Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[SuperSonicFlyer]

A few of the Assist Trophies would have presumably been chosen if Ultimate had more characters. I think an example is Isaac who was presumably popular on the ballot. Maybe even Geno.

Maybe a character from Xenoblade X would have been included since that game released before planning started.

Good point, that was exactly what I was talking about, or trying to say.

In regards to the bolded part, maybe that kind of adds to why people think next game is Geno’s last chance to join? Just a thought.

 

[Undella2]

Since this was a double post, I wanna say just, Impa is the best possible Zelda newcomer. That's all.

Personally, I think that if Impa were to be added, they should remove Sheik (which is what I'd think should've been done when they separated Zelda/Sheik in Smash 4). Never been a fan of how Zelda representation in smash (or in many fan-games / fan-rosters for that matter) has a bunch of different versions of the same character or trope (or how Doctor Mario is a seperate character from Mario proper, or how ZSS and normal Samus are seperate). I know that Impa isn't Zelda, of course, but Impa and the Sheik persona would both be Sheikah Ninja type characters.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Personally, I think that if Impa were to be added, they should remove Sheik (which is what I'd think should've been done when they separated Zelda/Sheik in Smash 4). Never been a fan of how Zelda representation in smash (or in many fan-games / fan-rosters for that matter) has a bunch of different versions of the same character or trope (or how Doctor Mario is a seperate character from Mario proper, or how ZSS and normal Samus are seperate). I know that Impa isn't Zelda, of course, but Impa and the Sheik persona would both be Sheikah Ninja type characters.

I used to share the same opinion. A separate Sheik made ZERO sense to me back in the day. When I saw that Charizard was revealed on his own, and Zelda was revealed way before Sheik and had a new Down B (Phantom Slash, which wasn't confirmed to be Down B yet but we knew)... this only made me more confident. Its weird but... somehow Sheik stayed. I expected a sort of similar situation to how Young Link was replaced for Toon Link more or less between Melee and Brawl.

Nowadays , I don't really think Sheik will be gone unless there's a major reboot. I don't even think that many characters will get cut. If so, then yeah, Sheik makes sense. But in a way, if Sheik stays Impa's chances get better maybe. Due to possible semi clone status or Echo Fighter status being options then. I want her unique but those are possibilities too of course.

 

[BrawlX10]

I think the major frontrunners for Microsoft are the green shooty guys, whichever of the two they're willing to pick. Personally I think with how much material Microsoft has under their belt, it would be better served to branch into a different genre and audience before falling back on a scrimblo. But after that, I'm sure Microsoft would be on the table to receive two characters and Crash could certainly be on the forefront of that.

Im not too sure about Master Chief chances tbh, i think Doomguy is a bit more likely.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I think Lyn probably suffered the most here. She continues to be one of the most popular and prominently advertised characters in her series but struggles to find an entry point into Smash since it prioritizes the most current protagonists at that point in time. Without a clear opening for a "loose" Fire Emblem character, this just remains one of the most explicit victims of bad timing and nothing more or less than that. Under more normal conditions she'd probably be in.

Personally, I'd also throw Rhythm Heaven in here if the series doesn't get a new game anytime soon. Having been planned for Smash 4, the avenue for inclusion was already there but now we're back to square one because we haven't had a new game since then and it's unclear how likely we are to get one. And unlike Isaac, there's no unified support behind one singular Rhythm Heaven character nor as vocal or intense support at large. I see a fan push having some impact on Golden Sun's visibility and representation but RH doesn't even have an Assist Trophy.

Rhythm Heaven missing out on Smash 4 was so tragic and frankly I kind of wish they had been the character worked on at the tail end instead of Bowser Jr. who was always likely to stay a prominent character, even though I know they probably have different workloads lol

I mean Smash 4's project plan was in 2012 when Fever came out in Japan the previous year, and Smash 4 released in 2014, when Megamix would come out the following year. It was legitimately optimal timing for a Rhythm Heaven character, but just didn't work out.

