Q&A Falco Q&A

[Mogwai]

Quoting myself because I want an answer.

So I'm not sure how much ppl know about this, but someone mentioning walljumping reminded me of this. Tomacawk and iamthemicrowave were doing this recovery trick. Whenever they ledgeteched, they would point up getting the auto walljump of course, and also hitting the cstick towards the stage, making an instant walljump attack and bairing the attacker. It really isn't too difficult if you can remember to do it...Maybe everyone knows this.

Yea, PC told me about how Rice always does it and how it's really beast. Training yourself to do it is a decent idea, but it gets ***** at low %s vs. good crouch cancelers, so I'd still advocate stationary tech -> forward B as your default reaction.


As to your other question, I don't know what you're looking for. If you have an example of someone doing better things off a shine than you right in front of you, why don't you just do that? I mean, the only thing I can really tell you is that you shouldn't dair them above 40ish in the cookie cutter shine -> WD -> sh dair combos, because then they can tech and it's **** near impossible to follow up correctly. You're better off doing aerial shine -> platform wave land or a sexy WD reverse utilt or a JC usmash or sh uair or sh fair -> grab even.

 

[PEEF!]

Yea, PC told me about how Rice always does it and how it's really beast. Training yourself to do it is a decent idea, but it gets ***** at low %s vs. good crouch cancelers, so I'd still advocate stationary tech -> forward B as your default reaction.


As to your other question, I don't know what you're looking for. If you have an example of someone doing better things off a shine than you right in front of you, why don't you just do that? I mean, the only thing I can really tell you is that you shouldn't dair them above 40ish in the cookie cutter shine -> WD -> sh dair combos, because then they can tech and it's **** near impossible to follow up correctly. You're better off doing aerial shine -> platform wave land or a sexy WD reverse utilt or a JC usmash or sh uair or sh fair -> grab even.

Ah, very nice. Nobody has ever told me I should just stop dairing at 40 even though i figured I should stop. All those other ideas besides waveland (im not that good =P) are awesome. Thanks much.

Also may I add, fantastic recovery post. One of those "i should read this multiple times" things.

 

[TresChikon]

Wow, thanks for the guide. Not only does this huglely benefit Falco, but I'm sure it can be applied to any character. Well not per se, but getting down the thinking that you suggested can improve anyone's game.

 

[Rannskita]

technically i knew everything already, but is useful guide in terms of how to think about recovering and the mindset. last section especial

 

[halcyon.days]

Pillaring with Falco is fastest with the control stick, but it's still possible to be fast enough using X/Y so they can't grab you after you shine without being hit by a nair, right?

 

[pockyD]

why is it fastest with control stick

 

[Mogwai]

there's no reason it would be inherently faster with control stick and the vast majority of the cast will always have a window to grab you.

 

[halcyon.days]

why is it fastest with control stick

It's faster flicking up than moving your thumb to X or Y.

Also, why does Mango do a fullhop and then do double fast fall lasers as opposed to double jumping immediately? Isn't it slower that way?

 

[Mogwai]

it's slower, but safer obviously since you hold onto your double jump.

 

[TresChikon]

It's faster flicking up than moving your thumb to X or Y.

Also, why does Mango do a fullhop and then do double fast fall lasers as opposed to double jumping immediately? Isn't it slower that way?

You can shoot them midway and at the top. But they're both effective imo

 

[P.C. Jona]

is that a picture of kage wes?

lmao

 

[Mogwai]

yea, that's Kage's reaction to M2K vs. Zhu, lol, it's too good.

 

[Alukard]

this thread is amazing mogwai good work ... ima read the whole thing later =]

 

[DtJ Jungle]

Good stuff mogwai

 

[2G00d]

I completely love this thread.
Helps me to think what I need to do when playing some campy Sheik

Only problem I have is, inconsistent wavedashs.
I had better wavedash before I played fox, after I played fox my wavedash just fails into full jump.
Ne tips? :o

 

[pockyD]

airdodge later

 

[halcyon.days]

I completely love this thread.
Helps me to think what I need to do when playing some campy Sheik

Only problem I have is, inconsistent wavedashs.
I had better wavedash before I played fox, after I played fox my wavedash just fails into full jump.
Ne tips? :o

That's because when you press jump with Fox, he stays on the ground for a very short amount of time before he leaves to jump.

With Falco, after pressing jump he stays on the ground for a long time, which is why if you try to air dodge too soon you'll just full jump.

Practice practice practice. Falco (same with Ganondorf and Bowser) have weird wavedashes and you have to airdodge just a tad later. After you fiddle around with it and get the timing down, it should be no problem.

And if a Sheik is camping you, camp back. You have lasers for God's sake.

 

[Mogwai]

These are all characters' first airborne frame. So the earlier the character is airborne, the quicker proper wavedash timing is. So if you WD perfectly with Fox and screw up with Falco, you just need to adjust your WD timing to be slightly later (your Fox airdodge timing is while Falco is still on the ground and unable to airdodge). This also explains why some characters are easier to shorthop with than others, as the game detects short hops by seeing if you're still pressing jump 2 frames before you would be airborne meaning that you have twice as long with Falco (4 frames) to let go of Jump as say Fox (2 frames).

Fastest Jumps (4th frame)
Fox
Ice Climbers
Kirby
Samus
Sheik
Pichu
Pikachu

Average Jumps (5th Frame)
Doc
Mario
Luigi
Falcon
Ness
Young Link
Mr.Game & Watch
Marth

Slow Jumps (6th Frame)
Peach
Yoshi
DK
Falco
Jiggs
Mewtwo
Roy

Slower Jumps (7th Frame)
Ganon
Zelda
Link

ZOMG WTF Slowest Jump (9th Frame)
Bowser

 

[Alukard]

LMFAO at bowser

 

[Ryan-K]

it takes more time for bowser to jump than for marth to grab ._.

