Ask a quick question, get a quick answer (The Marth FAQ's)

[Shaya]

If for whatever reason they're uber good at SDI, doing the third hit downwards may actually spike them (as in they've sdi'd so they're not on the ground), which can follow up into a tech read.

I wish I could really "write" (properly) everything and anything I know about dancing blade.
There is so much depth to that move, especially using it within the air that isn't part of the current 'vernacular' (i.e. metagame)

 

[Nike.]

I've been considering making a dancing blade info dump thread for a very long time.
Everything about all 18 versions isn't readily available to see, and having a thread for that could only help.

 

[C.J.]

Do it, do it, do it. I've been wanting to, but, I'm lazy and dealing with characters atm.

Also, make sure you have accurate frame data for everything about it (frame advantage of each hit/variation, how long you can wait between hits before inputting the next hit of DB, etc etc)

 

[Reizilla]

I wanted to make an info dump, but school is ****** me.

 

[PEACE7]

Nike I will love you forever if you do

 

[eveningninja]

A few questions about chain-grabbing as Marth:

1. Do I use forward-throw or down-throw to chain grab?

2. Do I use Shield + Attack or Z to do the chain grabs?

3. Which characters can Marth chain-grab and at what percents?

 

[PEACE7]

A few questions about chain-grabbing as Marth:

1. Do I use forward-throw or down-throw to chain grab?

2. Do I use Shield + Attack or Z to do the chain grabs?

3. Which characters can Marth chain-grab and at what percents?

For your first question it depends on the chaingrab for example you can fthrowX2 falco>dthrowX3 for about 41% damage. Or against Pikachu you can fthrowX2>dthrowX1 for about 32%.

For your second question you can use both.

Marth can chaingrab falco, fox, wolf, pikachu, shiek, D3. We also have an infinite grab on ness and I think also lucas. You can get the fthrow to dair near the ledge I think on almost everyone I'm not completely sure but you have to space it. There are certain characters that this works better on than others for example falco and fox its a 0 to death, and on diddy, snake if you land the dair it puts him in a very bad spot . Those are all at 0% except on ness and lucas which I think it doesn't matter what percent they are at. There's also a chaingrab on MK that Kadaj came up with but the timing is really strict. I'm sure there's much more that can be added to this.

 

[ScareMl]

For your first question it depends on the chaingrab for example you can fthrowX2 falco>dthrowX3 for about 41% damage. Or against Pikachu you can fthrowX2>dthrowX1 for about 32%.

For your second question you can use both.

Marth can chaingrab falco, fox, wolf, pikachu, shiek, D3. We also have an infinite grab on ness and I think also lucas. You can get the fthrow to dair near the ledge I think on almost everyone I'm not completely sure but you have to space it. There are certain characters that this works better on than others for example falco and fox its a 0 to death, and on diddy, snake if you land the dair it puts him in a very bad spot . Those are all at 0% except on ness and lucas which I think it doesn't matter what percent they are at. There's also a chaingrab on MK that Kadaj came up with but the timing is really strict. I'm sure there's much more that can be added to this.

peace, what's that chaingrab combo that kadaj made? is there a vid, i kinda wanna see it lol

 

[C.J.]

Pika might also be dsmashx10

The CG kadaj posted vs MK isn't legit

The CG->spike on fox isn't a 0-death. It is on Falco and Wolf though.

 

[ScareMl]

Pika might also be dsmashx10

The CG kadaj posted vs MK isn't legit

The CG->spike on fox isn't a 0-death. It is on Falco and Wolf though.

is it cuz fox can use that jump + fair thing?

 

[C.J.]

I'm pretty sure his forefox is long enough to recover on it's own anyway. But even if not, then yes, foxcopter will let him live easily.

 

[Shaya]

I'm pretty sure I tested dthrow from 0% on pika, and it isn't legit.

But dthrow tipper fsmash is legit up until like 14%.

 

[Reizilla]

I could've sworn you can't regrab Pika after a second Fthrow...

 

[Shaya]

Fthrow x2 is fine.

 

[ScareMl]

I'm pretty sure his forefox is long enough to recover on it's own anyway. But even if not, then yes, foxcopter will let him live easily.

the foxcopter i can see, but a good marth will side-b the foxfire and then mix up the up-b stage spike timing and unless that fox is a CPU, he won't tech it 80% of the time.

 

[Shaya]

What C.J. is saying its not guaranteed.
The opposing player has options to avoid death that you need to read/react to properly to finish him off.
A mix of fire fox, coptor (and all the various degrees it can go in) is enough for a Fox to survive... how reliably? probably still less than half.... but its not a guaranteed 0-death then.

 

[PEACE7]

C.J are you sure that the fthrow to dair on wolf is legit? I don't think it is I'm pretty sure he can survive I might be wrong tho.

 

[phi1ny3]

btw, does marth in the ditto get fthrow/dthrow -> tipper fsmash? I never seem to get it, like marth always has time to shield the fsmash if it's dthrow, or air dodge if it's fthrow, and I don't think it's a timing constraint.

 

[C.J.]

fthrow-> stutterstep fsmash.

C.J are you sure that the fthrow to dair on wolf is legit? I don't think it is I'm pretty sure he can survive I might be wrong tho.

99% sure

 

[Jeos]

I've got a question...

when marth lose his aerial mobility?
I was playing a g&w, and got impulsed by his up-b, but then I could not drift as freely as always, does someone know why?

 

[Anaky]

When you Upb, and then someone hits you, you'l find that you lose you arieal mobility, but you still get your Upb back obviouisly.

