IC... (Fly you already know Porc, don't you? )

 

[Binx]

Ok I mean against something like that:
http://www.youtube.com/user/dphanna#p/u/236/f7dTYVM6E_s
the samus shouldn't be moving, she just stays under the plate-forme and she does her ****y spam...
There are 3 Samus in France, I'm ALWAYS playing against them in tournament and I lose because of that with IC... (Fly you already know Porc, don't you? )

You can use up angled forward tilts iceblocks and good movement to get them to do something predictable, you get around projectile camping from all characters in a similar way. You dodge and block and hit them down without putting yourself in a vulnerable position, if at all possible try and get within a range you can punish them for doing something in. With samus I like to get into a mid range and then try to time my iceblock to hit her first missile then her, you have to be patient and make them approach you.

I never liked wavesmashing and taking the hit but it can work and it would be a worthy trade if samus is at medium high to high percents.

 

[mastermoo420]

Whattt wavesmash is the coolest and, imo, most effective punisher there isss P: Besides a grab, lol.

 

[ChivalRuse]

Is there a reason why Nana's CC is worse than Popo's? If you go into training mode and have Link/Y.Link throw a bomb/rang, Nana receives more stun than Popo when she gets hit while CCing.

 

[Binx]

Is there a reason why Nana's CC is worse than Popo's? If you go into training mode and have Link/Y.Link throw a bomb/rang, Nana receives more stun than Popo when she gets hit while CCing.

Cause shes a girl

 

[Wobbles]

Cause shes a girl

Pretty much this.

 

[Facepalm]

I don't know if this was posted beforehand but can anyone confirm this? When you downthrow a Ganon at like 50-80ish% assuming the Ganon Di's away from you... can you wavedash into downsmash? I've done this a couple times with solo IC but not sure if the Ganon would be able to 360 the joystick and jump

 

[ChivalRuse]

It works on Sheik. Not sure about Ganon. If you expect him to jump, you can always upsmash/uair...

 

[AshuRawRun]

Hi , I've played yesterday with some Parisians, and now I haven't got problems against samus anymore (I juste get her in the air and I chase her but I don't let her touch the ground again, IC are faster and their up aerials/smash are good) but now I've got problems against Falcon... =(

He's too fast, I can't grab him and his attacks are blocking mine and they hit me whereas mine haven't enough range... He kills nana in like 1 combo and she's pretty dumb, she got always hit...

Any suggestions or video of an IC ****** a GOOD Falcon (I haven't any in mind, if I find one I could try to copy the IC's game...)?

 

[Smasher89]

If you want inspiration: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQsSw9JylKY (chu vs jiano on dreamland, that match is too good XD). I noticed chu might have the possiblility where he jagbs jiano at the right ledge, to probably have time to jab>turnaround dsmash for a maybe more powerful edgeguard.


Currently thinking about what to pick against Ganon(who secondaries peach), last time i pulled a pink shinobi against him at KJ64 and after that taking the set (got a hit last 3 seconds getting both to get to last stock 0%, then won after 3min more play). Didnt play yoshis against him since I think it´s probably ganons best stage...

 

[AshuRawRun]

I like to play on Yoshi Story against Qlex's Ganon, it's probably a good stage for ganon but otherwise ganon survives way too much. Can't kill him before 150% on other stages soooo... But I never beat Qlex in tournament =x

And thanks again for the match, if anyone knows more match please post them =D

 

[ChivalRuse]

A few helpful Wobbles posts on the Falcon matchup:

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=10481460&postcount=2463
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=10516433&postcount=2488
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=10517544&postcount=2492

 

[Binx]

Thanks, added.

 

[AshuRawRun]

Yesterday I played a French Falcon player, the match was like:
I wait near the edge, I grab, ADA to make him face the edge, F-throw, Forward Air => Death (at 0% when I grab) and I did this 4 times, lol...

Up tilt is cool against Falcon too I guess.

