Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

This did seem pretty believable when Shinobi discussed it, but it only happened a few days before E3. Hard to say whether it was a guess or not, but its close proximity to E3 could mean he somehow found out at that point. But like, these text leaks and lists that claim to know months in advance or list like "20 characters considered for DLC" and have most of them but not all correct are just BS imo. Throw enough mud against a call and some of it will stick after all.

Now, if it was the eve of E3 and someone somewhat reputable were like "Psssst... It's About Time we got a new Smash character", maybe that would be a good indication as to who is coming or something. But months away and from 4ch text leaks of all things, no way.

It's not uncommon for people to guess Crash is coming, like that one fraudster Twitter person who guessed Byleth right, or the 4chan leak that assumed KOS-MOS and Reimu would be among the next folks.

That being said, I'm really unsure Sak and Ninty would allow Acti to flirt violation of a NDA like that. It wouldn't be much of a surprise if we knew he was coming, after all. They can afford to tease announcements of upcoming games, but doing this for a Smash appearance would be overstepping bounds.

Besides, so far third-parties that have more involvement in Smash than spirits tend to deny that there's something from them coming in Ultimate, whether it's a fighter or Mii.

Literally the only real leak from the DLC was SNK. And that wasn’t some insider putting a text post on 4chan, that was Nintendo accidentally updating Smash’s copyright list a few days early before the Nintendo Direct that announced Terry.
It’s been VERY close to the chest. Which makes sense, Smash’s development team is much smaller post release than it was to first create the game, and 3rd party discussions can pretty safely be done with just a few legal department folks.

I remember the time people doubted that Hero was coming at all, regardless how much insiders talked about him, and even Tansut trying to get his contact guy to verify whether Erdrick was truly coming (the base was actually Luminary, but about 98% of people thought it'd be Erdrick). This leak was so big that SE higher-ups were allegedly pissed off about it when someone let the info slip over there.

In any case, Sak has made sure that absolutely nothing else leaked after the SNK incident, and so far, aside maybe from some small talks of little info slips from before, nothing has leaked since then, not even the identity of the ARMS character.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Even that always felt more like a guess. People have been speculating Banjo for nearly every character announcement since Melee, and Banjo just had some merch pop up.

This did seem pretty believable when Shinobi discussed it, but it only happened a few days before E3. Hard to say whether it was a guess or not, but its close proximity to E3 could mean he somehow found out at that point. But like, these text leaks and lists that claim to know months in advance or list like "20 characters considered for DLC" and have most of them but not all correct are just BS imo. Throw enough mud against a call and some of it will stick after all.

Now, if it was the eve of E3 and someone somewhat reputable were like "Psssst... It's About Time we got a new Smash character", maybe that would be a good indication as to who is coming or something. But months away and from 4ch text leaks of all things, no way.

Shinobi is a moderator over at ResetEra and their modding staff is known for being very credible with info. Shinobi very likely knew the truth about Banjo & Kazooie in Smash before hand as he also teased at Ridley before a couple of months before he was announced at E3 in 2018.

 

[Shinuto]

This could explain Shantae's lack of presence in crossovers as of late.

"Interesing to note: Sakurai said on the Sephiroth stream that sometimes characters being in other crossovers or fighting games affect negotiations of said characters. Smash Ultimate and MvCI were being developed at roughly the same time, so maybe they had issues with getting Monster Hunter content (besides Rathalos and a couple of songs) in Smash; but now that MvCI is long out of development, Smash has the road clear to continue negotations with Capcom about Monster Hunter in a fighting game. "

 

[Paragon-Yoshi]

That's nothing new really, now is it?

 

[Megadoomer]

This could explain Shantae's lack of presence in crossovers as of late.

"Interesing to note: Sakurai said on the Sephiroth stream that sometimes characters being in other crossovers or fighting games affect negotiations of said characters. Smash Ultimate and MvCI were being developed at roughly the same time, so maybe they had issues with getting Monster Hunter content (besides Rathalos and a couple of songs) in Smash; but now that MvCI is long out of development, Smash has the road clear to continue negotations with Capcom about Monster Hunter in a fighting game. "

He only talked about that in relation to the music.

https://youtu.be/vsY0pdCW9N0?t=1951 (for whatever reason, the video is age-restricted, so I can't embed it)

What he said was "We know that people would like to have more music from this series in this game. However, we were met with some challenges. For example, if a character is featured in a different game or appears in another game as part of a collaboration, there are some cases in which songs from the original game aren't included. We need approval from all the copyright holders in all regions. [...] We only include the songs in the game after all of these issues are resolved."

The quote only mentioned music licensing - it said nothing about characters not being able to get into Smash because they appeared in other crossovers. (or not being able to get into other crossovers because they're going to be in Smash) The inclusion of Ryu, Terry, and Shovel Knight (among many, many others) should make it clear that appearing in crossovers or making guest appearances isn't an issue.