 

[TresChikon]

it takes more time for bowser to jump than for marth to grab ._.

:O

Bowser's like "Rawr, Dash into JC Grab!"

Marth drinks a cup of tea like a ***, "Eh come here you chubby kid" *grabs*

Disclaimer=Drinking tea is not gay, I'm just making fun of Marth.

Doesn't anyone think Falco's waveshine feels funny?

 

[Rannskita]

i like foxes waveshine a lot more than falcos tbh. feels more natural.

bowsers waveshine is legit though

 

[Mogwai]

Sounds like you should be a Fox player to me Falco's WD/Waveshine feels infinitely more natural to me. It might have something to do with maining the little ****er for 3+ years now though.

 

[Teczer0]

ZOMG WTF Slowest Jump (9th Frame)
Bowser

I takes bowser less than 1/6th of a second to jump?

Bowser is too fast for melee

 

[TresChikon]

I takes bowser less than 1/6th of a second to jump?

Bowser is too fast for melee

its less than 9000

 

[Rannskita]

Sounds like you should be a Fox player to me Falco's WD/Waveshine feels infinitely more natural to me. It might have something to do with maining the little ****er for 3+ years now though.

lol falcos gameplay is a lot more my style, basically everything about falco im better with than fox, except wavedashes (and that applies to all my characters)

fast wd = zoomzoomzoom
slow wavedash = zoo...ooom?! zooo...jump >_<

 

[TresChikon]

lol falcos gameplay is a lot more my style, basically everything about falco im better with than fox, except wavedashes (and that applies to all my characters)

fast wd = zoomzoomzoom
slow wavedash = zoo...ooom?! zooo...jump >_<

Fox needs a fast wd to be all crazy and chemically imbalanced, but Falco can just cruise all nice and flowy with his combos.

 

[4% APR]

Yea, PC told me about how Rice always does it and how it's really beast. Training yourself to do it is a decent idea, but it gets ***** at low %s vs. good crouch cancelers, so I'd still advocate stationary tech -> forward B as your default reaction.

this is awesome with marth because the bair turns you around so you can grab the edge instead of going to far from the wall jump and dying

 

[PEEF!]

On the subject of LHDL:

I swear to god I am going to kill myself if I spend another hour trying to get this **** down. I can do everything else regarding falco. I have no problem multi-waveshining, shine>firebird stalling, whatever else, except this god **** double laser p'akonib''bp'iawonbaw;or!

When I do the y button version, I shoot one too high, or I cant get the second out. When I do the control stick version, I side b or up b 95% of the time, and the other 5% I make it onto the stage and either shoot one laser too high or can't get the second out. I have no idea how you press b soon enough after the tap jump to not side or up b. =,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,[

I want to quit life.

 

[Teczer0]

On the subject of LHDL:

I swear to god I am going to kill myself if I spend another hour trying to get this **** down. I can do everything else regarding falco. I have no problem multi-waveshining, shine>firebird stalling, whatever else, except this god **** double laser p'akonib''bp'iawonbaw;or!

When I do the y button version, I shoot one too high, or I cant get the second out. When I do the control stick version, I side b or up b 95% of the time, and the other 5% I make it onto the stage and either shoot one laser too high or can't get the second out. I have no idea how you press b soon enough after the tap jump to not side or up b. =,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,[

I want to quit life.

Do the one that "feels" more comfortable to do.

Personally I use the control stick method. I generally press down on the controller then press up then make sure I have my control stick in the neutral position when I press the first B. Then I move forward and keep mashing B.

The trick is to make sure that for the first laser, your movement is only vertical. Or rather your control stick is in the neutral position I guess.

 

[noodles]

drop down lower and slide your finger from y->b. laser as you jump

 

[Rannskita]

seems like youre just too slow getting from y to b tbh. same with me though, its getting better but its rare my first laser will go at a hitable height.

just keep practising (as i am) and eventually you'll become more consistantly fast getting from y to b, and your lasers will be low, and both come out.

also, i tried the control stick method, and although it does get me same height lasers, its much more likely i'll firebird, firebird stall, or just shine or something crap. i figure thats more of a catastrophe than one high laser from the y>b method, so i steer clear of the control stick and am just training y>b

 

[MattDotZeb]

I read this whole thread 5 times and I still suck at falco what am I doing wrong?

 

[Falcinho]

you're not using upb as an offensive move enough

 

[Alukard]

i can't multi shine on someones shield ... =[

mogwai must help me next time i see him =]

 

[MattDotZeb]

Alu just keep trying it in matches, thats how Elen and myself got it down :D
Use control stick ggz


btw mogwai i really want to falco ditto you since i got ridiculously good practice vs zoso in them over the past 2 days.

 

[Alukard]

Alu just keep trying it in matches, thats how Elen and myself got it down :D
Use control stick ggz


btw mogwai i really want to falco ditto you since i got ridiculously good practice vs zoso in them over the past 2 days.

i can't do it with stick ... i can only do it with y and b -___-

but i mean i'm getting pretty beast with falco =P

 

[MattDotZeb]

idk man last time we money matched falco dittos it was me who won and i'm a scrub.
get at me!!! lol jkjk

 

[Alukard]

idk man last time we money matched falco dittos it was me who won and i'm a scrub.
get at me!!! lol jkjk

wasn't that like 4 mass maddness' ago ??

also wasn't i ****** u with like luigi ... link ... _____ *insert any char here* at dj's house

^_^

 

[MattDotZeb]

i was sandbaggin to prepare you for the scrubs in wc at genesis =P


luigi is too good btw