Toby.
Smash Master
its alright.
<3
i want cheese and crackers
<3
i want cheese and crackers
-
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Choosing Your Starter: IKE take TWO
- Thread starter Bomber7
- Start date
http://allisbrawl.com/blogpost.aspx?id=14200
when KO'd
stamina becomes 30% of what it was (only the pokemon that got KO'd)
typh: 30% right, 100% of the time
when KO'd
stamina becomes 30% of what it was (only the pokemon that got KO'd)
typh: 30% right, 100% of the time
Toby.
Smash Master
i wish that had been posted on the pt boards 
i see its sourced from a japanese site...how unsurprising. They are always ahead it seems.
This would explain why I've often felt like i become fatigued slightly faster than I should with a freshly killed pokemon.
i see its sourced from a japanese site...how unsurprising. They are always ahead it seems.
This would explain why I've often felt like i become fatigued slightly faster than I should with a freshly killed pokemon.
T-block
B2B TST
wow that's a lot more complicated than i thought it was
so after a fully fatigued squirtle is KO'd you need 36 seconds for it to recharge. and there's more than one state of being fatigued o.o
so after a fully fatigued squirtle is KO'd you need 36 seconds for it to recharge. and there's more than one state of being fatigued o.o
Blitzmidfielder
Smash Journeyman
Versus Olimar:
Ivysaur is bad, mkay. Olimar outranges her completely and usually sets up his line to Fair with a red Pikmin.
Charizard has Rock Smash. For some reason, I think Charizard has better options, like Usmash and Bair, or Nair. But he still gets grab combo'd like a mo'fo.
Squirtle just seems better. Dair eats some pikmin and pokes his shield well. The difficulty is in getting past a wall of smashes because of HUEG disjointed hitboxes.
Ivysaur is bad, mkay. Olimar outranges her completely and usually sets up his line to Fair with a red Pikmin.
Charizard has Rock Smash. For some reason, I think Charizard has better options, like Usmash and Bair, or Nair. But he still gets grab combo'd like a mo'fo.
Squirtle just seems better. Dair eats some pikmin and pokes his shield well. The difficulty is in getting past a wall of smashes because of HUEG disjointed hitboxes.
I agree with Typh mostly. While Olimar vs Squirtle is not even close to the easiest matchup in this game ( its not like Dedede/DK ) its a pretty solid advantage to Squirt so he should be maximized.
Ivy isn't terrible here. She can repel grabs easily, leaf goes through non-purple Pikmin and she can gimp as easily as be gimped. Only problem is that an Usmash with a red pikmin. Fair can be a threat too as it sets up for a gimp.
Charizard does fairly well too. Rock smash/flamethrower space well and he can gimp. He can also stock tank decently. Olimar has lots of power but if Charizards smart he avoid the main threats for a while until Squirtle gets restored.
Ivy isn't terrible here. She can repel grabs easily, leaf goes through non-purple Pikmin and she can gimp as easily as be gimped. Only problem is that an Usmash with a red pikmin. Fair can be a threat too as it sets up for a gimp.
Charizard does fairly well too. Rock smash/flamethrower space well and he can gimp. He can also stock tank decently. Olimar has lots of power but if Charizards smart he avoid the main threats for a while until Squirtle gets restored.
of course i was exaggerating a bit but the matchup is really easy. people just get frustrated/scared/don't know how to play the matchup so they end up getting *****
lots of forward tilt, lots of fair (if you space a fullhop fair right against his "dead zone" which is diagonally above him, he can't do anything even if he's shielding), once you get him in the air, which is his worst spot, and your best, just **** the **** out of him, easy stuff
no hydroplane anything, except maybe for grab a little bit, it's easy for him to shut any ground game you have down with a flick of the cstick or a pivot grab
and remember he has no grab armor so you can just jab or ftilt him and even if he grabs you you'll just knock him out of it lol
if anybody has any questions about the matchup ask me, i live like 2 minutes away from richbrown and we've been playing constantly since the game came out so we both know eachother's characters inside and out, and i still **** him with squirtle xd. i don't think i've ever lost to an olimar except maybe him but i lose to him on purpose (this isn't johning, you can even ask him lol)
Blitzmidfielder
Smash Journeyman
What if you're not Squirtle, Typh?
Also, I swear Olimar has grab armor. The little ******* stuffs my smash attacks with it. And that Usmash should have such a huge hitbox it hits diagonally.
Also, I swear Olimar has grab armor. The little ******* stuffs my smash attacks with it. And that Usmash should have such a huge hitbox it hits diagonally.
IThinkAboutIvysaur
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- Jul 26, 2009
- Messages
- 102
Actually he is easier to gimp because he has such terrible mobility in the air.
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
OK, so, should Charizard be started so that you don't have to switch when you die?
Toby.
Smash Master
No. Start squirtle. Theres no point starting with zard because his role is to tank until squirtle is recovered. Obviously this isn't an issue on the first stock.
