You think Bowser will be competitively banned?

[BaPr]

But to answer the question, no. Bowser will definitely be a higher tier, but his attacks are still too slow and not as far ranged as a really good fighter. The reason I said that is his speed got higher, but in brawl, his attacks were really slow and a little bit of better speed won't make him OP. Now, please don't say that he is going to be revamped and his moves might not be the same as brawl, I know that, but I am just saying that because I am 100% sure he will have at least 1 or 2 moves from Brawl.

 

[Neo Zero]

But to answer the question, no. Bowser will definitely be a higher tier, but his attacks are still too slow and not as far ranged as a really good fighter. The reason I said that is his speed got higher, but in brawl, his attacks were really slow and a little bit of better speed won't make him OP. Now, please don't say that he is going to be revamped and his moves might not be the same as brawl, I know that, but I am just saying that because I am 100% sure he will have at least 1 or 2 moves from Brawl.

Oh so you know how the entire roster plays and acts then right?

While this thread did give me lots of laughs, I'm surprised some people took this seriously. Even when the game comes out, there wouldnt be any evidence of him being OP at all. Now a few months down the line, he wins tons of tournies and is the most played character due to "tier whores" then maybe this question is something that COULD be asked, but at the end of the day, just because someone can look good in pre release videos doesn't mean anything. For example, Hsien Ko looked like she might be decently viable in her pre release videos of Marvel 3 and look how that turned out. Its nice to see people excited, but there is a difference between theory crafting and stupid general statements. Its kind of why so many people had their laughs and the thread grew like it did, because a logical person knows this kind of thing can't possibly be known at this point of time, or anytime remotely soon.

To people claiming "[X] looks way better, easily a top tier" or "Wow that looks so broken, def. ban", realize that pre release videos and trailers are meant to make everyone look very good, showcasing a character to be bad is a horrible strategy. Want to speculate? Thats fine, but don't assume things like this with zero facts.

 

[volbound1700]

I think Sakurai is going to avoid having a "Metaknight" character this time around so there will be a better balance although it won't be perfect. I say it will be more like Melee.

 

[BlitznBurst]

He's not fast. What makes you think he's fast? Because he's faster than Brawl#s Bowser? That's still not very fast.

 

[Wyoming]

He needed to be faster and have a little more variety with his smash attacks and we got it. He's still a large target and most likely one of the, if not THE slowest character in the game but these changes should make him a little more interesting to use.

 

[BaPr]

Oh so you know how the entire roster plays and acts then right?

While this thread did give me lots of laughs, I'm surprised some people took this seriously. Even when the game comes out, there wouldnt be any evidence of him being OP at all. Now a few months down the line, he wins tons of tournies and is the most played character due to "tier *****s" then maybe this question is something that COULD be asked, but at the end of the day, just because someone can look good in pre release videos doesn't mean anything. For example, Hsien Ko looked like she might be decently viable in her pre release videos of Marvel 3 and look how that turned out. Its nice to see people excited, but there is a difference between theory crafting and stupid general statements. Its kind of why so many people had their laughs and the thread grew like it did, because a logical person knows this kind of thing can't possibly be known at this point of time, or anytime remotely soon.

To people claiming "[X] looks way better, easily a top tier" or "Wow that looks so broken, def. ban", realize that pre release videos and trailers are meant to make everyone look very good, showcasing a character to be bad is a horrible strategy. Want to speculate? Thats fine, but don't assume things like this with zero facts.

All I have to say is of course I know his moves, I am BaPr. BaPr stands for I am a psychic.

 

[MrBigstuff]

I think Sakurai is going to avoid having a "Metaknight" character this time around so there will be a better balance although it won't be perfect. I say it will be more like Melee.

Even Melee had Fox. He didn't invalidate half the cast single handedly, like MK, but he was still ridiculously strong.

 

[KingofPhantoms]

I still can't get over this post...I mean, out of all characters...

 

[DRM4R10]

<3

Best thing about Brawl was Bowser's side-b glitch. Mmmmmmmmm flying Bowser!

Edit: Oops, I have to contribute. Ummmmm, Bowser's stance says enough as it is. Obviously before, Bowser was struggling to layoff eating excess goombas. Now that Wii Fit Trainer is in the game, clearly his posture and his appetite are now much improved. Wait a minute...

