PPMD's Falco Discussion Thread

[X1-12]

Ok I'm probably getting annoying now with all the questions but anyone can answer this really, no need to bother PP or whatever.. BUT

what do you guys think of (facing inwards) Up-tilt to bair/dair edgeguard.. the up-tilt hitbox is actually really big (extends from the floor to above falco's head) and it takes half as long as D-smash.. It seems best mainly vs spacies but i don't think I've ever seen it done in a match..

PS I know the hitbox video is for fox hut they're basically the same

 

[JPOBS]

when spacies try to side-B onto the stage/into you, its pretty good, people do it all the time and follow it up with a bair to send them back off stages.

its not an optimum edgeguard though, there are better things you can do like run off->dair but its not that bad and fun to do.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Ok I'm probably getting annoying now with all the questions but anyone can answer this really, no need to bother PP or whatever.. BUT

what do you guys think of (facing inwards) Up-tilt to bair/dair edgeguard.. the up-tilt hitbox is actually really big (extends from the floor to above falco's head) and it takes half as long as D-smash.. It seems best mainly vs spacies but i don't think I've ever seen it done in a match..

PS I know the hitbox video is for fox hut they're basically the same

I like staying turned around and uptilting because I think there's a better chance I'll hit them before they get through me if they get hit with the part of the uptilt that sticks back farther. Also, it lets me Bair easier if they end up not side-B'ing into me.

 

[X1-12]

when spacies try to side-B onto the stage/into you, its pretty good, people do it all the time and follow it up with a bair to send them back off stages.

its not an optimum edgeguard though, there are better things you can do like run off->dair but its not that bad and fun to do.

what about vs spacies upB? if they go high you usually have enough time to do another one and hit them or

 

[JPOBS]

i've never tried it vs upb or seen it done. i cant see it being effective unless they upb right into you.

i guess you could just cover that option, and if they go high, you have time to chase with something

 

[Dr Peepee]

I recorded some matches with Twitch yesterday. They're not all up yet but I have some Falco matches up if you guys want to look.

http://www.youtube.com/user/DrPeepee1

 

[FoxLisk]

Chillin taught me to utilt whichever way i'm facing as soon as I hear the bing if someone's illusioning on stage. you can bair them back off like 99% of the time. i dont think it works well against up b... maybe if you time it perfectly, but i think it's worth your while to just turn around and utilt with your back to them for that.

edit: i have a question about sheik, because i cant figure out this **** matchup

what do i do when she's spacing tilts on my shield? my friend today was playing and he would just stand right out of grab/shield range and ftilt my shield. i know i can roll out but that seems so easy to punish. sh nair can work but it seems really risky too if she just CCs or i time it a little wrong. any good ideas on this one?

 

[JPOBS]

sh dair?
WD back oos if you dont have the gonads

 

[FoxLisk]

i did a lot of SH dairing and got grabbed a lot for it. the thing is sh dair is too easy to react to. if i SH early dair, the hitbox isn't at his face for a while and he has time to get out of the way, and if I SH late dair, he can just tilt me out of my SH. it worked like maybe 1/4 times but I was hoping for something safer. WD back oos seems reasonable if I learn how to time it. The thing is I'm not sure how much is sheik really shutting down my options and how much is me being bad at the matchup :-\

edit: is fadeaway SH dair safe?

 

[#HBC | Mac]

wd oos *****, esp when yu fsmash after it (if yu think the opp doesnt have quick enough reflexes.)

full jumping is beast. wavelanding to another platform.

rolling away is quick enough and not easily reacted to, unless the sheik actually waits for a moment after every tilt.

SH dairing shud work, i don't really get what yu mean about it not being in his face for a while. I don't think it's very easily reacted to. have yu played someone who was able to react to your sh dair attempt? cuz if not that theres no point in theorizing that it wudnt work when it does a decent amount of time imo.

actually yu cud probs get away with doing like anything except rolling towards which will almost always get yu wrecked. and sheildgrabbing when its spaced.

 

[KirbyKaze]

Shine OOS is okay against Sheiks that try to come in with grabs after aerials and spacing and ****.

 

[AnDaLe]

So i need help with Falco dittos again. Well, I did get the person to Shine OOS, but he kept on actually hitting me with it T.T then death comboing me.
Also, When i tried to Shine OOS, it never worked. Like i'd get punished cuz i missed. Any help on the approach and the Do's and Don'ts?

 

[unknown522]

edit: i have a question about sheik, because i cant figure out this **** matchup

what do i do when she's spacing tilts on my shield? my friend today was playing and he would just stand right out of grab/shield range and ftilt my shield. i know i can roll out but that seems so easy to punish. sh nair can work but it seems really risky too if she just CCs or i time it a little wrong. any good ideas on this one?

if you really wanted to, you can u-smash OoS when she's above CC percent.

But yeah, WD back is most recommended like JPobs said. You can laser some more and regain control.

 

[Melomaniacal]

I'm just having issues with the laser duels.

 

[unknown522]

shoot a laser, then PS the other one.

 

[#HBC | Mac]

I'm just having issues with the laser duels.

yo me too

shoot a laser, then PS the other one.

****s mad hard =/

i always end up giving up on lasers in dittos cuz i always seem to lose that battle.

i hate fighting falco, brokenass character gawd****

 

[JPOBS]

i hate it when both you and your opponent are on the same sh laser timing and keep hitting each other lol

Laser->sheild is how you win laser wars.

pray you powersheild one of his lasers.
to mix it up, do double jump double lasers so that you get on a different timing than your opponent and maybe you can sneak a laser past him and gain momentum.