 

[Paragon-Yoshi]

The quote only mentioned music licensing - it said nothing about characters not being able to get into Smash because they appeared in other crossovers. (or not being able to get into other crossovers because they're going to be in Smash) The inclusion of Ryu, Terry, and Shovel Knight (among many, many others) should make it clear that appearing in crossovers or making guest appearances isn't an issue.

Well, Shovel Knight is not a playable character.
And I don't recall any recent crossovers, that Ryu and Terry were in.
But even if that is the case, Ryu and Terry always appear in traditional fighting games, that are vastly different from Smash.

 

[Megadoomer]

Well, Shovel Knight is not a playable character.
And I don't recall any recent crossovers, that Ryu and Terry were in.
But even if that is the case, Ryu and Terry always appear in traditional fighting games, that are vastly different from Smash.

Ryu's in basically every Capcom crossover, while Terry most recently had a crossover appearance in Fighting EX Layer.

Either way, the quote was referring to music licensing - it's not like Sakurai said "if a character appears in another crossover, it's impossible for them to appear in Smash". (or, going by what was being implied, "if a character's going to appear in Smash, then it's impossible for them to appear in other crossovers") He was just trying to explain the almost complete lack of Final Fantasy content in Smash 4's DLC and Ultimate's base game.

Shantae's lack of crossovers (aside from Blaster Master Zero) could just be because WayForward is protective of the character. Her lack of crossover appearances isn't a hint that she's going to be playable in Smash, and Sakurai's comment doesn't even imply that's the case.

 

[Paragon-Yoshi]

Ryu's in basically every Capcom crossover, while Terry most recently had a crossover appearance in Fighting EX Layer.

Either way, the quote was referring to music licensing - it's not like Sakurai said "if a character appears in another crossover, it's impossible for them to appear in Smash". (or, going by what was being implied, "if a character's going to appear in Smash, then it's impossible for them to appear in other crossovers") He was just trying to explain the almost complete lack of Final Fantasy content in Smash 4's DLC and Ultimate's base game.

Shantae's lack of crossovers (aside from Blaster Master Zero) could just be because WayForward is protective of the character.

I have no issues with you pointing out the music licensing. That makes sense.

The only thing I see issues with, is your argument about Ryu, Terry and Shovel Knight.
The games Ryu and Terry appear in are not at all like Smash Bros. So they don't make an appearance in a game that is "the enemy", aka Smash Bros like games.
And Shovel Knight... Like I said, he is not playable.

As for WayForward being protective of the character:
Why then would WayForward allow Shantae to appear in crossover games, EXCEPT those that are FIGHTERS in any shape or form?!

 

[meleebrawler]

I have no issues with you pointing out the music licensing. That makes sense.

The only thing I see issues with, is your argument about Ryu, Terry and Shovel Knight.
The games Ryu and Terry appear in are not at all like Smash Bros. So they don't make an appearance in a game that is "the enemy", aka Smash Bros like games.
And Shovel Knight... Like I said, he is not playable.

As for WayForward being protective of the character:
Why then would WayForward allow Shantae to appear in crossover games, EXCEPT those that are FIGHTERS in any shape or form?!

I can name a lot of genres Shantae hasn't crossed over with yet. Is not appearing in games that are tower defences or strategy RPGs supposed to mean anything?

Perhaps you meant games featuring a lot of indie characters, and the fact that the main examples of such being fighting games is a mere coincidence. More understandable to see that as being suspicious. But when I look at Wayforward, I see a company that is more concerned in pursuing creative ideas and making games out of them then trying to make one a cash-cow franchise. They don't spend their every waking moment trying to get Shantae more exposure because, get this, they make other games too and would like for people to try those as well.

That's my "reasonable" take on their behaviour: they take after Nintendo in that they do what they want to do rather than what fans wish for or expect of them most of the time, even if on a surface level they do engage with fans more on Twitter.

My pipe dream take would they are actually planning a big Shantae crossover with one of Nintendo's franchise (preferably Super Mario).

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Not even indie crossovers of any sort are necessarily guaranteed to get all the big names, just look at Travis Strikes Again; a lot of indie game t-shirts you can obtain, yet not a shovel knight or genie in sight. The biggest indie involvement in that game was

Spoiler

Hotline Miami, but that's not especially surprising given the subject matter of both it and No More Heroes.

Well, whatever it is they are doing, I just hope that Udon's artbook release doesn't get delayed at the last minute. It's been years at this point.

 

[SebTheGamer]

Now I’m afraid about Shantae getting Mii’d. If she did, honestly that’ll be messed up

 

[GoldLiger]

Less than an hour and a half before we find out if Shantae is or is not a Mii costume.

I hate tension like this lol. Oh well time to enjoy some Digimon games.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I think you guys will be safe. Given the theme of Pyra & Mythra, Shantae doesn't fit the bill.

 

[GoldLiger]

1 HOUR LEFT!!!!!

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Now I’m afraid about Shantae getting Mii’d. If she did, honestly that’ll be messed up

I honestly would prefer Shantae getting a Mii costume over just a Spirit as that would be the 2nd best option if she isn't going to be a playable fighter.

