Shoot First, Ask Questions Later: The Samus Tactical Discussion & Q&A Thread

[DelxDoom]

SOme people don't know the properties of her down b. It's part of playing a low tier, ignoring your opponent's ignorance isn't going to help you win imo

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Hey! If any of you are on. My friends picking up Samus and we were wondering if dropping through a platform and getting a missile out is just REALLY time sensitive or if there's some trick like hitting B twice to quicken Sonics Homing attack. We can get it on occasion but more often than not we just bomb or do the first part of the animation.

 

[Cherry64]

Hey! If any of you are on. My friends picking up Samus and we were wondering if dropping through a platform and getting a missile out is just REALLY time sensitive or if there's some trick like hitting B twice to quicken Sonics Homing attack. We can get it on occasion but more often than not we just bomb or do the first part of the animation.

Timing sensitive. Suuper timing. I used to be able to do it consistantly, but now I just mess up. SOOO much easier to do a homing missile, and much more rewarding IMO. just drop through and don't smash missile, and it'll help him that much more.

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

****! It's really hard. lol Any idea on the frame window? He could do Super Wavedashes in Melee like 80/90 percent of the time so I think he'd be willing to try. And does Homing missile take less time to come out than smash missile?

 

[KillerJawz]

Bombs are horrible. They have no legit/guaranteed use. Any time u want to drop a bomb, there is ALWAYS a better option. The only time a foe would get hit by them is because they were not thinking.

They are horrible, but this is actually legit. Seeing as the bombs are timed, it allows you to have two hitboxes out at once in two seperate places, this makes chasing from the ledge really satisfying.

 

[Cherry64]

****! It's really hard. lol Any idea on the frame window? He could do Super Wavedashes in Melee like 80/90 percent of the time so I think he'd be willing to try. And does Homing missile take less time to come out than smash missile?

Way less time to come out. I don't think I ever knew the frame window, I just knew I could do the super missile from the platform lol. It's really hard yeah, but it's not as hard as consistently triple lasering as fox from a short hop. THAT is hard.

Can he missile cancel perfectly already?

 

[Terios the Hedgehog]

Can you missile cancel in this game? He said he read they took it out or something.

 

[Cherry64]

LOL. The only way to super missile while dropping through a platform is to missile cancel it. and the timing is super lame.

 

[Dragonmaster_Omega]

LOL. The only way to super missile while dropping through a platform is to missile cancel it. and the timing is super lame.

You sure you can do a super missle while DROPPING from a platform? As in, pressing down to drop through it? Becaus ei am skeptical at that. I can barely get a homing missle in that timing, let alone a super missle. But walking off a platform is a bit more believable

 

[Xyro77]

You sure you can do a super missle while DROPPING from a platform? As in, pressing down to drop through it? Becaus ei am skeptical at that. I can barely get a homing missle in that timing, let alone a super missle. But walking off a platform is a bit more believable

Yea u can do it but its super hard. its better to run off and missle

 

[KillerJawz]

It can be done off of higher platforms like Yoshi's, I've never tried it on BF however.

 

[Dragonmaster_Omega]

It can be done off of higher platforms like Yoshi's, I've never tried it on BF however.

Well yeah but i was referring to lower platforms such as that of BF. I think it could be done on the platform on Orpheon, but that one requires some good timing

 

[KillerJawz]

Just tested it, it can be done on BF as Xyro said. It also works on Frigate.

 

[DelxDoom]

I rarely use power missile, you need some time/space to do it.
other people do use it more than I


and yes homing missile is faster

 

[Cherry64]

Told Ya :D

Learn how to Missile cancel first and then you should have the timing down. It's strict though

Terios, a MUCH better option is running off and SMissile'ing. You can run off the back of the platform to give you more space, which is never a bad idea unless you want to follow up with a physical attack, and even then, on BF the stage is so short that if your going to run off the platform ALWAYS do so to back

(Assuming the opponent is on stage)

 

[DelxDoom]

Running technically is not a good option

 

[Judo777]

So guys i cannot for the life of me figure out Samus' charge beam. Its such a weird move.

If you guys dont know samus' charge beam is one of the few moves that can actually stuff DK invincible up b and sonics invincible side B. Typically in order for that to be possible there must be multiple hitboxes. The first hitbox clanks with the move and ends it. The next punishes them after the clank. I was testing with this and using a marth fsmash as a control for my experiment but got some interesting results and im wondering if using marths fsmash was a good idea.

Here is what i found. Marths fsmash will clank with samus' charge beam and both hitboxes will end. Both Charge Beam and Marth fsmash will clank AND punish DK invinci up b which doesnt make sense from marths perspective but idc about that. The thing that screws everything up is this. Marth's Fsmash only clanks with sonic's invincible side b reseting to even frames with no damage to either person, but charge beam both clanks it AND makes sonic take the damage from the shot by punishing him (perhaps with a second hitbox?).

Idk what this means but i cant think of another move that i can test this out with cause Im thinking marth fsmash was a bad choice to idk why. What does it all mean?

Actually i figured it out on my way to class. Its a matter of damage. DK's upb does like 3% so both moves beat it out. Sonic's Side B does like 8 or something and marths clanks while samus' beats it out straight up. However marths fsmash can do at least 16% soo it can clank with charge beam.

 

[IsmaR]

The fact that CS is a projectile kinda skews the data, if you're comparing it to the likes of Marth's F-smash. Interesting to note, nonetheless. Maybe you should try further testing it out with something like Lucario's AS @ mid-full power.