Wii Fit Trainer is now the subject of his desires? Only time will tell. Perhaps he means to prove himself in SSB4 to win her over.

Ooooh so that's who he kidnapped in Super Mario 3D World instead of Peach. Makes a whole lot of sense.

But guys, he might be right. Meta Knight looked OP, even in the first e3 2006 trailer. and guess what, he's GOD tier in Brawl.

Even Melee had Fox. He didn't invalidate half the cast single handedly, like MK, but he was still ridiculously strong.

Atleast not half the people who win tournaments use him. Plus fox has 3 even matchups, whilst Meta Knight has one. Also Fox is placed in a tier with 3 other people. MK is in his own tier. If that's not enough, who ever considered banning Fox in Melee? Like seirously?

 

[Bowserlick]

Bowser is still a large target that will have problems dealing with projectiles. For that reason alone, he won't make it to the top top of tiers. But I bet he could be around the middle of the pack.

 

[Fastblade5035]

Bowser is still a large target that will have problems dealing with projectiles. For that reason alone, he won't make it to the top top of tiers. But I bet he could be around the middle of the pack.

His recovery is also the same, and we all know how wonderful it is.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Am wondering if he's also not as heavy as before.

 

[Bowserlick]

Have we've seen his recovery in the air? Maybe it will have armor like Ike's Up B for part of it.

 

[Toxicroaker]

Am wondering if he's also not as heavy as before.

if they are buffing him why take away one of his good points from previous games?

 

[Ryan.]

I don't think so, personally, but we'll know for sure when the game comes out. I really think he needed those improvements, and hopefully is balanced now with everyone else.

 

[S_B]

Oh so you know how the entire roster plays and acts then right?

A bajillion times, this.

Seriously, people. Doesn't anyone aside from me remember the speculation that Bowser might be top tier in Brawl after a few people had tried the game at E3? (along with some guy named "Ink" trying to name tripping after himself as "the Ink drop"? lawl)

Bowser will not be top tier because...

1. Heavy characters are almost never top tier.

Top tiers that need to be banned generally evolve from players pushing the amazing speed capabilities of certain characters to the absolute limit (aka MK, Fox and Marth). The odds are that Bowser's "speed limit" will be found fairly easily.

2. Bowser's moveset is AMAZING...unless you compare it to those of the rest of the cast.

Yes, his Brawl toolkit was better than his melee toolkit, but it was still crap compared to most of the cast that just plain had better moves:
-he has no projectile to help him approach or put pressure on opponents, meaning opponents can camp the piss out of him and spam projectiles at him endlessly.

-fire breath tends to do little more than invite punishment in most situations.

-his hitboxes aren't disjointed far enough away from his hurtboxes.

-his recovery was basically the most predictable pile of terribad in the entire game. It was just begging to be meteored or deflected.

One of the big reasons D3 was as high as he was is due to his hammer providing him with great, disjointed range so he could use it while putting himself in less danger than Bowser.

ROB, another Brawl heavyweight, had two projectiles at his disposal.

Also, D3 and Rob both have some amazing recovery.

3. "Big" in SSB just means "Big target".

The best strategy for fighting Bowser is still "Get in his face and pepper him with small attacks so he cannot react." As long as this is the case, he'll always be easy to overwhelm.

Note that the only heavyweights that make it into higher tiers (Snake, ROB, D3) all have not only projectiles but some pretty decent spacing options as well. Bowser has exactly one spacing option: the fortress, which is very easy to punish if the opponent can see it coming.

So no, Bowser is in absolutely no danger of being banned, let alone top tier, let alone 2nd, 3rd, 4th or 5th tier.

If Sakurai reveals a video of Bowser in which Bowser is spitting fireballs across the stage (like he did in Super Mario Bros.), then I might change my tune.

 

[deadjames]

Pssh no, Bowser won't be banned, I predict he'll be D-tier at worst, and C, maybe C+ at best because based on the limited knowledge we have it seems like they're clearly putting effort into buffing him.

 

[mariofanpm12]

I think that Bowser will still have some of the same general issues. He's still a heavyweight character, which means easy juggling and a large hurtbox that's just waiting to be exploited.

