Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[N3ON]

Is it really that unlikely to some of you lot that Bayonetta was one of the more popular characters on the ballot? She had a highly praised Wii U exclusive near the time the ballot opened and people like her as a character. Even if there were a few other characters above her in places other than Europe her uniqueness, popularity, and the way she fits into Smash blows any other potential character out of the water.

I'm not contesting the beginning part, but if you need to be censored in both appearance and language and have your design altered to achieve aesthetic parity with the roster (her proportions were normalized), the way she fits in Smash is not seamless. She is probably the character that needed to be changed most to mesh with the cast.

Throughout the voting process, her popularity came and went. For me, I believe she could have won, but I'd like to see the data. I find it unlikely that she would have won without the voting stopping after one vote.

If voting stopped after one vote per IP address or something, then imo her winning makes sense. Her popularity peaked around April/May, and started fading after that. Its very possible that she got the most votes during that period, but I just don't see it happening any other way.

Fwiw pretty much every character received the chunk of their votes during April/May, as that's almost assuredly when the ballot saw the majority of activity.

I can imagine Bayo beating K. Rool and Wolf, as popular as the latter two may be. Banjo and the Ice Climbers obviously weren't going to be added due to Microsoft ownership and technical limitations, respectively. That leaves us with Inkling, who might not have been feasible either.

I don't see why Inkling wouldn't be feasible, but I do see Inkling being saved for a role more important than tail-end DLC.

 

[FunAtParties]

I'm not contesting the beginning part, but if you need to be censored in both appearance and language and have your design altered to achieve aesthetic parity with the roster (her proportions were normalized), the way she fits in Smash is not seamless. She is probably the character that needed to be changed most to mesh with the cast.


Fwiw pretty much every character received the chunk of their votes during April/May, as that's almost assuredly when the ballot saw the majority of activity.


I don't see why Inkling wouldn't be feasible, but I do see Inkling being saved for a role more important than tail-end DLC.

This is true, she may have just peaked at the right time.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Actually, I think Bayo beat Wolf.

The direct said she even beat characters from past games and I can only think of three characters who would have gotten votes.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Actually, I think Bayo beat Wolf.

The direct said she even beat characters from past games and I can only think of three characters who would have gotten votes.

Ehhhhhh

Beating Ivysaur, squirtle, Pichu, or Young Link might not be particularly impressive but it would also fulfill that statement.

 

[Deleted member]

Actually, I think Bayo beat Wolf.

The direct said she even beat characters from past games and I can only think of three characters who would have gotten votes.

Actually, the quote was that she was among the Top 5 in the U.S., which included characters from previous Smash games.

We don't know who placed where exactly, but we do know that Bayonetta wasn't 1st, 2nd, or 3rd in the U.S., as those would be too major to not mention.

 

[Bowserlick]

Andross is probably being saved for the next game, even if he was extremely high in the ballot.

 

[Kirbeh]

Andross is probably being saved for the next game, even if he was extremely high in the ballot.

?

That sort of came out of nowhere. Please explain.

 

[Deleted member]

.....I think he was trying to be funny and replace "Wolf" with "Andross".

 

[Sir Gengar de Èctoplasma]

I thought Ryu was a photoshopped Little Mac?

Nah, he is a photoshopped Ike:

Spoiler

 

[Bowserlick]

?

That sort of came out of nowhere. Please explain.

Ah, I posted in the wrong dimension. On Earth 2, Andross is extremely popular and was most likely, number 1 or 2 on the ballot.

But if we generate enough support for Andross on this Earth, then he too can be a popular sci/fi villain and included in the next edition of Smash.

 

[Curious Villager]

Ah, I posted in the wrong dimension. On Earth 2, Andross is extremely popular and was most likely, number 1 or 2 on the ballot.

But if we generate enough support for Andross on this Earth, then he too can be a popular sci/fi villain and included in the next edition of Smash.

I personally wouldn't mind Andross, didn't he get a body in Starfox Zero?

 

[Deleted member]

Bringing something no one as brought yet with how has been chosen as the Ballot winner.