 

[unknown522]

****s mad hard =/

i always end up giving up on lasers in dittos cuz i always seem to lose that battle.

i hate fighting falco, brokenass character gawd****

I know that it was unrealistic to say that, but I don't have a real answer to laser wars. It's all about hitting the first laser.

 

[TemPesT-]

SHL 2 SHINE ***** LASER BATTLES

it actually does work pretty well if you SUCK at power shielding.

 

[X1-12]

What about CC'ing his lasers? surely each time you would be able to fire again faster until you can hit him before he fires

 

[Mogwai]

i just shoot them more and it usually works. i really don't know how to explain laser dittos, but for whatever reason I seem to be pretty good at them. PP told me at Pound that I shoot them at the right height, but I honestly don't think much about them anymore so I'm unfit to give advice on getting better at them,

 

[Silent Wolf]

SHL 2 SHINE ***** LASER BATTLES

it actually does work pretty well if you SUCK at power shielding.

this.

works well with fox vs falco too.

 

[Deathgazer]

So i need help with Falco dittos again. Well, I did get the person to Shine OOS, but he kept on actually hitting me with it T.T then death comboing me.
Also, When i tried to Shine OOS, it never worked. Like i'd get punished cuz i missed. Any help on the approach and the Do's and Don'ts?

think of shining oos like a double shine except you dont press the first shine. get the motion/timing right when you slide from Y => B (or which ever way you double shine)
If you could do perfect double shines, then technically you could do perfect shine oos, but you just need to get used to the timing.

If you want to practice, just shield and try to do the double shine motion.

the way i do shine oos is
when im in shield:
press Y as I let go of L (shield)
after you press Y you slide to B at the same time as pressing down on the control stick to shine/

hope that helped

 

[TemPesT-]

i do what this guy said, but with x if i'm falco, and y if i'm fox. lol that way theres less of a difference in my finger speed to do it, it's just that one button is a little bit farther away, so it works out in the end.

 

[Ocho(*8*)]

i use y for both characters cuz I hit the a button too much when I try going from x to b.

thats about the only time i use the y button too

 

[#HBC | Mac]

i use y for both characters cuz I hit the a button too much when I try going from x to b.

thats about the only time i use the y button too

i hit the a button almost every single time. However it hasn't been affecting me cuz usually falco is in some sort of lag so it doesn't register. bad habit tho

 

[Ocho(*8*)]

ya he usually is in some sort of lag so it doesn't matter much.

and even when i hit the a button when he isn't in lag it just ends up doing a quick aerial oos which often gets the job done for me, even if its not what I intended.

 

[TemPesT-]

now that i think about it, i'm not sure why i don't accidentally nair OOS, but i know i just slide super fast from x to b...

 

[JPOBS]

i use joystick to shine oos but the method u use isnt the problem

the problem is timing it so you're out of shield stun, otherwise you'll spotdodge or something stupid

 

[X1-12]

now that i think about it, i'm not sure why i don't accidentally nair OOS, but i know i just slide super fast from x to b...

pressing any button during your start-up jump animation is ignored unless its an up-smash or grab or something that can be JC'ed is ignored

 

[Mogwai]

up smash and up B and grab are the only things that can be jump canceled

 

[TemPesT-]

oh ya... i knew that lol. i just did it tho, i never thought about it

EDIT:

new **** thing to do on platforms. you ever really wanna get that fsmash a little bit sooner? but theres no more platforms to waveland up to and hit it?

so like your opponents a fast faller, around 30-40 you shine them, they go up, instead of just aerialing after them, waveland backwards off the platform, and then dbl jump into a dbl laser immediately and fsmash. looks hot works good. you can even do this on like FD from the edge, if you ledge hop dair, shine, waveland off stage, and jump into a dbl laser, then fsmash.

 

[unknown522]

you can also u-tilt -> f-smash.

Also, the double laser won't work. The f-smash is too slow. You can get shined out of it, or they can airdodge.

 

[TemPesT-]

i've seen ppl fall for it way too many times for you to simply say it won't work. maybe it's not a true combo, but seriously ppl get hit with it all the time.

 

[Fernandez]

What should i do against a peach floating above my shorthop lasers, but beneath double jump/full jump lasers?
I think full jump dair/bair/nair is too risky because you can get naired.
I just try to be patient and wait till they land but its kinda anoying that i can't hit her with anything.

 

[JPOBS]

i do one of 3 things:
1. try to predict/react when they are gonna fall down with a fair ad beat it with uptilt
2. use platforms to hit them with laser
3. run away until they stop doing that

i usually do number 3 the most but i do number 1 when i feel like a pimp

 

[stabbedbyanipple]

How do you edgeguard a samus that can sweet spot really well?

 

[#HBC | Mac]

take the ledge?

good q

 

[Mogwai]

shoot the *****, take the ledge, bair/dair depending on situation.

 

[FoxLisk]

ive been playing my friend's samus a lot lately and ive learned some things. i wanna find out if they work on better samuses, though, or if he's just missing ways out.

if samus is holding the ledge and i stand like... .75 full-distance shorthops away and SHL, is there some easy way for her to recover? ive had a lot of success just using laser -> ftilt if she jumps or stands up, if she does the jumping from ledge recover (like not ledgedrop, just hit jump), it's easy to jump up and nair. if she rolls back i have time to sh backwards a little and dair or grab or ftilt. i'm just outside of ledgehop fair range, and if i mess up it's easy to CC anyway. am i wrong, or is this just really hard for samus to get around?