 

[Jeos]

yeah, I've noticed that, but this time, I didn't up-b so that's why I was surprised...

 

[FEFIZ]

Dolphin Cancel cont like Ledge Grab?

 

[eveningninja]

So, as I continue to watch Marth matches, I notice that whipping the first hit of side-B all over the place is pretty common, used as much if not more than Fairs. Is this to keep the Fair fresh for KO's? Or is there something else I'm missing here? When should I use a single hit of side-B rather than Fair? What are the main mechanical differences and advantages of each over the other?

Thanks.

 

[LooftWaffles]

So, as I continue to watch Marth matches, I notice that whipping the first hit of side-B all over the place is pretty common, used as much if not more than Fairs. Is this to keep the Fair fresh for KO's? Or is there something else I'm missing here? When should I use a single hit of side-B rather than Fair? What are the main mechanical differences and advantages of each over the other?

Thanks.

Marth has fairly limited options landing once he has used his second jump, usind db1 on the way down is a way of mixing up your landings, and creating better positioning when baiting airdodges. It stalls vertical momentum, which is helpful if they are charging a slash or something trying to trap your landing. Learn to wavebounce DB, especially when you have rco lag to land much, much safer.

 

[FEFIZ]

Dolphin Cancel cont like a Ledge Grab? Guys?

 

[ScareMl]

Dolphin Cancel cont like a Ledge Grab? Guys?

not sure what you're saying

 

[tekkie]

what the hell happened to your guys' matchup thread?

also quick rundown of the marth/ICs matchup? do you really think it's even?

 

[C.J.]

Our MU threads died. I started bringing them back to life... slowly.

Anyway, if it's possible that it will hit their shield, DON'T TIP FAIR. It just slows you down

SH rising fairs >>>> falling fairs

grabs are really good because they'll be looking for them too. Pummel puts the other in hitstun too so you can safely throw the grabbed one

Nair beats blizzard, Counter CAN work but it's not guaranteed.

If you MUST land w/ an aerial and you're not at tipper nair range use uair as it's shield push is stupid.

**** them offstage HARD

If you've used your second jump and you are falling about to land, DS RIGHT before you hit the ground. In order to grab your landing, they have to input the grab before you hit the ground (otherwise you can spotdodge). They then get hit by DS or grab you during your invincibility frames. If you whiff what's the worst they can do? Get a grab. Well, that was about to happen anyway so w/e. Zero (low) risk/high reward (the only time that applies to DS, lol)


yes it's even.

 

[FEFIZ]

"not sure what you're saying"

You only can do 50 Ledge Grabs in one game with Marth. When you do a Dolphin Cancel (B + up) with Marth is like a 1 Ledge Grab? Or you need realy "grab" the ledge? Dolphin Cancel is very fast and difficult to see it!

Better to understand now?

 

[ScareMl]

"not sure what you're saying"

You only can do 50 Ledge Grabs in one game with Marth. When you do a Dolphin Cancel (B + up) with Marth is like a 1 Ledge Grab? Or you need realy "grab" the ledge? Dolphin Cancel is very fast and difficult to see it!

Better to understand now?

oh does it count? well that's easy to check. just do a dolphin slash cancel and quit game and see if it counted as a ledge grab lol

 

[eveningninja]

Marth has fairly limited options landing once he has used his second jump, usind db1 on the way down is a way of mixing up your landings, and creating better positioning when baiting airdodges. It stalls vertical momentum, which is helpful if they are charging a slash or something trying to trap your landing. Learn to wavebounce DB, especially when you have rco lag to land much, much safer.

DB1 only stalls vertical momentum when used at the top of your jump though, right?

And how do you wavebounce DB?

Thanks.

 

[C.J.]

It always slows you down at least a super tiny bit. It only makes you go higher at the top of your jump though.

To do a special in the opposite direction (specifically up, neutral, and down), input the opposite direction then the special.

To B-reverse any special, you input the special then his the opposite direction within 4 frames.

To wavebounce any special, you combine the two of them. You hit the opposite direction, then input the special then input the opposite direction within 4 frames

 

[eveningninja]

Marth has fairly limited options landing once he has used his second jump, usind db1 on the way down is a way of mixing up your landings, and creating better positioning when baiting airdodges. It stalls vertical momentum, which is helpful if they are charging a slash or something trying to trap your landing. Learn to wavebounce DB, especially when you have rco lag to land much, much safer.

Okay, so at 2:16 in this Mr. R video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?src_vid=fE7KfINF8P4

He does a falling DB1, then a rising Fair, and a Dair spike. I'm just wondering what the point of that DB1 is. If that were me I would've just used two Fairs. Any difference?

 

[C.J.]

It's a Europe thing

 

[ScareMl]

any marths know how to play the Wolf MU?

 

[Shaya]

dancing blade,
expect the shine,
fthrow is awesome
be careful about your whiffs / spaced aerials on shield if they're rising /etc due to wolf's fsmash being pretty tops
learn to edgeguard him, it takes some practise but its very manageable to shut down his ledge options
get the spacing down for fairing (or bairing) his side b recovery, it's not too hard, but knowing the positioning for his various vertical placements to recover makes gimping him easier.

 

[C.J.]

Also, his FH fair is really gay/almost unpunishable.

 

[BluLink77]

Hey guys. I am consistently having trouble recovering. I usually end up getting the ledge or just get back on stage and can't get to a safe spot. What are my options when it comes to getting back on stage?

If helps any I usually drop then short hop back on, but I consistently lose 50%+ from trying to jump, a or b onto the stage. I just can't figure it out :/

 

[eveningninja]

It's a Europe thing

So do you think it actually makes any difference?