 

[ChivalRuse]

F-throw -> fair is pretty cool. I should do it more.

 

[AshuRawRun]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DpsIoIZl11s
A freeplay match against Slhoka, it was freeplay so I was rushing like a dog lol
Although in the end I start thinking a bit but rushing is way more fun ^^
I tried Fly's chaingrab combo with Charge F-smash => d throw=> release/regrab during stun... But I failed ^^' haven't played for 1 month and 2 weeks =s but well I did better than I expected at those friendlies sadly the first match on FD wasn't recorded, there was an amazing combo 0=>death

 

[AshuRawRun]

Sorry for the double post, here's a match versus a Ganon (it's not his main, he mains Samus, and has probably the best Samus in Europe, French top 5 player)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZNxuwiTvEtk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f3fdDEGNb7w

 

[AshuRawRun]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kL3gQueM_Ow&feature=fvwk
^ ICs Versus Falcon
Some time ago I was asking Falcon advices but well I guess it's okay now:
I'm thinking that against Fox, Falco and Falcon, being agressive and rushing with some wavedash F-smash is the best strategy...
It might be because the people against who I play are used to play against my IC and I've been trying to stop this "rushing" strategy this year so they developped a metagame "anti-unrushing ICs"...
Well I was pretty surprised when I 3 stocked that falcon, he usually ***** me but I've been very lucky I guess.

Now I've noticed I got some trouble against Doraki (he plays Fox) because he totally knows my playstyle, I guess I would have less trouble against a REALLY better Fox (like Amsah's or Armada's or Zgetto's) than his Fox...
But I've been thinking of this a bit and I kept in mind how he was playing against me (lots of camp, shine jump, shine jump, shine "oh nana is dead"...) and I think if next time I remember that I must change my style to play against him I can **** his fox... I'm going to try this as soon as possible and try to take a vid where I'll do 1 or 2 cool tricks.

 

[AshuRawRun]

Sooooooooo I've been playing against Doraki's fox yesterday and I've been more in a "I want to win" logic, this time I've won almost all our matchs, I don't know if it was because I was more motivated or because I tried to change a bit my playstyle to counter his shine, jump, shine tactics (I haaaaaaaate that, but I must say it works pretty well on many ICs)
I've been more focused on his game and I tried to see when I could punish him.
I think now Fox vs IC is in IC's favor (but it needs a lot of training).

Any IC player who wants to beat a good fox should altern Rushing/turtle style, it's ****, when you rush they start adapting and they try to punish, when you're turtleling they start rushing and they make many mistakes. What I want to play now is an IC vs a really good Ganon.
I'd love to play against Kage...

 

[Fly_Amanita]

The extent to which ICs can rush down Fox varies a lot by stage and by the Fox player. You more or less can't rush down platform-happy Foxes on Battlefield and Dreamland; even on stages like FoD and Yoshi's, catching them can be a pain. You need to be really patient and cautiously look for openings. It's a lot easier to sneak in surprise approaches against Foxes that like to stay near the ground, though.

 

[INSANE CARZY GUY]

I think you're winning because you're unpredictable in that way ice climbers play like defencive

 

[Doraki]

Guys, almost all = 7 out of 12.

Cheers.

 

[AshuRawRun]

Guys, almost all = 7 out of 12.

Cheers.

I thought it was more like 9 out of 12 (in proportions), my bad then, anyway it was way better than the last time we've played. BTW could you post the match on FoD (you know the one I'm talking about right?)

 

[choknater]

i feel like this thread should be more active hahah

peepee's thread has rom's top 3 discussing specifics about matchups lol

ic's really need that

cuz i really feel lately that dominating strategies can be devised now that we are constantly learning more about the character's strengths

i feel like we haven't fully delved into the power of moves like the tilts, blizzard, or squall

but yeah

lets get some discussion going hahah :D

lets talk about marth

 

[Fortress | Sveet]

isn't ICs about being either horizontally liner to the opponent or vertically liner to the opponent?