Let's say, if another newcomer like K. Rool won the Ballot, we would have gotten him, yes.
And... Maybe a few new tracks to the DK stages?

While with we got:
- A new stage
- An alternate costume
- A BUNCH of music tracks
- A new series to be introduced with all the other ones
- Several new trophies
- The choice between ENG voiced and JP voiced (only in Japan)
- And additional promotion to one of the Wii U's most noteworthy games.

Just to say, unless you act in a very bad faith, you can't consider this move as a bad one.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Bringing something no one as brought yet with how has been chosen as the Ballot winner.

Let's say, if another newcomer like K. Rool won the Ballot, we would have gotten him, yes.
And... Maybe a few new tracks to the DK stages?

While with we got:
- A new stage
- An alternate costume
- A BUNCH of music tracks
- A new series to be introduced with all the other ones
- Several new trophies
- The choice between ENG voiced and JP voiced (only in Japan)
- And additional promotion to one of the Wii U's most noteworthy games.

Just to say, unless you act in a very bad faith, you can't consider this move as a bad one.

I wouldn't say Bayonetta was chosen because of that, but rather it all being added as extra frosting on the cake, alongside how incredibly detailed she was (magic circles, butterflies, etc.)

 

[Zerp]

Bringing something no one as brought yet with how has been chosen as the Ballot winner.

Let's say, if another newcomer like K. Rool won the Ballot, we would have gotten him, yes.
And... Maybe a few new tracks to the DK stages?

Nah, if he was the ballot winner I'd expect his alter-egos as costumes , a stage (Gangplank Galleon?) and a plethora of DK music and trophies because he won the ballot, I doubt it's a coincidence that Bayonetta got so much content and was the ballot winner, they're probably related. Maybe K. Rool would be broken too.

Just to say, unless you act in a very bad faith, you can't consider this move as a bad one.

I can't (and don't) consider it a bad move, but I can't consider it a great move either, because I can't see what their options were, maybe she was the best choice, maybe she was the worst choice, it's kind of impossible to tell. Obviously Bayonetta was a a popular character and she was probably a good pick, however, we simply don't know who's "realizable" and how subjective the terms of disqualification may or may not have been because of that.

 

[AwesomeAussie27]

Nah, he is a photoshopped Ike:

Spoiler

Can't wait for the Photoshopped Little Mac jokes to return if Spring Man is leaked.

 

[FunAtParties]

Nah, if he was the ballot winner I'd expect his alter-egos as costumes , a stage (Gangplank Galleon?) and a plethora of DK music and trophies because he won the ballot, I doubt it's a coincidence that Bayonetta got so much content and was the ballot winner, they're probably related. Maybe K. Rool would be broken too.


I can't (and don't) consider it a bad move, but I can't consider it a great move either, because I can't see what their options were, maybe she was the best choice, maybe she was the worst choice, it's kind of impossible to tell. Obviously Bayonetta was a a popular character and she was probably a good pick, however, we simply don't know who's "realizable" and how subjective the terms of disqualification may or may not have been because of that.

This. I don't consider adding Bayonetta a bad move, but I don't see how going with other characters would be any worse.

Bayonetta adds stuff to the series, but so would K.Rool and many of the other choices mentioned. Acting like they don't is selling them incredibly short.

 

[Luminario]

This. I don't consider adding Bayonetta a bad move, but I don't see how going with other characters would be any worse.

Bayonetta adds stuff to the series, but so would K.Rool and many of the other choices mentioned. Acting like they don't is selling them incredibly short.

I dunno, I feel like a non 3rd party character would have had less of an impact, if you get what I mean. Choosing a 1st party character from an already established series that's also a likely candidate to be added somewhere along the line anyway wouldn't really have the same effect as someone like Cloud, Ryu or Bayonetta.

 

[Deleted member]

Nah, if he was the ballot winner I'd expect his alter-egos as costumes , a stage (Gangplank Galleon?) and a plethora of DK music and trophies because he won the ballot, I doubt it's a coincidence that Bayonetta got so much content and was the ballot winner, they're probably related. Maybe K. Rool would be broken too.

