Lucina Moveset Analysis/Speculation/Discussion

[Xafer2468]

I know the 3ds version is coming out in two months, so the amount of change that can be done is a bit limited. In Lucina's case the minor changes that i feel need to be done are giving her the awakening fighting stance ( thats her trademark, sakurai, how could you err in that?) and her brand of the exalt. Honestly, with Lucina being a clone and these problems with her basic appearance, it feels like they just slapped her in the game last minute.

 

[Raetah]

That would be Luigi, he was like the Roy to Marth, but even more unique where he had his own original side.

What you suggest that Falco brought to Melee could be said here. I hope you are not only claiming that Falco livened up the Tournament scene.

Falco is much better than Fox, his UP Smash attack has more K.O. potential. His blaster has more knock back stopping attempts of getting back on the stage. His Aerial Down Air has spike to it. And it may just be me, but his Reflector seems to be easier to spike with.

The only character(s) I would not pick over Falco is a Goomba or other common enemies, but that isn't saying much.

Well i supose this is your way to end a conversation, see you other day!

 

[Gameboi834]

Marth has prominent gold trimmings on his outfit

 

[extremechiton]

What fair?

i mistook dolphin slash for a new fair

 

[Farorae]

Probably not a complete clone, but with the amount of similarity so far might as well be.

 

[KurashiDragon]

There is enough of a difference between their outfits to distinguish the two in the heat of battle. There might also be a height difference but I'm not sure about that.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Well i supose this is your way to end a conversation, see you other day!

Not really, but if you want to stop the conversation, then that is fine by me. Good day!

 

[Solbliminal]

Just wanna toss my two cents in since I saw this thread as I was passing through. From the looks of it, Lucina is going to be very heavily based on Marth. More so than even Roy was. That isn't something I'm personally okay with. Because the one appeal between Marth and Roy was the difference in strength, speed, and visual flares. Lucina seems to be more of a Namco design choice where the movesets look nearly identical, but act differently with hardly any visual difference unless you are a competitive player who pays a lot of attention to detail. A good comparison here would be something like the difference between Asuka Kazama and Jun Kazama from TTT2.

Honestly I would be completely okay with Lucina if she at least had a lot more unique animations or attacks. I don't care if it is one or the other. Just give her anything to make her differentiate from Marth more. That is literally the only issue I'm having with her existence as of right now. But until then, she remains an inferior successor to Roy in my eyes. I don't care what Roy's standing was in Melee. But to replace a Marth clone with a less inspired Marth clone just feels plain lazy. Whatever though, honestly.

 

[Saikyoshi]

If all else fails, just remember which one you're controlling and which one you aren't.

Unless you're playing Free-For-All. Then you're supposed to get confused.

 

[Saikyoshi]

She's going to get Roy's attacks for her customs, I have a feeling.

 

[8-peacock-8]

One has longer hair and has a different body shape than the other.

 

[ClinkStryphart]

Hair, Clothing, Sword. If you look carefully enough everything is different.

 

[Reginleif]

There's honestly no reason to make Lucina a clone. First of all, contrary to the general notion, she does not fight like Marth. Yes, she disguises as Marth! A big part of her appeal is her being Masked Marth. But it is already known she fights like her father, Chrom, as stated in Two Falchions. Since Lucina is a female and has a lighter, thinner body than the Marth in SSB4, she should be able to perform more quickly and jump higher.

The only reason Roy was a clone was due to time constraints, and since the roster was finalized this time around before production began, how come they decided for Lucina to share the same moveset as Marth?

Lucina is not an alt I believe because she is an announced newcomer and her own character.

Since Sakurai is so against clones and redundancy, I can't help but question why Lucina was decided to not have a completely unique moveset.

This situation can play out as another Marth / Roy or Fox / Falco, which don't seem to be the goal this time around for Smash Bros. There HAS to be a good reason why Lucina is a clone.

Perhaps Sakurai only wanted Robin due to that extremely unique fighting style we've all witnessed already and Intelligent Systems really wanted their favorite and the most popular character of Awakening, Lucina. It might have been a last minute addition, honestly. I'm not even sure Intelligent Systems can push characters that hard. Things can change, even though Sakurai stated the roster finalized before production.

 

[Saikyoshi]

I think it's probably because FE really doesn't have that much moveset potential with sword fighters.

I'm just glad her standard attacks are mostly different.