 

[Thegameandwatch]

I think Lyn probably suffered the most here. She continues to be one of the most popular and prominently advertised characters in her series but struggles to find an entry point into Smash since it prioritizes the most current protagonists at that point in time. Without a clear opening for a "loose" Fire Emblem character, this just remains one of the most explicit victims of bad timing and nothing more or less than that. Under more normal conditions she'd probably be in.

Personally, I'd also throw Rhythm Heaven in here if the series doesn't get a new game anytime soon. Having been planned for Smash 4, the avenue for inclusion was already there but now we're back to square one because we haven't had a new game since then and it's unclear how likely we are to get one. And unlike Isaac, there's no unified support behind one singular Rhythm Heaven character nor as vocal or intense support at large. I see a fan push having some impact on Golden Sun's visibility and representation but RH doesn't even have an Assist Trophy.

Pokemon examples:
Lot of Pokemon missed their chance for the same reason as Fire Emblem.

The only character from that series who was added long after their generation is Pokemon Trainer but FRLG was still new when Brawl was planned and that’s where their design came from

My opinion is that Mimikyu would have been the Pokemon that was chosen if it wasn’t a starter from Gen 7. It’s also the most popular from that generation that wasn’t a starter.

Gen 3 and 5 rep because of time. Gen 5 rep would have presumably been Zoroark.

Could happen to Generation 8 unless it’s Legends Arceus rep since that game released before Gen 9 so it could be considered depending on when the game was planned.

 

[Perkilator]

Gong back to Crash, I’d like to once again reiterate that Japan loves him way more compared to his Microsoft-adjacent competitors, so I at least think that gives him somewhat of an advantage.

 

[Dukefire]

It is the International Women's month, so to ask some female characters.

What do you think about Lara Croft's position for the next smash bros? Also, what would her design be based on her history in the Tomb Raider series?

 

[Undella2]

I feel that Smash Ultimate's insistence to bring back, like, 90% of the stages from past games also led us to missing out on some neat new stage concepts they could do for series that might "deserve" more or more representative stage picks.

Like, Fire Emblem for instance? They have, like, "generic castle siege", "generic coliseum", "not actually a generic arena technically but it sure feels like one", and "okay an actual place with character for once but all the background characters look like ps2 npcs". Yoshi just has variations of generic Yoshi's Island stages IIRC, and there's still not a proper full Bowser's Castle stage, which one would think would be an obvious pick. Among other examples.

A new game would, I believe, allow the devs to put a breath of fresh air into series' stage picks / representation. I hope they ease up on the traveling stages and "basically just battlefield but with a fancy video playing in the background" ones though.

 

[BrawlX10]

You know, something I thought of...

If you have not noticed, we only had five newcomers with original movesets in Ultimate. (Inkling, Ridley, Simon, King K. Rool and Incineroar), while there were five echoes. (Daisy, Ricther, Chrom, Dark Samus and Ken). One other was a semi-clone, (Isabelle) and with that, we technically had more fighters with copied, non-original movesets (or five and a half counting Isabelle as a half) and even Melee had around eight newcomers, Brawl with 12 newcomers and Smash 4 with 14, all with original movesets, and that is not counting the newcomers who were clones, semi-clones or echoes. That said, I am talking base game for all of these. Imagine how many original newcomers we could get next game in the base game with Smash 6 compared to Ultimate without Everyone is Here.

Ultimate had 5 uniques and 1 semi-clone, but it also brought back Squirtle, Ivysaur, Ice Climbers and Snake....which are 4 unique fighters and also Wolf that it's kind of a semi-clone.
Not just characters, but they had to like work on like 50 stages that weren't in Smash WiiU too and probably adjust some of the ported ones too, that also consumed some time.
I think it's perfectly doable to expect at least 10 newcomers base game (not counting echoes).

 

[fogbadge]

It is the International Women's month, so to ask some female characters.

What do you think about Lara Croft's position for the next smash bros? Also, what would her design be based on her history in the Tomb Raider series?

