Q&A thread ASK QUESTIONS HERE.

[hichez50]

What should lucario do after we get spiked from a falco player. Just post anything that works.

 

[phi1ny3]

If it's spike out of dthrow, learn how to DI. If it's offstage, it's usually because you got too close to the ledge where he can throw those out safely. It's a lot of preventative work. I usually just like to throw out a little BAS because sometimes by the time they've gotten close to you from the other side of the stage (for some odd reason, I always find myself getting sent across the stage v. Falco more than on the closer side), the BAS slows them enough. Recovering from below requires that you go reaaaaally low if you want to mix it up that way, because Falco has more risk coming down close to you to dair than you double jumping and ESing back onstage (if he misses, he has to use firebird, which is pretty bad). Basically, treat spike like an aerial SL for below the stage. If you got hit by it, it's usually because you ran out of options or it was your own fault for being predictable.

Or do you mean how to survive a spike?

 

[hichez50]

No I just mean getting spiked on the stage. There follow up options are really good. What usually gets me is that frame 3 jab. I feel that my only option is to roll away. I feel like I do better when I purposely take ~14% so I can't get chain grabbed.

 

[phi1ny3]

Oh, the jab's frame 2 btw, but yeah, now I know what you mean. If he tries going for a grab, just jab out of his jab mixups (it's literally zero frame advantage for him), it'll force him to use the full jab combo instead. If it's at low percents, you can spotdodge the grab to beat his "pillaring", at higher percents though, you're usually going to take a smash or at least a jab/ftilt

 

[hichez50]

What do you mean by zero frame advantage?

 

[phi1ny3]

He doesn't have enough frames to shield most quicker attacks after doing his jab mixups (especially after jab1), most people don't realize this though and get grabbed this way. If you can discourage him from putting grabs into his jab game (we also have good options for if he does the multijab, which makes his CQC game sorta weaker but still strong), you can usually limit it to when he reads a mistake instead of stringing into a grab.

 

[hichez50]

Is there a guide that talks about frame advantages. I hear people say things have +1 frame Adv. etc.. I would just like to read up on it more.

Thanks I will defiantly experiment with jabing though.

 

[phi1ny3]

Yeah, if they do A/AA -> grab, just jab, FP (sometimes, very risky though), or grab them out of it if it didn't push you far away (or if you DI'd closer), if the do the full jab flurry, you can SDI really quickly and dair or do a falling FP on them out of it (once again, risky if they catch onto it).

 

[Aurane]

How many force palms should Lucario spam for a Grab combo on Bowser?

 

[phi1ny3]

Lucario used to be able to chaingrab characters with sideB, then he took an aura sphere in the knee.

 

[Browny]

Why Phil... why...

 

[hichez50]

How many force palms should Lucario spam for a Grab combo on Bowser?

It all depends on percents. Realistically ~3

Also, does lucario have any air grab release off the stage to aura sphere strings? It seemed to work on a CPU Bowser 100% of the time. But I am not sure if that is the CPU just being dumb.

 

[Steam]

Acceleration Due to Gravity Boost While Fastfalling

34. Lucario (0.00)

Does this mean fastfalling doesn't help our vertical survivability?

 

[hichez50]

Should lucario be using a certain move if their opponent uses there mid air jump above the stages?

 

[D. Disciple]

uair

best os

 

[hichez50]

Hey I was doing some stuff in training mode today and I was wondering if the back part of fair is safer on shields? also does pivoting side b offer a range increase?

 

[Karnu]

This may seem like a odd question but I should ask it.

When facing Olimar is it a good idea to use double team when you have Pikman stuck on to you?

I ask this because since they are smacking you and you are not flinching would it be a good idea to use double team seeing as it will go into attack mode. I never played a decent olimar user yet so I would like to know. Also some feedback on how to deal with olimar would be great as well thanks.

 

[D. Disciple]

Hichez - That depends if you're crossing them up, but I'm pretty sure it's not.

It does not offer a range increase if you pivot it.


BC25, not a good idea at all. You leave yourself vulnerable.

Shoot auras spheres, space fsmashes and grab him. You don't jump until he's in the air.

 

[Karnu]

Hichez - That depends if you're crossing them up, but I'm pretty sure it's not.

It does not offer a range increase if you pivot it.


BC25, not a good idea at all. You leave yourself vulnerable.

Shoot auras spheres, space fsmashes and grab him. You don't jump until he's in the air.

wow its that simple? OK thanks for that I will remember that so why is it not a good idea to be in the air till olimar is?

 

[Aurasmash14]

wow its that simple? OK thanks for that I will remember that so why is it not a good idea to be in the air till olimar is?

Because if you're in the air and Olimar is in the ground, you will get *****.

HARD.

There is very little a Lucario can do to fight against a grounded Olimar trying to swat him out of the air. Just his Usmash alone should be reason why you don't jump over him.

 

[Karnu]

Alright, thanxs for that.

Sorry about the dumb question I'm still learning.

 

[Aurasmash14]

Alright, thanxs for that.

Sorry about the dumb question I'm still learning.

No it's alright. I was the dumbest of the dumb for a realllyyy long time when I used to hang out here.

 

[Blondie.]

What are lucario's oos options? Also, what do you guys do to oos cancel an aura sphere? Like I mean, how do you do the aura sphere charge to shield to jump cancel? I have my r button set to jump and tap jump off. I try to sheild then quickly press r, then do something with the c stick, but I always end up getting a roll instead of oos aerial. Sorry if I worded that question a little weird lol!

 

[D. Disciple]

It wasn't dumb BC25, it's just Olimar is really dumb. The less you're in the air the better.