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
OK, so we start Squirtle. That seems pretty unanimous. Should we go on to the next character?
PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
typh making useful posts about the olimatchup.
rich browns pretty **** good and he has a sexy last name if i do say so.
i want to play him again, he barely beat me both games at winter game fest.
rich browns pretty **** good and he has a sexy last name if i do say so.
i want to play him again, he barely beat me both games at winter game fest.
RichBrown
Smash Master
Normally I come in here just to make fun of typh/the rest of you guys, but this is one of the rare times I will be serious and acknowledge that typh knows the Olimar matchup better than any PT main in the world (all 5 of you) and anything he says about the matchup is true.
And yeah we've kinda gotten to the point where we've played each other so many times that it's just dumb to play in tournament, I'm like 0-6billion against him haha
(yet still ranked higher in so cal <3)
And yeah we've kinda gotten to the point where we've played each other so many times that it's just dumb to play in tournament, I'm like 0-6billion against him haha
(yet still ranked higher in so cal <3)
Toby.
Smash Master
There doesn't appear to be any reason to start with zard. I dont really see why we should recommend it.
start charizard if you want to get combo'd to 80 percent at the beginning of the match and then outcamped (edit: and don't say flamethrower helps because he can just throw reds through) the rest of the stock because you can't switch to squirtle or you'll waste squirtle because he'll die right away
sounds not that great to me but hey whatever you want
sounds not that great to me but hey whatever you want
PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
im going to mm richy boo at active
PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
rich brown brings you to brown town.
as in buttsecks
as in he ***** you.
buttsecks = brown town.
as in buttsecks
as in he ***** you.
buttsecks = brown town.
Character Discussion: PEACH
For this discussion I think will be very simple and short.
Squirtle is recommended for the start of this match-up.
From my experience, you need a mobile character because any good peach is really mobile, likes to hover and throw projectiles and it gets really frustrating and would be even more frustrating if Ivysaur and/or Charizard would start because I don't think they would be able to land a good hit on her.
*Keep in mind I never said anything against Ivy or Charz KOing her.
For this discussion I think will be very simple and short.
Squirtle is recommended for the start of this match-up.
From my experience, you need a mobile character because any good peach is really mobile, likes to hover and throw projectiles and it gets really frustrating and would be even more frustrating if Ivysaur and/or Charizard would start because I don't think they would be able to land a good hit on her.
*Keep in mind I never said anything against Ivy or Charz KOing her.
T-block
B2B TST
yeah basically you wanna maximize your time with squirtle, and there's no reason not to start squirtle
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
I could be wrong, but wouldn't flamethrower be a good option against Peach? Her main approach is hovering toward you, and Zard is kinda tall, so wouldn't he be able to space/camp well with flamethrower? Also, most of his attacks outrange her except for her veggies, which can be caught and used against her. I don't see why Zard would be bad against her.
Retro Gaming
Black and White Thinking
The thing I always feel about Peach is that with Charizard, do not not bother trying to grab her. Actually, try not to shield her attacks in general. Avoid things "getting hit" (As in her hitting you or your shield) in general. If you shield a grounded attack you should be careful because she will almost always try to jab you to cover herself. If she's approaching you in the air do not shield or you will eat Dair and have your shield diminished ridiculously fast. The match-up kind of puts me off because I rely on grab with Charizard, so not really having that as an option is kind of bad. If you set your self up in the right state of mind though, Charizard's Bair is especially useful, and you will live forever since she only really has like three kill moves.
Start Squirtle.
Start Squirtle.
CoonTail
Smash Lord
-Zards fire does effectively cancel the turnip spam and a full hop flame thrower does hose her float approach with D-air. Zard can put up a good fight against her its jus her back and fourth floating abilities that allow zard to get juggled so hard. Zard is a good start if your really good at the matchup and can take a stock off with zard.....because if you can use the zard squirtle battery you could very well end the match. Squirtle is the poke of choice because he can hose peachs approach with his aerial aggressivness, he can match her back and fourth air patterns with his hit and run tactics. His glide toss creates an issue with the peach spamming turnips because if you get your hands on a strong one shes not that heavy and may have just set up a kill against her. Honestly in the peach matchup the biggest thing to take advantage of is the turnips because the strong ones can devestate peach since she isnt heavy. Zard getting hold of one means flamethrower,rocksmash, and a nasty turnip is what she has to deal with till we let it go. Ivy has razor leaf and bullet seed while holding a strong turnip and can glidetoss. Squirtle has his hydrotoss which is enough to make it so that if you get of a strong turnip and hydrotoss it she is either forced to shield and get grabbed or not shield and attempt to grab the turnip still ending bad for her.
I say starting squirtle is a good general choice, but if your good enough with zard you really can mess up her game if you manage to take advantage of the first stock. If you look into it more I really think zard can do alot here and according to the matchup i believe its 45:55 in zards' favor.