 

[deadjames]

I think that Bowser will still have some of the same general issues. He's still a heavyweight character, which means easy juggling and a large hurtbox that's just waiting to be exploited.

Heavyweight doesn't necessarily mean easy to juggle, I think you're confusing heavy with big because Diddy, Peach, and Wolf are heavy, but they're not nearly as comboable as say DK, D3, or Bowser.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Heavyweight doesn't necessarily mean easy to juggle, I think you're confusing heavy with big because Diddy, Peach, and Wolf are heavy, but they're not nearly as comboable as say DK, D3, or Bowser.

I hate to tell you this, but Diddy and Peach are lightweight fighters, while Wolf is mid-heavy.

Back on-topic, Bowser would still be a big and easy target to push around, even after getting the offensive buffs.

 

[S_B]

Once again, to reiterate, Bowser will still be lucky to be anything but BOTTOM tier.

 

[Pheta Ray]

I'm thinking that he won't be total garbage tier, depending on how this new line-up of characters turns out, but he'll still be low tier.

 

[Tepig2000]

*Reads the title*

 

[S_B]

I'm thinking the OP is, in fact, a troll.

Been rewatching some videos and I can already tell that Megaman is going to be a nightmare matchup for Bowser: All those projectiles........

 

[Morbi]

Bowser will be banned the day Metaknight is Bottom Tier.

 

[Toxicroaker]

Bowser will get banned if: He gets super armor constantly, and every move is an OHKO

 

[Tepig2000]

Bowser will get banned if: He gets super armor constantly, and every move is an OHKO

So he won't be banned.

 

[Toxicroaker]

So he won't be banned.

yes

 

[Superyoshiom]

Bowser will probably get a boost in the tier list, but he won't be banned. Some if his attacks still take some time, like his down B

 

[S_B]

Bowser will probably get a boost in the tier list, but he won't be banned. Some if his attacks still take some time, like his down B

I can't fault your enthusiasm, but I'm frankly not even holding out for a tier boost for Bowser.

Projectile spammers DESTROY Bowser. We know this, and while his upright posture may look a bit better, all it means is that he's a taller, easier target to hit.

Unless Bowser has something to protect him from quick characters that jump over him, run to the other end of the stage and spam projectiles, expect him to be bottom tier or damn close to it.

 

[Cpt.]

I think Sakurai is going to avoid having a "Metaknight" character this time around so there will be a better balance although it won't be perfect. I say it will be more like Melee.

I'm sure he is trying to do this, but not having an all around better character is something more easily said than accomplished.

 

[S_B]

I'm sure he is trying to do this, but not having an all around better character is something more easily said than accomplished.

Exactly this.

And I don't even think it's going to take a MK-level character to beat Bowser.

Any quick character who can spam projectiles is going to wreck Bowser. Why? Because if you can force Bowser to approach, he's basically guaranteed to lose, unless they give MK's tornado to Bowser and just rename it the "whirling fortress".

 

[Cpt.]

Exactly this.

And I don't even think it's going to take a MK-level character to beat Bowser.

Any quick character who can spam projectiles is going to wreck Bowser. Why? Because if you can force Bowser to approach, he's basically guaranteed to lose, unless they give MK's tornado to Bowser and just rename it the "whirling fortress".

Lol. I'd hope that Sakurai at least learned a lesson from the whole "tornado or infinite priority".

 

[S_B]

Lol. I'd hope that Sakurai at least learned a lesson from the whole "tornado or infinite priority".

For that and a number of other reasons, I'm hoping that the Tekken team is actually designing and balancing the movesets and Sakurai has little to do with it.

 

[Eternal phoenix Fire]

Bowser's gonna be so ****ing lame. 1 frame up airs and Up B is now Mach tornado.

 

[S_B]

Bowser's gonna be so ****ing lame. 1 frame up airs and Up B is now Mach tornado.

If only...

 

[Dropkick JD]

I'll still keep my dedication from Melee and Brawl to use him here.

I just feel as long as he has some good cover mechanism from projectiles, it'll be fine.

 

[Pazzo.]

To early to say... but If I had money on it...

 

[Xcano]

They could give Bowser a reach that takes up half the stage and he would still be mid-tier because of his size.

 

[Cpt.]

If only...

This