I would say they are reasonable but not great. while she is acknowledged as an icon of gaming I can’t say I’ve ever seen a lot smash requests for her. so I suppose I would say she’s a dark horse candidate. as for design I imagine they’d go with classic with modern as an alt

 

[SuperSonicFlyer]

Ultimate had 5 uniques and 1 semi-clone, but it also brought back Squirtle, Ivysaur, Ice Climbers and Snake....which are 4 unique fighters and also Wolf that it's kind of a semi-clone.
Not just characters, but they had to like work on like 50 stages that weren't in Smash WiiU too and probably adjust some of the ported ones too, that also consumed some time.
I think it's perfectly doable to expect at least 10 newcomers base game (not counting echoes).

Honestly, I was not talking about those (Snake, Ice Climbers and the like), though since they missed out last game, I can see how much work that could of had to be done, if those characters needed to be redone, even like Mewtwo and Roy for Smash 4.

I do think the 10 newcomers thing you said would work. Thanks for bringing up the 50+ stages thing, too.

 

[Perkilator]

It is the International Women's month, so to ask some female characters.

I’m just gonna list the female characters I’d like to see as newcomers.

• Pauline
• Dixie Kong
• A reworked Zelda
• Timerra
• Ayumi Tachibana
• Chun-Li
• Aigis
• Estelle Bright

 

[Shinuto]

The mod is fantastic, but it’s also amusing how obviously unaware these guys are of UMVC3 Phoenix Wright.

All these super complex mods with Phoenix Wright and Paper Mario, and Shantae just has a decent model over Zelda's moveset

 

[Dukefire]

I would say they are reasonable but not great. while she is acknowledged as an icon of gaming I can’t say I’ve ever seen a lot smash requests for her. so I suppose I would say she’s a dark horse candidate. as for design I imagine they’d go with classic with modern as an alt

She did make history for female characters along with Samus. So, it is no surprise her achievements makes her a candidate for Smash Bros's hall of fame.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

I feel that Smash Ultimate's insistence to bring back, like, 90% of the stages from past games also led us to missing out on some neat new stage concepts they could do for series that might "deserve" more or more representative stage picks.

Like, Fire Emblem for instance? They have, like, "generic castle siege", "generic coliseum", "not actually a generic arena technically but it sure feels like one", and "okay an actual place with character for once but all the background characters look like ps2 npcs". Yoshi just has variations of generic Yoshi's Island stages IIRC, and there's still not a proper full Bowser's Castle stage, which one would think would be an obvious pick. Among other examples.

A new game would, I believe, allow the devs to put a breath of fresh air into series' stage picks / representation. I hope they ease up on the traveling stages and "basically just battlefield but with a fancy video playing in the background" ones though.

Ultimate bringing back like 90% of the old stages is why I'm hoping next game will focus more on giving us a fresh stage list where the majority is new stages (and I don't mean a small majority either).

I think it's one of the easiest ways to make the next Smash stand out from Ultimate, since stages are like half of the equation of a match. The only exceptions in my eyes are things like Boxing Ring which is really almost all Punch-Out can give as a stage and some of Ultimate's new stages depending on veterans included, like Cloud Sea of Alrest, Garreg Mach, Spring Stadium, New Donk City, etc. But only a handful kinda like Brawl did, rather than like half of the stage list being returning stages like Smash 4's stage list.

I also really want Battlefield to have a different feeling to it come next game, because as much as I like Battlefield, I feel like it's been wearing Brawl's aesthetic for the last three games.

 

[SuperSonicFlyer]

Yeah, I must admit, too many old stages came back in Ultimate. I know there was not room for many newer ones, but there was not much new in stage variety. I do hope there are plenty of new stages next game.

 

[Dukefire]

Yeah, I must admit, too many old stages came back in Ultimate. I know there was not room for many newer ones, but there was not much new in stage variety. I do hope there are plenty of new stages next game.

We will see in time...

Until Switch 2 has initiated launch worldwide, the answers will remain unguided without coordinates to the targets.

 

[SuperSonicFlyer]

We will see in time...

Until Switch 2 has initiated launch worldwide, the answers will remain unguided without coordinates to the targets.

Honestly, Dukefire, you can say that again!

 

[Undella2]

It is the International Women's month, so to ask some female characters.

What do you think about Lara Croft's position for the next smash bros? Also, what would her design be based on her history in the Tomb Raider series?