 

[Cherry64]

It'd have to be full Izzy. Samus' CS clanks with his AS only when it's at full. It will never beat our Fully charged CS though. Interesting to note.

 

[Judo777]

Thats because a in order to beat full charged charge beam out you would have to have a hitbox that dealt 37% lol. ANd i mean 1 hitbox not like bowser fsmash that hits twice.

And the only difference between b moves and grounded moves is that they can clank with aerials. Which for this example there isnt an aerial in the game thats gonna beat it out lol. Idk if there is even one that can clank it. Anyone know of an aerial that deals 16%?

 

[Cherry64]

Uhh, Cannot say, but I'd venture Ike probably has something. Snake maybe?

 

[KillerJawz]

Ganon's Bair I THINK does 16, I'm more then likely wrong however. I think that Ganon does have one of those however.

 

[IsmaR]

Meant AS' power depending on his damage, Cherry. Should've specified that a bit better.

 

[Cherry64]

Meant AS' power depending on his damage, Cherry. Should've specified that a bit better.

Lucario is all about his aura levels. even at his highest aura level though, his AS clanks with our CS. it never beats it and our smash missile can clank with his AS until aura level 3 or something :S

 

[Judo777]

Uhh, Cannot say, but I'd venture Ike probably has something. Snake maybe?

Ikes aerials are transcendent so he cant clank with anything lol. Snakes fair i think might be the only thing but idk.

And yea ganons fsmash can clank a Charge beam.

 

[Cherry64]

Good ol' Ganon.

Doesn't ganon's Dair do obscene amounts of damage? Like 20ish?

 

[Judo777]

Good ol' Ganon.

Doesn't ganon's Dair do obscene amounts of damage? Like 20ish?

yea 23% that should work.

 

[Browny]

So yesterday I accidentally DI'd downwards out of Samus' upb (with Mario) such that it sent me downwards and I was able to punish it...

Is it possible to do this regularly? I have no idea how I did it lol.

 

[SuSa]

Know the directions that the screw attack hits you in, SDI down and in those directions. (I forget if it's clockwise or not for the pull. I think it is...) and just DI+SDI depending on the timing of the screw attack.

Just don't depend on it too often because reacting that fast is really hard/borderline impossible unless you expect it to happen.

:leek:

 

[Cherry64]

Know the directions that the screw attack hits you in, SDI down and in those directions. (I forget if it's clockwise or not for the pull. I think it is...) and just DI+SDI depending on the timing of the screw attack.

Just don't depend on it too often because reacting that fast is really hard/borderline impossible unless you expect it to happen.

:leek:

There are like three moves that lead into UpB. If everyone who fights a samus regularily notices these three moves, she'll move down on the tier list again.

her UpB is SDI able yes. A lot of samus ditto's made sure of that.

 

[KillerJawz]

There are like ten moves that lead into UpB.

Sorry that was just really bothering me.

Jab
Uair
Dair
Fair
Nair
Homing Missiles
D throw
Usmash [lol]
Bombs
Utilt

 

[Cherry64]

Sorry that was just really bothering me.

Jab Riskaaay IMO
Uair
Dair
Fair
Nair Weak hit, they can usually punish, unless it's at higher percents, but that requires chasing to hit them with UpB
Homing Missiles You can pull anything out with these babies <3
D throw
Usmash [lol] If the final hit doesn't hit them and they don't have a hitbox out yeah
Bombs
Utilt

10 char, 10char

 

[KillerJawz]

Jab works if they get hit by the hit closest to Samus, I should have specified that.

Nair works with both hits, but Usmash was just too hilarious when I combo'd it into a upb.

 

[Cherry64]

never once used nair to link a UpB.

Aha yesss I love love love using Usmash for that. tooo funny.

 

[KillerJawz]

You can use nair to force shielding opponents off a platform onto the ground then upb them for them. You can also falling nair an opponent and upb from it. It's really only at lower percentages though.

I remember landing a usmash all hits on a fox player, he saw his % rise and literally rolled on the floor laughing.

 

[Dragonmaster_Omega]

If they were hit by all hits of usmash then that deserves a laugh =3
I love screw attack so much. It has so many weird hidden properties

 

[KillerJawz]

Ahh screw attack. I honestly think it's sooo underated. Have you seen the semi spike hitbox on it? That is just so amazing ;___;.

 

[Dragonmaster_Omega]

Ahh screw attack. I honestly think it's sooo underated. Have you seen the semi spike hitbox on it? That is just so amazing ;___;.

Funny, i had managed to do that to a Toon Link just yesterday on Orpheon. It was soooo satisfying too considering how close it is was. Fighting TL is a nightmare for me.

I also love how many things you can use Screw attack to escape from. The risk-reward factor varies depending on the situation.
I have used it to escape MK nado and Snake nair (unable to recreate snake nair escape, but i KNOW it is possible)

 

[Darkshadow7827]

I still have no idea how to SDI screw attack. I just hold left or right hoping I won't get caught up in it.

 

[Cherry64]

I still have no idea how to SDI screw attack. I just hold left or right hoping I won't get caught up in it.

Out the bottom is your best bet, near the beginning you can also DI away while samus is rising and punish accordingly. If you are in the main attack SDI down, or apparenlty clockwise, but its' easiest to get out down? Maybe up, but I have NEVER seen anyone get out of the sides of it before.