Ask a quick question, get a quick answer (The Marth FAQ's)

[Shaya]

If you do it 'perfectly' there are only 3 frames of which you aren't invincible and only 8 frames that the ledge can be grabbed.

 

[ScareMl]

so what shaya is saying is that's it's pretty boss. it's gonna come in handy gimpy falco's recovery, diddy's recovery, etc.

 

[Kel]

Yeah I think I can do it consistently. You just up B right when you're in grabbing range of the ledge, right? It's actually a lot easier than I thought.

Now....to figure out the double Up B/ Up B cancel thing on the ledge...

 

[Orion*]

Yeah I think I can do it consistently. You just up B right when you're in grabbing range of the ledge, right? It's actually a lot easier than I thought.

Now....to figure out the double Up B/ Up B cancel thing on the ledge...

if you dont have triple jump glitch or w/e dont do it and just double jump. so you dont have landing lag. it just gives your opponent more options to cover and marths airdodge onstage is pretty gay because theres always fear of upB

 

[Pierce7d]

Yes, keep in mind if you use this technique, you will have the carry over lag as if you did an UpB to the ledge, because you did.

Also, keep in mind, Marth is not the only character capable of doing this.

 

[Jeos]

Now....to figure out the double Up B/ Up B cancel thing on the ledge...

I can give you some tips about DSC if you want, I'm able to do it about 60~70% of the time.

 

[Kel]

I graciously accept any and all tips from everyone of all skill types.


Fellow Marthicans, lend me your powers so that I may do well at a regional this weekend. Seems that Kain, MJG, ROB, D3, and maybe Diddy/ ICS will be the obstacles here.

 

[Reizilla]

Pick Metaknight.

 

[Jeos]

ok, I'll post it here so anyone can see it, because it's really useful for getting back to the stage (wich is one of marth flaws), so I'm assuming you're hanging to the edge:

- press back (away from the stage) for about 3-5 frames (you'll get it with a little practice)
- DB1 the same direction (keep pressing away)
- let around the entire animation of DB1
- do an arc with the control stick (like doing QCDI), using numeric directions, you must go from 4 to 9
- you must ensure you've jumped, then DS back.

follow this procedure and adjust the time of the jumping while you're getting your timing and then do some practice to get your own times.

It's quite useful but I warn you to practice this very careful and do not spam it, 1 or 2 attempts at most or you'll get punished to death.

Also, I don't know if it will be ok to use at highest level of play, 'cause I doubt you'll get many chances to take a break when getting back to actually do this.

 

[Sylarius]

I graciously accept any and all tips from everyone of all skill types.


Fellow Marthicans, lend me your powers so that I may do well at a regional this weekend. Seems that Kain, MJG, ROB, D3, and maybe Diddy/ ICS will be the obstacles here.

Reminds me of Alphicans. (Marthicans)

Also I find that Up B regrabbing the ledge works against Marths who tend to use DB1 after their DJ instead of just DJing. Although most good Marths will just DJ :|

edit: I see Marths just wait after ground grab releasing an opponent, e.g. KillLock and Nike will do nothing after ground grab releasing and wait for the opponent to do something, is this generally a safe option?

 

[MasterOfGalaxies]

Is it worth it to play online with Marth? It becomes just so much harder to win when wifi kills your spacing, so is it better to just practice other stuff vs CPUs if you can't play with someone in person?

 

[Foodies]

I find that wifi is really good for MU experience. As long as you don't pick up habits like rolling/spotdodge/smash spamming (which works better than it usually would because of wifi >_>), I'd say it's worth it. Just don't use it to practice tech skill or anything.

 

[MasterOfGalaxies]

Alright, thanks. Tech skill etc. should be practiced offline, but play wifi for matchup experience. Got it.

 

[Sylarius]

edit: I see Marths just wait after ground grab releasing an opponent, e.g. KillLock and Nike will do nothing after ground grab releasing and wait for the opponent to do something, is this generally a safe option?

Think people just skipped it over lol. But there's my question.

 

[Foodies]

Because you edited it in And generally, no, since Marth doesn't really have a good close range game. So it's more of a mixup/when you think the opponent will do something defensive (Ex: spotdodge, roll, shield etc) which you can punish by waiting. I guess a lot of people would do something defensive after a ground release, but I still wouldn't call it a safe option. That's my opinion though.

 

[Jeos]

Playing online with marth (or any other character) is the best for getting a better player overall (as stated earlier, leave techskill to the offline). Is specially well for marth because it helps with spacing, readings, option select and ledge options, wich are his mayor flaws.