 

[KurashiDragon]

They seem to have the same moves through and through but there might be differences. Lucina is likely to be faster but with no sweetspot on her blade. Aesthetically, I think the clone route makes a lot of sense. Awakening is a spiritual successor to Shadow Dragon with Lucina being a direct descendant to Marth. Heck, she even pretended to be marth in the beginning of the story. It actually kinda makes sense for Lucina to be a marth clone. That said, I do hope there will be at least some differences to warrant a character slot for her.

 

[Wraeith]

Honestly I still suspect she's just a Marth alt. Their hitboxes were purposely made similar.

Unless Lucina adopted Marth's top tier Brawl technicalities, thus making her superior to the nerfed Marth. :D

If Lucina is stronger than Marth I'm not convinced it'll be by a wide margin unless the power-balance is completely off scale. A lot of Marth's strength was derived from the tipper, and I have to assume that's at least one mechanic that will remain unique to Marth through all of the other nerfs.

I fear they'll both be severed parts of what old Marth was in order to give them both a more distinct flavor. There may be a very sad irony that Lucina plays more like Marth than Marth if this proves true.

 

[Reginleif]

I think it's probably because FE really doesn't have that much moveset potential with sword fighters.

I'm just glad her standard attacks are mostly different.

I really wish her final smash will be different at least. Performing the Awakening and summoning Naga would make up for that loss of Grima by Robin.

 

[Saikyoshi]

She has the same specials as Marth, though I would assume they have some different properties (her dancing sword and dolphin slash seemed different to me, but I'm not a big Marth player so the exact differences aren't exactly clear in my mind).

Her u-air looked visually similar if not visually identical (again, not a big Marth player) to Marth's. Her nair, however, looks significantly different to me, unless I'm going insane. If you take a look at this gif http:// gfycat.com/ FineSentimentalGecko, I hope you'll see what I'm talking about. To me, it looks like her nair is NOT a "double slash" with two hits - one forward, one behind - like Marth's is, but rather is more of a multihit "spinning slash."

To me, the progression of the move looks like it hits:
Forward, hits Samus
Backward, hits no one
Forward, hits Samus again
Backward, hits Greninja

Then she brings it forward again for a sweep to bring it back around to the front. Not sure if this part has a hitbox though. IIRC, Marth should only have two hits on his nair and more ending lag.

I could be wrong for sure, though - like I've said, not huge on Marth so it could still be identical and I'm just missing it since I don't know him well enough.

So you're saying she has Roy:M's Nair?

Well, that's better than Marth's, at least. She could be Sakurai's answer to Roy:M. If that's the case, reliiiiief.

 

[DANICK]

Let's wait for the release of the game and them we will say if she is a clone or no allright

 

[BertEast]

So you're saying she has Roy:M's Nair?

Well, that's better than Marth's, at least. She could be Sakurai's answer to Roy:M. If that's the case, reliiiiief.

Nah, her nair is similar to Marth, but it swings in front of her three times. The animation is nearly identical, but the attack seems to last longer

 

[Reginleif]

Let's wait for the release of the game and them we will say if she is a clone or no allright

That side B, up B, down B are all the same so far

 

[DrRiceBoy]

Up air and neutral air are the same too.

 

[Katakiri]

Well there's not much to say about her until we get more solid game-play (we got less than 10 second of game-play footage of her) but some things I noticed:

• The few attacks we saw were notably faster than Marth's.
• Her spot-dodge is fairly short and seems like it can be acted out of before the animation even finishes as she goes immediately into Astra/Dancing Blade which could mean she is very good at close-range punishes.
• And of course she lacks Marth's highlighted sword tip which likely means no tippers.

So from what I gather she's a Marth clone that trades the Critical Hit Tippers for raw speed and flexibility. Extra power vs extra speed. I'm not using the term clone in a bad way either because even of they have similar animations, the two likely play differently in a Ken / Ryu fashion and it's very nice to have the two options available since there's no accounting for taste after all.

 

[ImaClubYou]

Just fun speculation. Lets have fun and don't hurt my feelings

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIGE5Lh4NTI

 

[praline]

omg.... who is who...

Man I just can't tell the difference at all! Did you just post Marth twice?

 

[lanky_gunner]

The one thing I noticed was one of her idle animations. She grabs her chest and lets out a sigh, EXACTLY like Marth does. I've looked through the video to find differences, but it looks like all her attacks are the same as Marth's, with only a small difference at most.

Her inclusion really disappoints me. Not cause she is in over Chrom (who I wanted), but because she had the potential to be an entirely different character (which if she was, I would be ok if Chrom wasn't in), and they chose to copy and paste.

 

[Saikyoshi]

Hair, Clothing, Sword. If you look carefully enough everything is different.