I believe it is coincidence.
Unlike K. Rool, Bayonetta came from a series that wasn't represented in Smash until she was included.
And unlike Cloud or Ryu, content from her series is easier to obtain from a legal standpoint due to Bayonetta 2's rights belonging to Nintendo.

Regardless of if she was added as a result of the ballot or not, that same content would be still be present.

 

[Opossum]

For what it's worth, I definitely think Snake was among the characters who beat out Bayonetta on the Ballot for the US. Popular, a veteran, and legally unfeasible. The (im)perfect storm.

 

[FunAtParties]

For what it's worth, I definitely think Snake was among the characters who beat out Bayonetta on the Ballot for the US. Popular, a veteran, and legally unfeasible. The (im)perfect storm.

I honestly believe he was the most popular choice out of every non meme tbh.

 

[Chandeelure]

I am starting to think that Midnight Lycanroc is likely.

It is everywhere.

 

[Schnee117]

I am starting to think that Midnight Lycanroc is likely.

It is everywhere.

I am starting to think that Night Lycanroc is likely.

It is everywhere.

That's why you had to say it twice right?

 

[Deleted member]

It is one of the most likely if an Alola Pokémon were to be considered now.

But it still has major competition in Marshadow and Incineroar when factoring the movie. As well as Tapu Koko, Mimikyu, Rowlet, and Bewear for the anime and other things.


Only time will tell if one of those 7 or none of them at all get in.

 

[FunAtParties]

I dunno, I feel like a non 3rd party character would have had less of an impact, if you get what I mean. Choosing a 1st party character from an already established series that's also a likely candidate to be added somewhere along the line anyway wouldn't really have the same effect as someone like Cloud, Ryu or Bayonetta.

I get what you're saying, but it's not just K.Rool. Inkling would rep a new series, Snake's return bring MGS elements/stages back, etc...

There's also a lot of stuff not really being repped in the DKC series. Some of the best music in videogames imo, Gangplank Galleon stage, characters like Rambi, Enguarde could be assists, etc... all could be making it's way to Smash for the first time.

 

[Chandeelure]

That's why you had to say it twice right?

Yeah , sorry my cel is laggy.

No, but really, I think it's underrated.
Maybe the Lucario of Gen 7.

First Rockruff was "special", and was paired with the starters a lot.
Then Lycanroc appears a lot in the game.
Now those Pokemon Cards, an event and also Gladion has one in the anime and the edgy kid has one in the movie.
Also that rummored third Lycanroc form.

I don't know.

 

[AwesomeAussie27]

Yeah , sorry my cel is laggy.

No, but really, I think it's underrated.
Maybe the Lucario of Gen 7.

First Rockruff was "special", and was paired with the starters a lot.
Then Lycanroc appears a lot in the game.
Now those Pokemon Cards, an event and also Gladion has one in the anime and the edgy kid has one in the movie.
Also that rummored third Lycanroc form.

I don't know.

I would be fine with the stone doggo in Smash.

 

[Luminario]

I get what you're saying, but it's not just K.Rool. Inkling would rep a new series, Snake's return ring MGS elements/stages back, etc...

There's also a lot of stuff not really being repped in the DKC series. Some of the best music in videogames imo, Gangplank Galleon stage, characters like Rambi, Enguarde could be assists, etc... all could be making it's way to Smash for the first time.

I know, I said already established series. Inkling and Snake would have also worked super well too but Snake must have had some legal problems and Inkling is likely to be the Villager of the next Smash, being the first newcomer revealed that's a highly requested rep.
I don't know much about DKC, but I trust you on how much it can bring to Smash, however that would be adding to an already established series, while Bayo brought an entire new series along with it's own style of an over-the-top stage and banging music that was extremely unlikely to be added without her being the ballot winner.

Yeah , sorry my cel is laggy.

No, but really, I think it's underrated.
Maybe the Lucario of Gen 7.