 

[Zano]

**** marth online, can't fast fall for **** properly

 

[ScareMl]

Alright, thanks. Tech skill etc. should be practiced offline, but play wifi for matchup experience. Got it.

trust me, the lag can make play very frustrating and it feels like you're not playing well, but it will help you get better in the long run.


and zano, what are you talking about? fast fall on wifi isn't that much different.

 

[Orion*]

**** marth online, can't fast fall for **** properly

to a very large extent, once youve put in a certain amount of time into wifi, if you arent comfortable doing most things it probably means you havent put in enough time irl and that they they arent second nature.

 

[Zano]

I'd be lying if I said I put a lot of time into practicing offline, so that makes sense. I plan to soon tho once I get time.

 

[Wizzrobe]

Playing online with marth (or any other character) is the best for getting a better player overall (as stated earlier, leave techskill to the offline). Is specially well for marth because it helps with spacing, readings, option select and ledge options, wich are his mayor flaws.

I never thought of online as a good way to improve. The input lag just ruins it, even once you get used to it. Offline is just so much easier and is what you will be using when at tournaments. (unless you play online tournaments)

 

[Orion*]

if you can play offline ALL the time then good for you, but most people are incapable of that, or travelling to tournaments every weekend

 

[MasterOfGalaxies]

I've recently learned it's more important to play against people than to play offline without lag.
Even if that sometimes means trying a secondary because you keep fail-spacing with Marth. =P

 

[KillLock]

wifi is a good tool for improvement. you just have to be patient with it.

 

[Cassio]

Is there a thread or something somewhere with accurate frame data? So far everything ive found is old. Im trying to help a friend of mine out.

 

[C.J.]

The Marth Frame data thread, the last page has a post from Shaya with accurate frame data. The frame dis/advantage on shield in that thread's OP is accurate except for fair (1 frame safer than listed).

Alternatively- opensa.dantarion.com/autoframe/FitMarth.php if you know how to read it all.

 

[Zano]

wifi is a good tool for improvement. you just have to be patient with it.

play me moar til I don't suck anymore

 

[Haze~]

Not a Q but feel free to respond/counter. Final destination: It just feels like the stage is way too good for Marth.
Dealing with Falcos and olimars camping aren't a problem here i feel. They have a hard time getting under us here aswell which they don't have on BF for ex. A big stage means less escape to the ledge from juggling and so on. If you have good a defense and agressive reads go here..

 

[clowsui]

The problem w FD is that it doesn't allow Marth to platform pressure which allows him more safe openings against a LOT of characters. While I agree it's a highly underrated Marth stage and shouldn't be banned in most MUs, I think it shouldn't be the first pick against a lot of characters since it strongly exaggerates Marth's weaknesses too

 

[MasterOfGalaxies]

Marth can be juggled about as easily as he can juggle, so the strengths given by ease of juggling on FD work against him too.

 

[Pierce7d]

This is false. Marth is not easily juggled, but he loses a lot of stage control when knocked into the air.

 

[Jeos]

and specially if you used your second jump

 

[MasterOfGalaxies]

Then I'm clearly doing something wrong. =P
How do you not get juggled without a second jump, really good aerial speed, or a good dair?

 

[ScareMl]

watch mike. wavebounced dancing blade and SB all day. then AD and attack mix-ups. you shouldn't get juggled that easily.

 

[clowsui]

what scare said

you should use wavebounce DB and wavebounce SB with consideration to the opponent's commitment though

 

[Shaya]

Combination of footstools and dair being 6 frames is also hard for most characters to get around.

 

[MasterOfGalaxies]

Ok, thanks. Maybe this will help. How do you wavebounce DB though?

 

[Jeos]

assuming you're drifting left, do a DB1 to the right and press very fast to the left again (it must be done within 5 frames)

 

[Orion*]

I've recently learned it's more important to play against people than to play offline without lag.
Even if that sometimes means trying a secondary because you keep fail-spacing with Marth. =P

play both? >_>

This is false. Marth is not easily juggled, but he loses a lot of stage control when knocked into the air.

this

 

[MasterOfGalaxies]

play both? >_>

You misunderstand. I have a horrible internet connection, to the point where I can hardly SH reliably. I was referring to the fact that even if I can't play Marth because I fail that bad without being able to even SH reliably, I can play another character where than doesn't matter as much, and still practice reading and zoning and other things that one can't practice alone.

And thanks to everyone for the tips.