We shouldn't have to look carefully if you ask me, though.

There was a reason picking Sonic, Lucario, or Pokémon Trainer could trigger a repick in Brawl Doubles.

 

[praline]

Hair, Clothing, Sword. If you look carefully enough everything is different.

You don't even have to look carefully. If you do a quick glance they look completely different.

 

[Tikivoy]

I wouldn't say its "last minute", but more along the lines of "low priority".

Like Ganondorf. When I say that, I don't mean "lets put them on axe list if we have time constraints", I mean they don't use up time to make a completely different moveset even though they deserve it. Most likely Robin was chosen for a unique moveset, and Lucina was also chosen due to her being the IS + fan favorite, female, and actually looking right with Marth's moveset. (Chrom wouldn't at all)

It's clear she changed something, since Marth got nerfed in speed, which she most likely will make up for.

 

[Cobalsh]

I like how Roy was different because FIRE, but still had the same moves. And now that a faster or more powerful version, who actually has potential to be different outside the trailer that included a character that none have you have played, and from Meh Observation, we've determined that Lucina is a clone.

Fascinating.

 

[Juken]

Well, it makes sense that she'd be a clone of she passed as Marth for a lot of the time in the game she was in.

I'd have preferred if she were just an alt costume though to prevent the same thing that happened with Roy from happening to Marth (it looks like he's going to be weaker than his clone character this time around).

 

[Turokman5896]

Id like to ask you guys to watch the trailer and pay attention to Marth closely, he does a dash attack that looks just like one of Lucinas moves, likely her dash attack. Lets just hope we are all wrong.

 

[Xafer2468]

Sakurai probably only planned robin, but then IS was like 'dude lucinas so cool add her plz' and sakurai just said '**** it, slap marth on her'. Its rather unfortunate.

 

[Curious Villager]

When did Sakurai say that he was against clones?

Anyway, as somebody else stated. She was probably a low priority newcomer, I guess this probably means that they have probably more or less wrapped up all the higher priority characters that they wanted to include and are maybe currently working on the lower priority characters now (eg like the "Forbidden Seven" and perhaps Toon Link, Jigglypuff and Wolf where in Brawl).

Just me speculating I suppose...

 

[Solbliminal]

..who actually has potential to be different...

This is the reason people are pissed off. Lucina has the potential to be a completely different character than Marth. That includes visually. It wouldn't kill Sakurai's dev team to make her have some unique animations at the very least. Instead we get a slop job lazy replacement of Roy.

 

[lightdasher]

PLEASSE

Four FE reps is more than enough

 

[Sendo Roba]

I still need to stand by her being a costume because seeing a clone at this point is unjustifiable. Call it denial, but that's because it is. I refuse to believe they'd make a clone after all these unique newcomers and all the effort in Brawl to decline everyone

 

[The Real Gamer]

Although many probably disagree I see Lucina as more of a low-priority, "bonus" character to give Awakening fans some extra love, while Robin was meant to be the main attraction.

We were bound to get a clone/semi-clone newcomer eventually and considering how much love the Awakening series has already gotten I think it's a bit short sighted to be complaining about her being one... At least she made the roster in the first place (RIP Chrom).

 

[Raetah]

I like how Roy was different because FIRE, but still had the same moves. And now that a faster or more powerful version, who actually has potential to be different outside the trailer that included a character that none have you have played, and from Meh Observation, we've determined that Lucina is a clone.

Fascinating.

The trailer reveals that Marth's fangirl is atleast a "Semi-clone" of Marth.
No one, or atleast, not me think that Roy is different than Marth in Melee. And thats my reason for being worry about Lucina in Smash 4. Previous Marth clone did not worked correctly and that makes me doubt about Lucina. I really want to be wrong about this, we can only wait to game release to know.

This is the reason people are pissed off. Lucina has the potential to be a completely different character than Marth. That includes visually. It wouldn't kill Sakurai's dev team to make her have some unique animations at the very least. Instead we get a slop job lazy replacement of Roy.

Marth's fangirl really likes Marth, for that reason she decided to imitate Marth.

 

[Cobalsh]

This is the reason people are pissed off. Lucina has the potential to be a completely different character than Marth. That includes visually. It wouldn't kill Sakurai's dev team to make her have some unique animations at the very least. Instead we get a slop job lazy replacement of Roy.

Roy was much lazier.

"Hey, guys, let's make Marth with FIRE!"

I think it's much lazier just to add an element than change how the character actually plays.

Edit: Herp a derp.