Personally, as for new female characters that I'd be most happy to see, I'd say-

-Terra Branford
-KOS-MOS
-Ashley (from WarioWare)
-Reimu
-Saber (Artoria)

...and maybe a few others, like Amaterasu (from Okami) and Morrigan.

Ultimate bringing back like 90% of the old stages is why I'm hoping next game will focus more on giving us a fresh stage list where the majority is new stages (and I don't mean a small majority either).

I think it's one of the easiest ways to make the next Smash stand out from Ultimate, since stages are like half of the equation of a match. The only exceptions in my eyes are things like Boxing Ring which is really almost all Punch-Out can give as a stage and some of Ultimate's new stages depending on veterans included, like Cloud Sea of Alrest, Garreg Mach, Spring Stadium, New Donk City, etc. But only a handful kinda like Brawl did, rather than like half of the stage list being returning stages like Smash 4's stage list.

I also really want Battlefield to have a different feeling to it come next game, because as much as I like Battlefield, I feel like it's been wearing Brawl's aesthetic for the last three games.

Some part of me wishes they brought back the melee FD aesthetic for either of the "generic" stages next game, tbh. Pink and black is a striking color scheme.

 

[SuperSonicFlyer]

Personally, as for new female characters that I'd be most happy to see, I'd say-

-Terra Branford
-KOS-MOS
-Ashley (from WarioWare)
-Reimu
-Saber (Artoria)

...and maybe a few others, like Amaterasu (from Okami) and Morrigan.



Some part of me wishes they brought back the melee FD aesthetic for either of the "generic" stages next game, tbh. Pink and black is a striking color scheme.

Oh, I agree on Melee’s Final Destination and how it looked. It also looked a bit bigger than the later versions of the stage. That is why I was not too thrilled with the later versions.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Some part of me wishes they brought back the melee FD aesthetic for either of the "generic" stages next game, tbh. Pink and black is a striking color scheme.

Honestly I'd be fine with about anything as long as it's different lol

We've been rocking the "temple ruins-looking stage placed high in the sky with a running day/night cycle" for three games now. I'd take something more mechanical, something in space, something that looks incredibly natural and overgrown, I just want the stage to look different aesthetically, including the background.

Should also note I think FD has been fine about this. Brawl's FD looks completely different from Smash 4's FD (my personal favorite with the Earth and Sun dynamic in the background, I just wish it didn't blind me every so often lol), and Ultimate's FD has that cloudier aesthetic to it that changes to like a fiery turmoil looking thing in the background, so they feel different aesthetically to me. Melee's is great too and I really like the more digital form it takes background wise if I remember it right.

This is exclusively a Battlefield problem for me.

 

[Dukefire]

Other than possible stages and the ongoing characters discussions. Do you think Sakurai is still voicing King Dedede for the next game if it is a way to pass the torch? Also, would his new design be used?

 

[Undella2]

Other than possible stages and the ongoing characters discussions. Do you think Sakurai is still voicing King Dedede if the next game if it is a way to pass the torch? Also, would his new design be used?
View attachment 399920

Who generally voices Dedede in the Kirby games these days?

 

[Dukefire]

Who generally voices Dedede in the Kirby games these days?

Don't know, but I know Sakurai does voice the blue penguin in Smash Bros. It does fit since HE created Dedede along with Meta Knight, Kirby and Marx to name some.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

Who generally voices Dedede in the Kirby games these days?

His current voice actor is Shinya Kumazaki, the current director of the Kirby series at HAL.

 

[Pupp135]

Speaking of, which are these characters you guys feel missed out the most?

If I wnet by series.

Honestly, I could see Toad going down this route. He is an evergreen Mario character that could‘ve joined back in Melee or Brawl without people batting, but it seems that something else gets prioritized each time. Just like prior games, I could see Waluigi and a character like Pauline getting prioritized next game.

In addition to Toad, I think Meowth and Eevee earn shout outs for this type of scenario as Pokemon Trainer was the only time where an older generation of pokemon was chosen, but they do have the Fire Red and Leaf Green remakes to account for. Just like Toad, they had been recurring pokemon that just never made the jump to SSB.