I say starting squirtle is a good general choice, but if your good enough with zard you really can mess up her game if you manage to take advantage of the first stock. If you look into it more I really think zard can do alot here and according to the matchup i believe its 45:55 in zards' favor.
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
Does Ivy get straight Metaknight/prison *****? Because, if so, it seems starting Zard would be a better option. Not grabbing hurts a bit, but not game-breakingly.
Fixed and stated for truth.
Yea, 'd have to say you are wrong, flamethrower is too slow to catch her and it's punishably laggy when going against her.
As good as it all sounds, Charizard would get *****. Charizard is super slow compared to peach. Smart peach players will space you with her turnips and there isn't mush we can do about that, charizard is a big target. When she gets close, according to what Retro said, you can forget about shielding because it won't work. Peach will run circles around you before you land a hit on her. Sure you can say that since Charizard has alot of one hit moves that he could start but overall, you have to be able to hit her for that to happen. She will **** him in the air (includes hovering) and you might get lucky and play a person who plays peach but doesn't go aerial like she is supposed to play and beat her up then but the smart peaches hover every second of the match and go aerial and ****.
I rest my case.
Toby.
Smash Master
Peach's down air clanks with charizards flamethrower. So if we try and bring that out they can either dair straight through the flame and hit us, or do a retreating dair so that they can reset their spacing/pluck a turnip.
Charizard doesn't like peach.
Charizard doesn't like peach.
CoonTail
Smash Lord
Only reason I said FULL HOP flamethrower is because that way it wont clink youll knock her out of the air.....but you guys are right I just thought based off the most recent matches I had that charizard wasnt at any advantage or anything but really just could compete. From what I heard from the peach i played the matchup is 45 55 in zards favor so I may have just gotten poor information. But either way flamethrower and rocksmash is all he really has outside of somehow managinng to pull things off in close to her. Guess i need to tell this peach to step up his game lol.
MaTA
Smash Ace
squirtle does great against peach...just watch out for her down smash. charizard does okay and he could up B out of her combo.
Bestiarius
Smash Ace
OK, so I was probably wrong to suggest Zard, but CoonTail, seriously, to say that Zard just has Flamethrower and Rock Smash just sounds wrong to me. I mean, come on, 2 of the best moves in the game? Hardly much to complain about. Still, he may hav3e a disadvantage, but it's not that huge. Powershield turnips and short hop a Rock Smash if she gets too close. I don't think Zard's all that bad off. Still, Squirtle's better, but that's not the point. Should we start Squirtle? If we lose the first life with Squirtle, we're in a bad spot. Not so much with Zard, plus, if we win the first life with Zard, we're sitting pretty. I think cost-benefit favors Zard, but that's just my 2 cents, which are the least valuable 2 cents on the forum, pretty much. Just my strange opinion to be something to consider.
PokemonMasterIRL
Smash Master
Dont get Turnip gimped as Ivy, so annoying.
Blitzmidfielder
Smash Journeyman
If someone's really smart and patient, I think Ivy could compete in this matchup, if only for Glide Tossing turnips.
Ivy also has a decent anti air game. Dtilt her out of her float cancel, its got bigger range than any of her aerials. Bulletseed also frustrates a Peach trying to continually dair ivy. Use your range, spam leaves and try mindgame an uair at 80-100 to get that early kill. Or be bold and jump out to uair/fair her as she's recovering with her 2nd jump. Turnips move slowly when thrown so they won't be caught so easily. Still, ivys glide toss > peaches.
Back on topic, start squirtle. Better in the air than peach. Utilt is faster than peach's dair, jab will beat out anything she has on the ground. Watergun for spacing, and to push her recovery back. Charizard is good, Squirtles better.
Back on topic, start squirtle. Better in the air than peach. Utilt is faster than peach's dair, jab will beat out anything she has on the ground. Watergun for spacing, and to push her recovery back. Charizard is good, Squirtles better.
CoonTail
Smash Lord
Your completely right beast I jus didnt feel like defending. Honestly I feel all 3 of PT's pokes put up a good fight but this is a talk about choosing your starter. I feel that zard is a good start because a good zard deffinitly has options against peach. He can cancel turnips very well....can use flamethrower to pull her out of the air if used correctly...on top of that rocksmash crushs peach as long as she isnt floating. B-air can also outspace peachs float approach as long as its not f-air I believe. Im glad im not the only one thinking this way....but the zard-squirtle is my favorite battery due to the pace change so I start zard here because even if I do poorly zard is out of the way early leaving squirtle and Ivy to clean up mid to late game. Thats how I start this matchup...more later in class getting yelled at
Toby.
Smash Master
I never said that peach totally ***** charizard, or even that peach has a slight advantage. I don't have an opinion on the matchup because I lack experience against good peach players. I was simply telling people that dair beats flamethrower, and that it makes traditional spacing with Charizard difficult.