 

[GoldLiger]

Five minutes left!!!!

 

[Jorichi]

I honestly would prefer Shantae getting a Mii costume over just a Spirit as that would be the 2nd best option if she isn't going to be a playable fighter.

Same, anything is better than nothing. I'd also rather get a disconfirmation now rather then later.

Anyways, here's to hoping we'll get some food for some good speculation.

 

[Dukefire]

It didn't start Mii Costume wave 9 immediatly. So good or bad news for now

 

[RetrogamerMax]

It didn't start Mii Costume wave 9 immediatly. So good or bad news for now

Well, the demand for Geno was more obvious which is why I think Nintendo started off with the Mii costume wave last time.

 

[Dukefire]

Well, the demand for Geno was more obvious which is why I think Nintendo started off with the Mii costume wave last time.

Yeah. Of course, Pyra is Fire power and Mythra is Light Speed with the mechanics of Sheik and Zelda back in Melee and Brawl with Down Special.

Plus, Pyra's outfit still show some skin, just not at the chest area.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Yeah. Of course, Pyra is Fire power and Mythra is Light Speed with the mechanics of Sheik and Zelda back in Melee and Brawl with Down Special.

Plus, Pyra's outfit still show some skin, just not at the chest area.

What I was saying was Nintendo knew the demand for Geno which is why they went immediately went showing off his Mii costume.

 

[Staarih]

Well, the demand for Geno was more obvious which is why I think Nintendo started off with the Mii costume wave last time.

They used the FF7 Mii costumes throughout the presentation, so they had to be shown first or the surprise would have been ruined.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

They used the FF7 Mii costumes throughout the presentation, so they had to be shown first or the surprise would have been ruined.

That makes sense.

 

[Dukefire]

So when kirby copy a fighter's neutral special, it is a littlr STRONGER then the original fighter.
Neat.

Edit: here comes wave 9

 

[GoldLiger]

Shantae is safe once again.

 

[Silvera]

Phew. We dodged another bullet once again. Shantae is still running strong.

 

[MeteoRain]

Huh, Monster Hunter and Ghosts N Goblins.

Once again, my intuition is totally off.

 

[Dukefire]

Although, sad for monster hunter rep. Lloyd is still safe.

And Sakurai didn't say for another DLC pass, so FP2 may be it.

Also, the duo comes out Today!

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Well Our girl and Lloyd live another day. I'm happy for his fans as this really seemed like the time they would bring back his costume. Also that alleged leak about the concert may be done now.

It's interesting, maybe Lloyd could get in, or maybe there is another swordfighter coming that they thought his reveal fit better with.

 

[Dukefire]

We will see when E3 rolls over.

 

[RetrogamerMax]

Well, looks like Concert leak is dead which means Shantae is still in this. I have a good feeling about this. I don't care if I'm right or wrong, I'm riding the Shantae train until the end! Who's with me?!

 

[Jovahexeon Joranvexeon]

Well, looks like Concert leak is dead

It is? What got de-confirmed?

 

[Schonberg]

Kinda surprised we didn’t even get a single new XBC2 costume with the Miis today, but hey, Ghosts and Goblins!

Also Pyra and Mythra look like a ton of fun, can’t wait to try them out later. ...Funny enough, I actually made a moveset for Ghirahim ages ago that used the same theme of 2 forms, same animations but one moves and attacks slower, and the specials change slightly. ...I think it’s put to better use here

It is? What got de-confirmed?

The fact that it’s a 4chan leak with no credibility?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

It is? What got de-confirmed?

The Monster Hunter and Rathalos costumes all coming back.

 

[MeteoRain]

It is? What got de-confirmed?

Monster Hunter

Edit: Jinx

 

[Motor Bug2005]

It is? What got de-confirmed?

The 2 Monster Hunter Mii Costumes from Sm4sh are coming back.

edit: ninja'd.

 

[Paragon-Yoshi]

Huh, Monster Hunter and Ghosts N Goblins.

Once again, my intuition is totally off.

At this point, I'd say: Don't even try to predict what Smash is going to do. You're always gonna be wrong.

Well Our girl and Lloyd live another day. I'm happy for his fans as this really seemed like the time they would bring back his costume. Also that alleged leak about the concert may be done now.

It's interesting, maybe Lloyd could get in, or maybe there is another swordfighter coming that they thought his reveal fit better with.

Well good to know Shantae is still in the running.
I never watch those presentations or trailers.

 

[Schonberg]

Ok, I’m gonna get this out here before any YouTube faces start jumping on this as a new theory. But.

Spoiler: *cough cough*

please don’t take this too seriously I know so many characters have figures I’m just saying expect people to start saying “so a new character has to have a figure to get into smash??!?!” so now you have ammo

 

[zferolie]

So sakurai says he has a draw locked with the future fighter figures. Know who has a figure and is still likely with second chance theory?

Edit: Damn you ninjaing me with my own theory!!!!

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Considering the Arthur Mii, it might be a safe assumption that we aren't getting anymore Capcom reps either.