The other fighters that I want to highlight here are Lyn, Krystal, and Rex. Lyn is a popular character is in a similar situation to Eevee and Meowth where the newest character from Fire Emblem gets priority. Krystal was a relevant and requested fighter during Brawl’s development cycle, but Wolf got prioritized partially from time constraints, and she hasn’t been relevant post-Brawl. Rex definitely has had bad luck where timing prevented his inclusion in base Ultimate, and technical limitations then prevented him from joining Fighters’ Pass 2. Now that Aegis is here, and we have Xenoblade 3 game since then, I think Rex will be left behind unfortunately. Honestly, Rex might have received the worst hand of the bunch.

For unrepresented franchises, I think Rhythm Heaven is the only one where I think this applies to given the planned fighter for the SSBFor Era and that Rhythm Heaven is now a dormant franchise. I don’t want to put Isaac here just yet as his requests may give him the push to join next game.

Related to Rhythm Heaven, I was recently thinking about the Gematsu leak and the fighters missing from it (Robin, Rosalina, Bowser Jr., and Duck Hunt). Given that Rosalina was excluded, I’m curious as to why she wasn’t on the list of characters.

 

[Thegameandwatch]

Oh, I agree on Melee’s Final Destination and how it looked. It also looked a bit bigger than the later versions of the stage. That is why I was not too thrilled with the later versions.

I think the one from Brawl is my favourite or at least the music.

I find it weird that it was absent from P+ outside of classic mode since other stages have alts in that mod.

 

[Dukefire]

His current voice actor is Shinya Kumazaki, the current director of the Kirby series at HAL.

How fitting. Two head director voicing one of the OG Kirby characters. One for running the modern Kirby series and the other for Smash Bros and creator of Kirby series itself.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

While I don't have any nostalgia for Melee's Battlefield and Final Destination aesthetic, I would like to see something that shakes them up, as well as differences between the battlefields.

 

[Thegameandwatch]

Related to Rhythm Heaven, I was recently thinking about the Gematsu leak and the fighters missing from it (Robin, Rosalina, Bowser Jr., and Duck Hunt). Given that Rosalina was excluded, I’m curious as to why she wasn’t on the list of characters.

If it’s real then It’s presumably an early draft before it was finalized which could be why Chrom was listed originally who was briefly considered but was dropped for not being distinct compared to Marth and Ike.

I think the reason why the Chorus Kids were cut was for the same reason as the Ice Climbers since they would have been 3 characters at once which would be a problem on the 3DS.

I think Rosalina and Luma took that slot of being a multi-character gimmick since she can run better on the 3DS compared to the Ice Climbers and Chorus Kids for example.

 

[fogbadge]

Other than possible stages and the ongoing characters discussions. Do you think Sakurai is still voicing King Dedede for the next game if it is a way to pass the torch? Also, would his new design be used?

yes and no

 

[BrawlX10]

Yeah, I must admit, too many old stages came back in Ultimate. I know there was not room for many newer ones, but there was not much new in stage variety. I do hope there are plenty of new stages next game.

I think it was fine for Ultimate since a lot of those stages had been absent for years. But for Smash 6, having 90% of the stages be old would be kind of repetitive and lame, honestly. I feel like 90% of the stages should be new. That said, I’d be fine with bringing back some newer Ultimate stages like New Donk City Hall or Mementos, and maybe a couple of missing stages like Woolly World or Mute City Melee. Imo, Let the 64 to Smash 4 stages that were present in Ultimate rest for a while, at least in the base game.


As for items, I’d be fine with removing some of the older ones like Smoke Balls, Gust Bellows, Grass (Cucco or Beehive, they’re basically the same—just keep one), Killer Eye, Drill, Hocotate Bomb, etc. and add new items instead, and there are plenty of new item ideas they could experiment with. I’m fine with them keeping all the new items introduced in Ultimate, though I wouldn’t miss the Ramblin' Evil Mushroom if it gets cut.