Once you can figure out the olimar's habit then you can punish with aerials, but until then play it safe.

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Oli's shield is small, so you can poke it if you wear it down a bit. Pretty risky though.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

How do I play against Wario?

 

[hichez50]

Master fundamentals.

Wario doesn't have anything that special about him other than that he can run away and take a few more hits than other characters. Be aware of that and always to keep your percents lower than his and try to get the first kill.

 

[D. Disciple]

space your fairs, spam bas, if he tries to bite, shoot an aura sphere immediately.

Back and Fthrow are your friends in this match up, so are tilts, jabs and dair.

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

Clap takes 8 frames to hit, our DAir takes 4. Mind you challenging his clap or our DAir is extremely risky business...

If you land on a platform he will normally try to Clap the landing lag. Land above him with caution, but Clap kills at over 137%ish if you horizontal DI to the max on neutrals. Wario just has options and an easy airdodge to escape with. Ironically his airdodge lasts as long as ours, but his aerial mobility makes him so friggin' hard to hit.

 

[phi1ny3]

Don't use laggy ground moves (in general they are bad, but especially in this MU). Take control of air space, while mixing it up to make sure he doesn't just vertically outzone you to compensate (with double jumps or SH aerial punishes underneath you).

Be aware of how tires work, so many people do stupid stuff like drop shield mid-way into a tire combo and get hit hard for it.

Also, pretend your shield doesn't exist for half the time. Wario's aerials pressure shield so easily and safely (especially with grab crossups and bite), and pinning yourself in one spot is disadvantageous.

What are lucario's oos options? Also, what do you guys do to oos cancel an aura sphere? Like I mean, how do you do the aura sphere charge to shield to jump cancel? I have my r button set to jump and tap jump off. I try to sheild then quickly press r, then do something with the c stick, but I always end up getting a roll instead of oos aerial. Sorry if I worded that question a little weird lol!

Best out of shield options are nair, fair, dair, shield grab, utilt, dash attack, jab, roll, and spotdodge. The best ones for dealing with faster things on the ground are utilt (for crossups), dair (really good because it hits extended hurtboxes from the other attack, and it's frame 4), grab (if you powershield or the move wasn't spaced right), rolls, dash attack (for well spaced, but somewhat laggy moves), and nair (doesn't punish a lot, but it's safe).

The trick to AS canceling is practice, practice, practice. On the ground, what you want to do is break it up into different parts. First, charge the AS, then just keep shield canceling it to get a handle on the timing. Then after, add the jump, focus on trying to get the jump out as fast as possible. The main thing that helps is to input the jump going first and foremost, then immediately move in the direction you want to go while just barely jumping out (it'll look jerky, but after some time, you can make it look smoother, but that's essentially the order you want the input to go), if you do it at once, you'll usually roll (or grab if you're buffering an aerial). While in the air, you want to try to air dodge as late as possible before landing, and it'll make it look seamless. After that, you can experiment timing it differently (like blocking a little while still charging, then punish out of shield after they've been blocked).

by the way, the easiest way to get crossup pivot grabs or turn-around grabs coming behind on someone's shield is to do an air dodge first.

 

[PEACE7]

how safe is fsmash on shield?

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

how safe is fsmash on shield?

Depends.

Factors:
1. Aura. Max Aura; Same stock Lucario's FSmash has 0 adv/disadv iirc.
2. How good is the opponent's Shield DI?
3. Character (lol Up B OoS).
4. Spacing. Tipper or no tipper.

Normally I'd say its probably a dumb move. A somewhat, sometimes useful pressuring tool if used for high % mindgames though.

 

[PEACE7]

Depends.

Factors:
1. Aura. Max Aura; Same stock Lucario's FSmash has 0 adv/disadv iirc.
2. How good is the opponent's Shield DI?
3. Character (lol Up B OoS).
4. Spacing. Tipper or no tipper.

Normally I'd say its probably a dumb move. A somewhat, sometimes useful pressuring tool if used for high % mindgames though.

Oh alright i see good to know thanks for the quick answer

 

[MythTrainerInfinity]

I could probably write an entire chapter of the book of: How to play Lucario just on FSmash spacing.

Oh! Don't forget to stutterstep FSmash sometimes! It can make a big difference in regards to spacing and not getting punished or hitting.

 

[Richi]

Watch me vs best wario in Mexico, maybe it can help u a little with this MU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKvtfK8LQGc&feature=relmfu

 

[garm993]

How exactly does this happen? I mean obviously I don't want it to happen so yeah because that happens. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ZeoMhpXEqfo#t=175s

 

[#HBC | Joker]

Pretty sure he UpB'd into the side of the stage.. it looks like he actually hit his head on the underside of the ledge, but I don't think that can happen on SV so I can only assume he was directing it to the right.

It's also likely that he was accidently holding down on the joystick, making it so he can't grab the ledge. I mention this because Lucario is kinda notorious for being amazing at snapping to the ledge, and I'm not sure why he wouldn't ledgesnap otherwise.

 

[hichez50]

I could probably write an entire chapter of the book of: How to play Lucario just on FSmash spacing.

Oh! Don't forget to stutterstep FSmash sometimes! It can make a big difference in regards to spacing and not getting punished or hitting.

This is not an exaggeration.

@garm993 He was too close and was slightly positioned to the right. If he was lower he would have been fine. I remember reading something way back in 2008 about this. If anyone remembers jeepysol(or something like that) he said stuff about it when he discovered all the UP-B tricks.

 

[hichez50]

nvm my bad

 

[Karnu]

Whats the best way to beat DK?