Shoot First, Ask Questions Later: The Samus Tactical Discussion & Q&A Thread

[KillerJawz]

the hit box is too smallllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll

also if you hit early it sucks

The hit box is actually large O_O, I don't know what move your looking at

Also a question:

Does Fsmash have a "ghost" hitbox? (Where it won't hit the opponent). Cause' Me and NOID were playing some wifi dittos and we fsmashed eachother at seperate times from the same distance, only to have both of them miss.

 

[Mr9]

think about it this way th hit box doesnt come out untill a certain frame, now assuming you two were the right distance away from each other than the frames with hit boxes come out will be behind each samus, and since samus pushes her torso forward when she fsmashes it pushes her hurt box closer to the other samus. so in other words the hit box from one samus, and the hurt box from the other samus are going in opposite direction.

some of her other moves with her arm canon do the same thing like missiles and charge shots, if the opponant is behind the hit box when it comes out they wont get hit.

 

[xxpatgxx]

As a ZSS/Lucario main I also use Samus as a close 3rd character, and she is also my solo low tier main. I find Samus to be a mixture of both ZSS and lucario with her long range like ZSS, and her floaty momentum and CS reminds me of lucario's floatyness and AS. I just wanted to ask you guys what Samus's hardest low tier matchup is, and why?

 

[KillerJawz]

As a ZSS/Lucario main I also use Samus as a close 3rd character, and she is also my solo low tier main. I find Samus to be a mixture of both ZSS and lucario with her long range like ZSS, and her floaty momentum and CS reminds me of lucario's floatyness and AS. I just wanted to ask you guys what Samus's hardest low tier matchup is, and why?

I would have to say somebody like Mario, but even then it's 60-40 at worst. Samus does well against the very large majority of low tiers. Mario can reflect our projectiles and make recovering a living nightmare thanks to his FLUDD and cape. These both are very useful against Samus. He destroys us with his amazing jab and superior ground game, but he can't reflect our projectiles TO AN EXTENT. If we keep up the missle cancelling then he has no chance to get through it, zair also hurts him since he can't really do anything against it.

 

[NO-IDea]

Between Mario, Ness and Lucas. Probably Mario though. All other low tiers Samus has decent MUs with.

 

[LanceStern]

The thing is marios' fireballs can be pretty annoying for Samus. I'd definitely say Mario/Luigis' superior ground game is a PAIN.

And Squirtle, he's so small that a majority of our moves go over him, and his moves/aerial moves have ridiculous priority and speed. It's like a metaknight/kirby if not for the fatigue.

 

[KillerJawz]

Ness and Lucas ain't really a pain tbh. They're so easy to gimp x.x

 

[MechWarriorNY]

Quick question: Do Morph Ball Bombs cancel momentum?
It would help if they did.

 

[NO-IDea]

You can't gimp a Lucas. o_O

Ness, it's easy to gimp one, but it's not like they're going to jump off the ledge and go, "Hey! Over here! z-air me! Then tank my up+b because it's ****! Or better yet, d-air it because it's priority is crap!"

 

[darksamus77]

Quick question: Do Morph Ball Bombs cancel momentum?
It would help if they did.

They delay your fall back to the stage, useful for avoiding a charged upward smash attack from an opponent.

 

[MechWarriorNY]

What I meant is, do they stop you from moving, if you're still moving?

 

[DelxDoom]

The hit box is actually large O_O, I don't know what move your looking at

asdl;fkjdfj nair is so bad seriously that hitbox is so lame

 

[KillerJawz]

asdl;fkjdfj nair is so bad seriously that hitbox is so lame

We are honestly looking at a different move. It has a very nice hitbox AND it's a sex kick.

@Noid, missles cut off his upb.

 

[Mr9]

you guys need to seriously relax....

if one of you guys can help get me the code to do hit bubbles i will end this argument, why because i cant find the code anywhere. so any and all help will be noted.

 

[KillerJawz]

you guys need to seriously relax....

if one of you guys can help get me the code to do hit bubbles i will end this argument, why because i cant find the code anywhere. so any and all help will be noted.

One step ahead of you. A few days back I asked another user to get the .pac for Samus. He's just finishing up another character first.

And we are relaxed, your just looking at this from a dramatic angle.

 

[Mr9]

One step ahead of you. A few days back I asked another user to get the .pac for Samus. He's just finishing up another character first.

And we are relaxed, your just looking at this from a dramatic angle.

i suppose, on the other hand this trifle disagreement has been dragging on for far to long.

 

[KillerJawz]

i suppose, on the other hand this trifle disagreement has been dragging on for far to long.

Indeed it is, but your not helping the matter. I said I was getting the .pac so there is no need for you to comment.

 

[Xyro77]

Quick question: Do Morph Ball Bombs cancel momentum?
It would help if they did.

yes they do. well, they SLOW down your momentum

 

[KillerJawz]

yes they do. well, they SLOW down your momentum

And send you into the upper blast zone

*Flashback*

 

[Xyro77]

And send you into the upper blast zone

*Flashback*

Doesnt matter. He asked a question and i answered it.