For Assist Trophies, I think they could keep fan favorites like Ashley, Alucard, Isaac, Krystal, Bomberman, and Midna (if they don’t become playable). But as much as I think Klaptrap, Chain Chomp, Twomp, Tiki, Vince, Devil, Arcade Bunny, and the like are cool, I think they could be replaced by new ones instead. Pokéballs are pretty much the same—keep the popular ones, but it’d be nice to see a fresher roster both with Pokeball newcomers of new and old gens.


This is probably a hot take, but I wanted to share my thoughts anyway.

 

[PersonAngelo53]

While I don't have any nostalgia for Melee's Battlefield and Final Destination aesthetic, I would like to see something that shakes them up, as well as differences between the battlefields.

Maybe something more Natural looking like the one in the bottom right could be cool for a new aesthetic for Battlefield. This is from the concept art for smash ultimate’s battlefield. Honestly some of them I find even cooler than what we end it up getting. There is more concept arts but I can’t find the other pictures in good quality at the moment.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

Yeah, I must admit, too many old stages came back in Ultimate. I know there was not room for many newer ones, but there was not much new in stage variety. I do hope there are plenty of new stages next game.

If they recycle all the HD stage assets they made for Ultimate then they will totally have the time for more new stages.

 

[SMAASH! Puppy]

Maybe something more Natural looking like the one in the bottom right could be cool for a new aesthetic for Battlefield. This is from the concept art for smash ultimate’s battlefield. Honestly some of them I find even cooler than what we end it up getting. There is more concept arts but I can’t find the other pictures in good quality at the moment.

Huh. I don't think I've seen these particular ones before. A lot of them look like they came from the Tak or 3D Rayman games.

I understand not using the designs with crazier stuff happening below the main platform since collisions would be jank and/or hard to read and/or different in a way that they maybe shouldn't be for the most basic stage, but I think the concepts themselves are more interesting then the rehash/remixes of Brawls Battlefield and Final Destination.

 

[TheFirstPoppyBro]

View attachment 399922
Maybe something more Natural looking like the one in the bottom right could be cool for a new aesthetic for Battlefield. This is from the concept art for smash ultimate’s battlefield. Honestly some of them I find even cooler than what we end it up getting. There is more concept arts but I can’t find the other pictures in good quality at the moment.

I think the funniest thing about these concepts is that the middle one with the brown walkway makes me think of like Donkey Kong Country Returns' aesthetic, like it looks like a DKCR version of Battlefield to me lol

That said, this is the kind of thing I'm talking about, enough of cribbing Brawl's Battlefield, gimme something with an interesting flair or a different vibe to it like the overgrown vine one on the bottom right. Maybe make it a bit darker than usual, make it feel kinda foreboding in a way, just do SOMETHING different and interesting with it.

 

[SuperSonicFlyer]

If they recycle all the HD stage assets they made for Ultimate then they will totally have the time for more new stages.

Makes sense, though I do not know if they will have more time to make new stages by what extent, as I can imagine there being work to be done even with recycling assets from past stages. Still, what you said does seem to have merit, as there would be some time, given how some of the stages before Ultimate had to be redone or took a lot of work, that kind of stuff.

 

[Undella2]

Maybe they could have final destination be the more "bright" generic stage in the next game and have battlefield(s) be more "dark" in comparison, as a sort of switch-up.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

Related to Rhythm Heaven, I was recently thinking about the Gematsu leak and the fighters missing from it (Robin, Rosalina, Bowser Jr., and Duck Hunt). Given that Rosalina was excluded, I’m curious as to why she wasn’t on the list of characters.

Simple.

The information was given by the source in sets.

Initially only were mentioned.

It wasn't until AFTER that we got "Pokémon from X/Y" which would be as well as Chrom (who was initially considered before was picked instead) and the Chorus Kids in the second set.

Rosalina was likely in the second set that would have been leaked but had already been revealed by then.
With probably being saved until one final leak until the source got ****ed over by Robin showing up instead of Chrom, alongside who was unaccounted for due to being a later separate addition. They probably knew by that point their 15 minutes of fame were up, especially when they tried to claim Shulk was about to be revealed that day. So a double whammy.