First Rockruff was "special", and was paired with the starters a lot.
Then Lycanroc appears a lot in the game.
Now those Pokemon Cards, an event and also Gladion has one in the anime and the edgy kid has one in the movie.
Also that rummored third Lycanroc form.

I don't know.

Only if I get to play as the Midnight form, as it's VASTLY superior to Midday form .
Tbh I feel like Lycanroc definitely has potential to be a playable fighter, but other pokemon are either on par or beat it in terms of uniqueness or popularity. It's got the clear makings of a tag team with different moves on each form though so that really helps its chances.

 

[Deleted member]

Yeah , sorry my cel is laggy.

No, but really, I think it's underrated.
Maybe the Lucario of Gen 7.

First Rockruff was "special", and was paired with the starters a lot.
Then Lycanroc appears a lot in the game.
Now those Pokemon Cards, an event and also Gladion has one in the anime and the edgy kid has one in the movie.
Also that rummored third Lycanroc form.

I don't know.

Your points seem to be more for Lycanroc in general as opposed to Midnight aside from the TCG event, Gladion's Lycanroc, and Cross' Lycanroc.
Especially since the third form that Ash would most likely be the one to showcase would be a point against Midnight and instead a point for the third form.

 

[Bowserlick]

What are the predictions for the third form? Midmorning?

 

[Deleted member]

What are the predictions for the third form? Midmorning?

Twilight

Midday (Noon) represents the middle of the day.
Midnight represents the middle of the night.
Twilight represents the transition in-between day and night.

 

[Kirbeh]

What are the predictions for the third form? Midmorning?

Hard to say given that both forms occupy the opposite positions being midnight and midday. Alternative forms could maybe be Dawn and Dusk, but I can't really think of a definitive third form, unless it's something like a mix of the two being an "All Day" form with no proper affiliation to either the sun or moon.

EDIT: nvm I think Golden nailed it.

 

[Opossum]

Twilight

Midday (Noon) represents the middle of the day.
Midnight represents the middle of the night.
Twilight represents the transition in-between day and night.

Taylor Lautner confirmed for Smash.

 

[N3ON]

Bringing something no one as brought yet with how has been chosen as the Ballot winner.

Let's say, if another newcomer like K. Rool won the Ballot, we would have gotten him, yes.
And... Maybe a few new tracks to the DK stages?

While with we got:
- A new stage
- An alternate costume
- A BUNCH of music tracks
- A new series to be introduced with all the other ones
- Several new trophies
- The choice between ENG voiced and JP voiced (only in Japan)
- And additional promotion to one of the Wii U's most noteworthy games.

Just to say, unless you act in a very bad faith, you can't consider this move as a bad one.

All of that makes sense. Yet I'd rather still have the croc.

 

[Deleted member]

Taylor Lautner confirmed for Smash.

#TeamLycanroc or #TeamGliscor

 

[N3ON]

#TeamLycanroc or #TeamGliscor

Gothitelle doesn't need either.

 

[Deleted member]

Gothitelle doesn't need either.

.....dear lord.....how did I not make that connection sooner.

 

[Bowserlick]

Midmorning Tea is a thing.

I think we need a dog with a monocle and a tea-cup. Midmorning is sophisticated, Midday is normal and Midnight is balls-to-the-wall feral.

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

I'm down with Midnight Lycanroc. Having an earthbender in Smash would be cool.

Sorry Isaac.

 

[FunAtParties]

I'm down with Midnight Lycanroc. Having an earthbender in Smash would be cool.

Sorry Isaac.

This makes me sad.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Actually, the quote was that she was among the Top 5 in the U.S., which included characters from previous Smash games.

We don't know who placed where exactly, but we do know that Bayonetta wasn't 1st, 2nd, or 3rd in the U.S., as those would be too major to not mention.

Is this actually true? If so it gives me pretty high hopes that Snake was among those top 5.

I do think Sakurai sees the outcry from Snake being cut so I think he'll at least consider him higher priority this time if he wasn't already last time. I don't know man, I just got a good feeling about this next Smash game in terms of Snake. And considering this is Smash Speculation I don't get to say that often if I ever have at all. One can hope.