 

[DelxDoom]

We are honestly looking at a different move. It has a very nice hitbox AND it's a sex kick.

@Noid, missles cut off his upb.

It's so weak compared to melee that is possible to punish on hit, is what i'm saying. Also it has no value against a shield, idk

 

[KillerJawz]

It's so weak compared to melee that is possible to punish on hit, is what i'm saying. Also it has no value against a shield, idk

Retreating moves? They are amazing on the edge.

@Xyro, and I simply added more detail.

 

[Mr9]

based on your guys own results where do you guys think samus should be on the next tier list?

 

[KillerJawz]

based on your guys own results where do you guys think samus should be on the next tier list?

Hmm, well if your referring to tourny results, based on the people I've had to face, I'd say perhaps a spot or two higher. If I had to say my own personal opinion.... She should swap places with Ness or Mario.

 

[xxpatgxx]

I would have to say somebody like Mario, but even then it's 60-40 at worst. Samus does well against the very large majority of low tiers. Mario can reflect our projectiles and make recovering a living nightmare thanks to his FLUDD and cape. These both are very useful against Samus. He destroys us with his amazing jab and superior ground game, but he can't reflect our projectiles TO AN EXTENT. If we keep up the missle cancelling then he has no chance to get through it, zair also hurts him since he can't really do anything against it.

Ah that's really helpful. What are some useful cps against Mario, that also benifit Samus, or won't hurt her at all?

 

[KillerJawz]

Ah that's really helpful. What are some useful cps against Mario, that also benifit Samus, or won't hurt her at all?

Well, in comparison to you, his recovery is VERY limited, and he doesn't do as well at mid to long range as you so.....

I would like to say Rainbow Cruise, Delphino Plaza, Final Destination and Pictochat are your best bets. Those are just my personal opinion though, I've found Mario has a hard time keeping up on Delphino.

 

[xxpatgxx]

Well, in comparison to you, his recovery is VERY limited, and he doesn't do as well at mid to long range as you so.....

I would like to say Rainbow Cruise, Delphino Plaza, Final Destination and Pictochat are your best bets. Those are just my personal opinion though, I've found Mario has a hard time keeping up on Delphino.

Makes sense, good call.

 

[Mr9]

*this comment has been moved to the the social thread.*

 

[KillerJawz]

so what is everybody studying? i mean what kind of a field are you interested to have a career in.

I think thats a question for the social thread.

 

[Mr9]

I think thats a question for the social thread.

ohh oops i thoght this was the social thread when i posted it. hehe sorry guys.

 

[MechWarriorNY]

Oh thank God. I knew they were good for momentum SOMETHING.
Thanks.

 

[-Cross-]

Is there more specific frame data that include hitbox duration and ending frames? Also what is her landing lag?

 

[MechWarriorNY]

Also, is it common knowledge that Samus can do the stutter step Fsmash?
I find it's a good tactic.

 

[KillerJawz]

Also, is it common knowledge that Samus can do the stutter step Fsmash?
I find it's a good tactic.

It's good for spacing if your using it tilted upwards, it REALLY helps against smalls.

 

[MechWarriorNY]

Yeah, I started using it today, because I wasn't sure
if Samus could do it. It's great for mindgames, and makes
Samus unpredictable, I think.

 

[-Cross-]

Has anybody done Samus' hitbubbles yet?

 

[Xyro77]

I have some one working on it now. please relax.

 

[KillerJawz]

I have some one working on it now. please relax.

Ah good, the guy who I asked bailed on me D:

 

[RaigothDagon]

I've got a few questions for those experienced with the MK matchup.

Where do you DI after MK's dthrow so it puts you in a position to zair him? Is this damage dependent, in other words, if Samus is at a higher percentage do you have to DI some other direction?

Where do you DI after MK's followup throws, for instance I notice but can't remember which throw follows into his fair and usually upb -> KO. If you guys could tell me which throws they are, where to DI and/or when to airdodge/(insert what action).

Where do you DI/SDI when caught in MK's uair strings?

How do you usually reach the ground when put in the air by MK? This one is very baffling to me.

Edit: Shoot, I thought I was done. But after talking to a guy that beat me in pools in my first tourney, I realized that I also have questions about Olimar.

What is the best way to get the Pikmin off of Samus? Does nair work? And is it a sound strategy? I realized zair worked well against Olimar on most occasions, but sometimes a yellow will come up and go straight through it.

 

[DelxDoom]

Just don't DI towards him, then you can easily airdodge-zair. Depending on the mk he'll usually shield that though, so you gotta be quick from then.

Fthrow is a lot faster than dthrow and might catch you offguard - it's also the one that usually leads to shuttle loop or fair if you're not careful.


As for Olimar, usually I would uair the pikmin or jab them off, Olimar is such a difficult matchup though.

Usually I try to be "aggressive" with fast aerials when I get pikmin stuck on me so that I can try hitting Olimar and the pikmin off me in one go, that can work but usually doesn't. Depends on the opponent as well.


I'm no good with DIing out of strings, sorry lol